The Braves added depth to their rotation today, officially announcing the signing of righty Gavin Floyd to a one-year deal. ESPN's Jerry Crasnick reports that Floyd will earn a $4MM base salary and can earn another $4.5MM with incentives. Floyd is represented by Moye Sports Associates.
Floyd, who turns 31 in roughly six weeks, posted a 5.18 ERA in 24 1/3 innings for the White Sox last season before going down for the year with a torn ulnar collateral ligament that required Tommy John surgery. Prior to that injury-shortened season, the former No. 4 overall pick had been a fairly durable mid-rotation starter for the White Sox, averaging 190 innings of 4.12 ERA ball with 7.2 K/9 and 2.8 BB/9 per season from 2008-12 in the hitter-friendly confines of U.S. Cellular Field.
The contract is similar to the deal that Mike Pelfrey signed with the Twins headed into the 2013 season. Pelfrey had Tommy John surgery on May 1, 2012 and signed for $4MM plus another $1.5MM worth of incentives. Floyd's Tommy John came on May 8, 2013, and he hopes to be throwing in the Majors by early May, according to Crasnick.
Floyd will eventually join a rotation that should consist of Mike Minor, Kris Medlen, Brandon Beachy and Julio Teheran as well. Left-hander Alex Wood could fill the void early in the season as Floyd works his way back from injury. It's also no guarantee that Floyd will be able to return so early. Though many Tommy John victims are able to make their recovery in a year's time, Scott Baker and Ryan Madson both serve as very recent reminders that the recovery process can be filled with significant setbacks.
Eduardo A. Encina of the Baltimore Sun first reported (on Twitter) that Floyd was near a deal with an unknown club, and David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution first reported that the Braves were the team (also via Twitter). Jon Heyman of CBS Sports first reported an agreement had been reached.
Photo courtesy of USA Today Sports Images.
Early hot stove was, Braves looking at D.Price, then it was Braves looking at J.Samardja….and now, Braves sign Gavin Floyd??…..ughh what a disappointment
As a Cub’s fan this is very depressing. I was hoping a deal would get worked out that would send Shark to ATL considering the Braves long history of cranking out pitching prospects.
Im not so sure the braves would gave a lot for him
True, but damn I would have loved to see him further develop under the tutelage your pitching coaches.
I was hoping for a deal including Sean Gilmartin and 2 other arms of halfway decent quality. I’m not expecting a return like the Rays got for Shields.
Haha…you think that’s all it would take for Samarzdija? Epstein could do better than that by holding onto him and letting him walk to get picks. Gilmartin is decent, but there’s nothing about him that makes anyone think he’ll be a TOTR starter. Nothing. His stuff is the stuff Paul Maholm’s dreams are made of.
I’m not saying that Gilmartin is the second coming or anything. I just find it hard to believe that we will get a TOTR prospect for him. If holding onto him is the best option, then I’m fine with it, I just think that some fans are expecting us to get a guy like Archie Bradley when its simply not gonna happen.
There’s a lot of difference between Archie Bradley – the top-rated SP right now – and Sean Gilmartin. That’s all I’m saying. Gilmartin. Gilmartin isn’t even in the top 5, according to BA, of best Braves pitching prospects (1. Sims, 3. Graham, 4. Hursh, 5. Cabrera, 7. Hale, 10. Gilmartin). That’s common knowledge, at least to Hoyer/Epstein. Not that they would need the best position prospect in MLB (like Myers was when he headlined the Shields deal), but something headlined by our 10th-rated prospect, who’s coming off a bad minor year, in Sean Gilmartin shouldn’t be the fall back. CHC would use that compensatory pick better than that.
Braves still aren’t done
I hope we have an Price deal in place…and we need Floyd to fill a medlen or tehran spot
Or a Smardijaza deal
Beachy/Medlin and prospects starting with Bethancourt
Rays wouldn’t want Beachy, he’s coming off a major injury.
According to DOB (yeah consider the source), Wren has said the Braves are done looking at starting pitchers.
I don’t think this eliminates the chances of acquiring a top of the rotation starter.
