For now, the Braves will replace Brandon Beachy by recalling Jair Jurrjens from the minor leagues. But the Braves' long-term solution could come from outside of the organization, David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution writes.
“I think we get through the next few weeks leading up to when the trading season really begins,” general manager Frank Wren said. “And we evaluate what we have, how guys are throwing and who might be available.”
The Braves are believed to be among the teams interested in Cubs right-hander Matt Garza, O’Brien writes. Garza earns $9.5MM this year and will be arbitration eligible for the fourth and final time before the 2013 season. His teammate, right-hander Ryan Dempster, could also interest the Braves.
The Braves hope Jurrjens pitches respectably, and they believe his minor league performance was better than his numbers would indicate (5.18 ERA, 4.7 K/9, 2.2 BB/9). Beachy will miss the remainder of the season to undergo Tommy John ligament replacement surgery, which leaves Jurrjens, Randall Delgado, Mike Minor, Tommy Hanson and Tim Hudson in the Braves' rotation.
How Jurrjens pitches will play a role in what Wren decides to do with the staff.
Dempster would lend them some veteran leadership. Hopefully it would be an ML ready need… like say a 3Bman… Do the Braves have someone like that in their system?
Was Gilmartin signed before July 31 last year? I’d love to nab him.
No way they’ll give him up.
A kid with a #3 starter ceiling is untouchable? Now I’ve heard everything.
His celiling is not a number 3, and even if it was he would look like an Ace on the cubs
He’s a left hander with above average stuff. What about that screams anything above #3?
People probably said the same thing about Tom Glavine.
How many Tom Glavines are there in comparison to AAA flame outs who didn’t have the stuff to pitch in the big leagues?
If Gilmartin was a strikeout pitcher with the control he does have, he would have been gone when ATL drafted in the 1st rd. ATL has shown through Beachy, Medlen, Delgado, and Teheran that they can develop good pitchers into better pitchers. True, we’re not developing our top pitching draft picks into our lead guys, but it rarely works out that way.
Yes he would have because his ceiling would have been a LOT higher.
the “left hander” part.
Funny, I’ve just heard everything too. He’s more than a #3. And the way Wren holds onto his pitching, what makes you think he’s going to let him go? He wouldn’t let any of the big 4 go last year at the deadline – why assume things would be different this year?
Juan Francisco is the closest thing they have to a MLB ready 3B… but he swings at everything.
They should DFA him, bad trade for ATL