If you look at Gavin Floyds statistics over the last two full years he compares favorably to Samardja and is a heck of a lot cheaper.
(Samardja is first, Floyd second)
K% 24 vs. 20
BB% 8 vs. 7
ERA-103 vs 102
FIP- 93 vs 97
xFIP- 89 vs 97
SIERA 3.56 vs 3.86
fWAR 5.8 vs 4.3
RA9 Wins 4.2 vs. 4.9
bWAR 2.8 vs 5.3
Steamer 2014 projected fWAR 2.8 vs 2.7
So what exactly is there to be disappointed about?
I definitely glad the Braves didn’t trade for Samardzija. He has good stuff but has never put it together and I don’t think he ever will. He’s a head case like Tommy Hanson and Carlos Zambrano in that as soon as 1 bad thing happens he completely unravels.
Floyd’s Tommy John came on May 8, 2013, and he hopes to be throwing in the Majors by early May, according to Crasnick.
——–
Yea, right. That timeline is not happening, Floyd will probably just be doing long-toss drills by early May. This just seems like wasted money by the Braves, unless Floyd is one exceptionally fast healer.
Pelfrey was ready for Opening Day 2013 after undergoing TJ on May 1, 2012. It can happen, and a $4MM base isn’t really much of a gamble for a Major League team.
There have been a lot of guys back on the mound within a year of Tommy John (or very close to it). Volquez and Strasburg are two more examples.
Scott Baker is a good example as well, he didn’t pitch in the majors again until September, very limited action for that kind of money. Pelfrey was rushed back too early, you can look at his numbers and tell that, he was horrible. Pelfrey didn’t find himself really until June/July then he was clearly worn out and tired by September. If Pelfrey is a good example of what the Braves are getting then it is still a waste of money. Ditto for Baker. It is wasted payroll for either side of the coin.
It was just reported that he will start throwing off the mound in about a week, fwiw.
-C
Every TJ case is different because no two bodies are the same.
You have to remember though that Floyd had a torn flexor muscle and UCL. So essentially he had two surgeries on his arm. There for plenty of examples of guys that are physically able to pitch in the major leagues in 12 months, but in the large majority of times it is easier closer to 16 months before the guy is pretty close to “normal.”
Pelfrey is a good example of a normal recovery, but would you consider what he did in 2013 a good return on the money? Ditto for Floyd, even if potentially he pitches as well and as much as Pelfrey, let’s guess that costs the Braves 5.5 to 6.5 million, that is a sad joke for team with the Braves’ payroll. My money is that over the course of say, 150 innings Alex Wood would be able to outpitch Floyd (while he recovers from Tommy John). And that is at best, realistically.
Very, very easily the Floyd will end up like Ryan Madson or Scott Baker. So the Braves will end up paying Floyd will a very limited amount of innings and still pay Alex Wood to be the 5th starter.
This is just a guess of course, but I’d wager Alex Wood pitches more innings than Floyd will in 2014. I understand this is a depth move and all that entails, but that doesn’t make it a good move to me.
The crux of this deal is that for a team like the Braves this is way too much money for what is essentially the 5th starter on your team, if he is healthy.
Alex Wood is still on an innings limit so the Braves have to be careful with him. Last year he pitched 77 2/3 major league innings and 62 minor league innings for a total of 139 2/3 innings. So yes he will be allowed to go 150 innings. His ceiling is probably 170 innings or so which is fine.
But I think what you’re forgetting is we don’t about Beachy yet. Will Beachy be able to throw 175-200 innings in 2014? I just don’t know and you don’t either.
Yes $4M base is more than we would have liked for Floyd but it’s not that bad. The Braves weren’t going to spend much this off-season because we don’t really have a lot of places to add pieces because the team is so young with so many in house options.
Personally, given what a low ceiling Floyd really has for this season I think the Braves would have been just as well off to at least try one of the minor league guys they have, like Cody Martin, to go along with Alex Wood and David Hale. So essentially you would have three guys as the 5th starter, reducing the workload and the number of times a team would face these young pitchers.
And the thing with Beachy is, yes we don’t know how he will be. But why do people seem to think Floyd will be better when his two surgeries only occured like 7 months ago?? Floyd is more likely than not going to be just as injury prone as Beachy was last year. Beachy’s TJ was in June 2012 and he had a light workload last season so I think he is also primed to pitch quite a lot more innings than Floyd will.
Even of the comparisons listed right here on this page, Beachy and Baker only pitched a very few innings the year after their TJ (30 and 15 respectively). Madsen missed the year entirely. The Braves have the pitching prospects to try and if they are unsuccessful they still have the pieces for a trade. Given this move for Floyd all this will do is leave the Braves in the position where they will have to make another move (trade) for a SP during the season, because someone will get hurt and Floyd will not be ready or hurt himself after returning too quickly.
I’m a little surprised he’s getting a major league deal, actually. A pretty okay pitcher coming back from injury and rehabbing is generally a good bet to get a minor league deal.
Mike Pelfrey ($4MM) and Scott Baker ($5MM) each got Major League deals last offseason. You’ll see guys take minor league deals if they had their Tommy John in July maybe, but Floyd’s was plenty early. No reason for him to take a minor league deal based on recent history.
He’d be making a contract 10x that and at least 2-3 years longer in duration if he hadn’t had the surgery. It’s not like the Braves haven’t seen him pitch since having the surgery in side sessions, believing he can come back.
It’s doubtful that anyone has seen Floyd pitch a side session since his surgery, which was only seven months ago.
He’s probably not throwing more than 80-90 feet from flat ground yet, which doesn’t even qualify as long toss.
The guy won’t throw off a mound until late February at the earliest.
Thanks for the point. Good point. Didn’t know the timeline, but that doesn’t change ATL’s success with TJ survivors and his upside. If it doesn’t work out with him, we won’t be looking at this deal that did ATL in at the end of the season. If it works out, Wren is a genius.
DOB just reported he’ll start throwing off a mound next week. So that’s good news.
-C
The price of starters is way to much if a guy with TJS can get $4 million and not even ready to start the season.
Plus he can earn an extra 4.5 mil in incentives….this to me personally is a terrible signing
I don’t think we have to worry about the incentives, I’d wager there is about no chance Floyd pitches in the majors before September. I just do not understand this deal. Yesterday I thought it might just be a $1 million deal.
If he does earn the $4.5MM in incentives, that means he had a good, healthy year, doesn’t it?
And $9.5MM for a good year from a starting pitcher is a really good deal.
From a #5 starter on a low budget team like the Braves, no.
In an era in which 40-year-olds (Colon) and injury prone pitchers (Kazmir) are getting multi-year deals worth $10MM annually, yes.
It’s a one year deal and the Braves still have 10 mil more to spend. It’s not like they need the money to sign anyone other than a reliever and bench pieces.
Still better than the Pelfrey signing.
Even when heathy Floyd is a mediocre starter but signing him when hes coming off a major arm surgery? I dont like this signing at all.
Mind boggling
Half our rotation had TJ surgery (Hudson, Medlen, Beachy) not including 2 more in the ‘pen (O’F, Venters). ATL has learned how to be successful with a pitcher having had TJ surgery and having the short drive to B’ham with the world’s leading expert in the area (Dr. James Andrews) doesn’t hurt. Don’t act like Braves haven’t benefited before from TJ surgery pitchers, including 1 of our best: John Smoltz. They still have a lot of value.
Not when he is on a one year deal and on opening day he’ll only be 11 months removed from surgery. TJ often takes 15 months to fully recover from. If there was an option for a second year I’d understand the move a little more.
Yes, it does, but not for everyone. Medlen came back and was successful in a year, while Beachy took longer than that and has had to go back and start over. It’s really different for different people. As time goes on and we learn more about this surgery, the rehab time can be reduced. I’m just saying that ATL has a lot of history – more than most – with TJ surgery and we are benefitting from that history and how successful (i.e. Smoltz, Hudson, Medlen, O’Flaherty, Venters, etc.) we’ve been.
Rushed Beachy, shut him down. Rushed Venters, had 2nd TJ. O’Flaherty isn’t recovered yet. Hudson wasn’t sharp immediately following surgery. Medlen was an exception and he only started 12 of his 50 games.
Venters had his first Tommy John surgery in 2005. Still think they rushed him back??
-C
You’re acting like ATL is rushing these players when these players won’t to get out their faster than some organizations will let them. Let’s acknowledge some personal responsibility. As much as we wanted Beachy to pitch, we’ve been deep enough not to rely on him since the limited exposure he’s had in the league. But take in mind, we only paid $4MM. Not a lot for a SP.
You are missing a few names.
The following pitchers on the Braves 2013 Roster are all TJS survivors.
Luis Ayala
Brandon Beachy
Scott Downs
Freddy Garcia
Tim Hudson
Cristhian Martinez
Kris Medlen
Eric O’Flaherty
Jonny Venters 2x
Alex Wood
Too early to put Venters (2nd one) and EOF on there since we’ve yet to see if they have recovered. And Wood had TJ surgery? When?
Thanks for doing the digging. I knew there was more than a few. I hope Dr. James Andrews’ office has a loyalty card for a free one after every ten.
Ricky Nolasco just got 4 years, 49 million, and Floyd and him have put up almost identical ERAs and WHIPs since 2010. (However, Nolasco of course is coming off one of his best years, and Floyd’s coming off Tommy John surgery.)
The point is, if he’s healthy by a reasonable date he could easily earn his money. It’s a fairly low risk, medium reward situation. He could be a solid innings eater.
Floyd has also pitched much better away from US Cellular field in recent years (3.85 on the road, 4.95 at home since 2011), and could benefit from being with the Braves, who tend to know how to get the best out of their pitchers.
Has wren been hanging out with Otis Nixon?
The Braves would’ve set the franchise back 5 years like the Tex deal if they went after Samardzija or Price. They would basically be renting those players for a year and a half before having to trade them by the trade deadline in 2015 with current ownership.
We already have one of the best rotations in the NL and it will only get better. Beachy was one of the best pitchers in baseball before his Tommy John and he should finally be healthy. This is a low risk/high reward signing.
Except they just spent 4 million of the 10 million they said they had. Almost half. I do not see the low risk.
For a 1 year deal it’s a low risk. Would you rather have signed Arroyo for 4 years $60 million? I’d rather invest in a player you can dump than to have another Derek Lowe contract on our hands.
I didn’t think they should have gone after David, Jeff, or Bronson. Rotation is pretty good as it is.
Bronson?! Really? They did go after David, Jeff. Jeff isn’t worth the prospects. David would take a massive haul similar to James Shields. You really want to give away a possible ROY to get a couple years of Price? No thanks.
I agree this is not low risk. 4Mil buys a solid bench bat or another legit arm for the pen that would be healthy to start the season. Also I’m not sold on Beachy. He was good when healthy, but how often has he been healthy even in his short career??
1 year deal and $4MM isn’t high risk.
nobody said it was high risk, but there is definitely risk involved with shelling out 4Mil for a pitcher coming off of TJS.
They have 10 million left AFTER the Floyd deal.
Not saying you are wrong on this, but where did you see that at? Everything I’ve seen shows Atlanta only having roughly 10Mil total to spend plus whatever they could get for Uggla.
Go look on Talking Chop, they are a pretty reputable site as far as news goes. Their article on the Floyd signing states that the club has 10 million left to spend according to projections.
I’d imagine that $10M (or most of it) will be used for arbitration raises.
No, I’m pretty sure it’s just their FA pot. With just the loss of McCann and Huddy alone the Braves cleared 20-23 million in payroll. Since it appears they only have 10 mil left, it seems they’ve allotted the rest of that 20-23 mil for arby raises + Floyd.
And in reality they actually had a bit more available initially when you account for non-tenders and FA guys like Downs.
I like your answer a whole lot better than mine! Thanks for the info, I appreciate it.
No problem! Not sure what we will spend that 10 large on beyond a BP arm(s) and bench bats.
Thanks for the reply. I usually check there but hadn’t today.
No worries, glad I could help!
It’s possible a 9.5MM deal. They can’t spend the other 4.5MM
Thank you. Finally some common sense.
beachy what ? jajjajaj cmon
and I will have changed. beachy will be of injury to injury’ll see.
if you want to be world champion you have to change and have the best. if not forget
What?
Honestly, I think the Braves already have better options the way current rotation is constructed. This is just Frank Wren doing more dumpster diving.
Considering how he regularly comes out with gems that fill holes after he goes free agent diving, this is a welcomed addition.
It would be if it were for 1 or 2 mil. Not 4 mil plus incentives.
Good grief, it’s 1-2 mil. Who cares? They’ve already made that back with arb agreements (Walden, etc.) You’re acting like this is your money. Scott Feldman just signed a 3/$30MM deal with HOU. Seriously, compare their numbers.
Gavin Floyd (age 30): 70-70; 4.48 ERA; 1.33 WHIP; 7.1 SO/9
Scott Feldman (age 30): 51-56; 4.62 ERA; 1.37 WHIP; 5.6 SO/9
The only big difference is that Floyd is coming off TJ surgery, but even then, Feldman hasn’t eclipsed 100 IP in the last 2 seasons. What makes you think that $4MM on a 1 year deal isn’t a deal when compared to 3/$30MM?!
The alternative isn’t Feldman… The alternative is Wood or Hale. Personally I think 4Mil could’ve been used more wisely, but its definitely not an end of the world contract. Just not one with a ton of upside in my opinion.
If Floyd approaches anything resembling 2009-11, even over a shortened timeframe, the upside is worth eight figures.
The value of WAR has increased so much that this is the new reclamation deal…I mean, c’mon. Josh Johnson gets a $4M deal for 2015 if he doesn’t start seven games this season. That’s like saying, “Hey, we know you may be hurt, but here’s $8M. And if you’re really hurt, we may give you $4M more.”
In Eno Sarris’ Fangraphs article of the Josh Johnson deal, he says, “Whether a win is worth five, six or seven million dollars, Josh Johnson has been worth $8 million every season of his eight year career save two. It just happened that one of those seasons was last year. It’s easiest to remember last year.”
Well, Floyd has been worth $4M every year he’s been a full-time, major league starter, except last year. Actually, he was also worth more than $8M every year since he’s been starting full-time in the bigs, with the exception of last year. Even his underwhelming 2012 was worth $8.6M, and WAR was way cheaper then than it is today.
Once again, it’s just easiest to remember last year.
-C
I don’t have a problem with Floyd. I think he will rebound and be worth exponentially more than this contract in future years. For me its just the problems that can come with returning from TJS. We already have risk in Beachy and we saw how his return went with his hiccups, we tendered Venters, and if we resign O’Flaherty we will be depending on 4 guys rebounding from TJS. I like all of those guys individually, but we needed a solid cog in that 3-4 slot to eat up some innings and I think that guy will be fairly reasonably priced come mid to late January, I just hope we still have the resources to sign him.
“Alternative” was perhaps not the best word to use, because ATL wouldn’t and couldn’t have signed Feldman for more than 1 reason. I’m just saying that if he didn’t have TJ surgery, he would have gotten that much or more on the open market. As a #4 or #5 starter, possibly, his numbers look good and they could be even better in the NL, based on history. However, if he’s not one of the 5 best starters, $4MM isn’t enough to relegate him to long relief or even release him to clear room on the roster for someone that could add better value, though I don’t think the latter would happen. ATL has had a lot of success with TJ surgery survivors, and this should be another case.
Maybe you missed the fact salaries have gone up dramatically…. 1 WAR is costing teams upwards of 6 mill this offseason, I think its reasonable to expect Floyd to provide in the neighborhood of one.
That’s a product of over eager teams with new revenue sources, but before this offseason is over you will see just like last year and the year before that somebody is left out there after most teams shopping lists are filled. If Atlanta still has the money to pick a guy like that up then great this deal was fine, but if this deal prohibits them from that type of signing then this signing was a mistake. Basically I reserve my judgment until late February.
Pricey crap shoot by the Braves….. I think their chips show that they think Floyd can deliver after the All-Star break. And that they fear Medlen will wear down again (or break) come August….. Hope they have some young arms on the fringe if these fragile pitchers run into problems.
“wear down again”??? Last I checked he’s been way better at the end of the last two seasons.
Won NL Pitcher of The Month for September over the last two years.
Honestly, I think the Braves are better off going with Minor, Teheran, and crew. This is just more front office dumpster diving.
SMH…this man can earn up too 9.5 mil…wow…whats up with these 4.50 era guys coming off tommy John getting all this money…floyd is a long reliever… Braves need Beachy and Woods to beat him out cause he is a .500 pitcher
What does a “.500 pitcher” even mean?
A guy whose team wins only half the games he starts would be my definition.
No Braves fan had faith in Freddy Garcia or Ben Sheets either. Both guys proved to be useful. The Braves needed a veteran pitcher. Floyd will be useful if he can come back healthy. The good news is the Braves really don’t need him. The rotation is good the way it was, but depth is never a bad thing.
Everyone had the right to be worried about those 2. Garcia couldn’t cut it with the Orioles who have a pretty mediocre staff and Sheets hadn’t pitched since 2010. I think Wren just got lucky on those.
Wren also was lucky with O’Flaherty. And then he was lucky with Carpenter.
Frank Wren is just lucky. Over and over again. Luck, luck, luck.
-C
Dont forget how lucky he was with Brandon Beachy.
My apologies, I forgot about that little piece of luck.
-C
If we use floyd as a stater then Beachy or Woods will not be starting… only way this is a good deal is if we are about to trade for Price
They will likely take it slow bringing him back because they have 5 starters right now. No reason to rush things. He’s good insurance. And what do you want the Braves to trade away to get Price? The haul they’re going to want for him is probably too much for Atlanta’s depleted farm system.
Start it with Beachy
So start the deal for price with the rotation’s best statistical pitcher who still costs less than $1MM and is controllable for 2014, 2015, and 2016. Sounds like a super idea. You must have been a huge fan of the Teixeira trade.
You guys can keep barking all you want about Frank’s ability to dumpster dive. I’ve seen it, I agree completely. But let’s be honest those other guys you are mentioning got tops 1Mil (pretty sure that’s what Sheets got.), when you go bargain hunting you usually leave the checkbook at home.
Sheets was out of baseball for 2 years and inked a minor league deal with the Braves. I’m not sure what they paid Garcia, but he was signed to a $4MM deal in Baltimore and the Braves bought his contract. Not sure for how much. That’s a small price to pay ($4MM) for an MLB veteran pitcher. Baseball relies heavily on service time for contracts, moreso than other sports. Dan Haren got 10, Colon got 20 over 2, and Hudson got 14. Pitchers are expensive no matter how you slice it and whining about $4MM for a veteran presence they really needed isn’t a bad signing at all.
Devil’s advocate here, but you say pitching is expensive no matter how you slice it. That’s not entirely true when you have young controllable guys. I just am not sure that Floyd’s value while returning from TJS will be any better than Wood or Hale, and I still contend that there will be veteran innings eater type guys available in February. I just don’t like the Braves tying their hands in December when there is so much more to play out.
I agree that Floyd really wasn’t the needed veteran to sign. But he’s a groundball pitcher, which is nice to have. He induces about as many as Hudson did. He’ll have a much better defensive unit behind him too. I liked the rotation the way it was, but I don’t think bringing in Floyd makes much difference. I don’t think it will be a complete waste. Young, controllable guys are obviously cheap to some extent, but veteran pitchers are not and that was my point which is why I referenced Haren, Colon, and Hudson.
For me its just an opportunity cost question. If this prohibits a better option from happening later in the offseason then I don’t like it. It’s not like we’re giving a 75M/5yr contract to a free swinging low contact OFer or anything.
I don’t think $4MM is going to hinder Wren from signing someone that would make Braves fans happy. Seems like all these grumpy Braves fans want a .300+ hitter who can smack 40 HRs a year with 120 RBIs all for league minimum. I think Braves fans have unrealistic expectations all the time. It’s like the David Price trade: what do the Braves have that they could trade away to get Price and afford Price for the next 2 seasons??? He’s a super 2 and already costs over $10MM. If they get price, they certainly won’t get anything else this offseason and they need some bench bats, which I would like to see some money spent on.
Price has been a pipe dream from the beginning. I’d rather see them clean out the whole farm for Sale. At least they could control him though he’s not realistic either. Honestly as long as Liberty Media is the owner Atlanta is never going to be able to spend the way they used to. If Atlanta wants to put together a WS winning team they need to start by extending guys like Simmons, Teheran, and maybe Minor. Get some cost certainty there. I know everyone wants to see them lock down Freeman, Heyward, Kimbrel, etc., but those guys are too close to free agency now and aren’t likely to sign any team friendly contracts. Look at the Rays approach with Longoria and Shields. Sure Davis didn’t work out great and Shields is gone, but they secured key contributors. I think Atlanta needs to show some more faith in their youngsters and build a platform to stand on for years to come. I mean look at Salvador Perez’s contract. That value is insane. If you look at the contracts that have been the most team friendly terms they are all signed when a guy has less than 1-2yrs of service time. When a guy already lives in a penthouse and has millions in his bank account he has no incentive to sign team friendly deals. Hindsight may be twenty twenty, but making the same mistake time and time again is just idiotic. (Yes.I know this has nothing to do with Floyd or Free Agents, but its my two cents anyway.)
Attention, hang-wringing Braves fans: There is no such thing as a bad one year deal, and $4MM is chump change for a MLB contract.
One look at Tim Hudson will tell you how coming back from TJ can go pretty well
If I’ve learned anything with this Braves front office and management, it’s to never doubt their low-risk signings. If anyone can make this guy better, it’s the Braves pitching staff.
And a good defense.
Check out Floyd’s FIP numbers. I don’t know much about the Braves defense outside of Simmons, but if the other seven guys behind the pitcher are any good, Floyd should do pretty well in Atlanta.
All below average, IF wise (that is if Uggla sticks around) but Simmons offsets the rest of the IF in some extremely crazy ways. There are a few articles talking about this.
I agree 100% with this mind set. It frustrates me that fans want Atlanta to sign and trade for every big name team, yet they talk negatively about teams like the dodgers and yankees who do the exact same.
Not a bad deal but they should have gotten an option for a second year. Pitchers returning from injury often don’t fully recover until their second season.
This is a decent depth/options move. It gives the Braves a sixth starter, allows Wood to spend some time in the minors refining things or work out of the bullpen to save some innings on his arm.
The Braves basically need to have a guy capable of pitching reasonably well for about 100-140 innings this year. Floyd should be capable of that without much issue. They don’t need him immediately, and he’s probably not going to be needed for the playoffs, either, unless there’s a significant amount of injury in the rotation or he’s just pitching that well. He’s this season’s Paul Maholm.
-C
The Braves would’ve been better off leaving the pitching staff as it is than signing this scrub. Really, this move doesn’t make an ounce of sense, especially for the amount of money they’re going to pay him. Even when healthy, he’s mediocre, probably the 7th best starter on this staff
The only way Floyd is mediocre is if you haven’t learned about park effects.
-C
52. James Shields
53. Gio Gonzalez
54. Gavin Floyd
Statistical category?? FIP- since 2008, Floyd’s first season as a full-time MLB starter. To be fair, Gio didn’t put in a full MLB season until 2010, but Shields has been a MLB starter since 2007.
He’s not nearly as mediocre as people are claiming.
-C
Seriously.
Get a good defense behind Floyd, and his ERA quickly drops into the 3.60-3.80 range, which is brilliant for $4MM.
Yeah, because teams should definitely go into the season without any backup plans, because pitchers never get hurt.
Would of just tried to bring Garcia back for less money. I see 4 mil for a healthy decent starter but not for one who may or may not be back in May. I’m glad the Braves didn’t go after price and I’ve never liked shark..both would of really cost more than money in prospects and they didn’t go multiple years with another starter but I think for the price there may be better options.
My only concern for the deal is the prospect of a set back. I like Floyd as a 4th or 5th starter option. You look at the Dodgers for example who are paying Josh Beckett and Chad Billingsly (their 4th and 5th starter) a combined 28 Million dollars, base salaries of 17 and 11 mil. Ubaldo Jimenez has comparable numbers, albeit slightly better than Floyd’s and he is going to make so much more than this. His base salary alone will probably be north of the 10 million mark. Am I jubilant about this move? no….Am I terribly upset and worried about this deal? no. We should save our judgement about this deal when the deal expires and see how everything went.
Braves have 6 starters with MLB experience now (7 if you count Hales two starts as MLB experience) Even if he has a setbeck, Wood will fill in just fine. He had a 1.6fwar in 77 innings in 2013.
I’m no pro baseball coach but I’ve been watching long to enough to know an easy way for this to go.
-Go into spring training with a definite 1/2/3 of Minor/Teheran/Medlen
-The 4 spot is Beachy’s to lose
-The 5 spot is a competition between Wood and Hale with the “loser” being put in a long relief role in the bullpen.
-When Floyd comes back, throw him wherever you have a weakness
-If a weakness still remains, go after a starter at the Trade Deadline.
I am completely indifferent about this signing, but if he throws an ML pitch before the All-Star Break, I’ll be surprised.
So you’re not COMPLETELY indifferent after all. Why will you be surprised, btw?
I don’t recall a player ever being ready when the team thinks he should be. I believe they were saying McCann s/b ready by opening day last year, I knew he wouldn’t be, and of course he wasn’t. The same with Hudson in 2012. I’ve heard this story over and over again about players being ready by a certain date, that days comes and goes and the player is still not ready. Fast forward to this season. The team says Floyd s/b ready by May. I say add at least a month to that and then a minor league rehab. That will run fairly close to the AS break, depending on what part of May they think he should be ready.
I could be wrong of course and it would be okay if I was, but I’ve seen this dance many times before and this is usually the outcome.
Heyward returned to the lineup before the end of the regular season when he was projected miss the remainder of the season and perhaps the playoffs.
McCann was never projected to be ready for OD last season. He was supposed to be back in late April/early May.
-C
As a Sox fan, I will tell you that this is a good sign. Gavin was always a good innings-eater and if he bounces back, the Braves just got a solid pitcher. He’s better than numbers show as most are a result of being on a team that just wouldn’t score when he was on the mound.
He will not be an innings eater coming off TJ. Guys who are back on the mound in 12 months or less almost always have a setback the first year.
Well I didn’t guarantee it. We’ll just have to wait and see. I obviously hope that he is able to recover completely, because when he was on, he was quite good for us.
Just another reason that Wren needs to go. I knew he would be going on his usual winter dumpster diving expedition to search for washed up players. Floyd wasnt a good pitcher even at his best.
Good move as insurance, kinda suspect he could have been had for a bit less.
I don’t trust the rotation to stay healthy- Medlen and Wood are higher than average-risks, and Beachy is high-risk.
Too much money for a pitcher that probably wont pitch until halfway through the season, and is sub-par at best.
Replacement level player at this point in his career if you ask me.
Fortunately, no one did.
-C
Aren’t the Braves supposed to be poor this offseason? 4 million is a lot for a risky guy.
Read the comment directly below yours. $4M isn’t nearly as risky as you think. I’d be surprised if he’s not worth it, actually. This is a very young team with a very young rotation. Signing someone like Floyd makes quite a lot of sense.
He declined a $20MM deal from BAL, reportedly, and the deal could pay Floyd as much as $8.5MM with incentives. But, if he reaches those incentives, he’ll be valued at a lot more than that. This is a risk, but not a giant one that could bring a lot of value to the rotation. Thanks to Wren for getting creative and not giving Arroyo anything.
Gavin Floyd get 4.5 base salary yet Mike Pelfrey makes more than that, mind boggling.
What I hadn’t considered in my debates about Floyd was how moving from the AL and extreme hitter friendly U.S. Cellular Field to the NL and neutral playing Turner Field might improve his numbers.
What I hadn’t considered in my debates about Floyd was how moving from the AL and extreme hitter friendly U.S. Cellular Field to the NL and neutral playing Turner Field might improve his numbers.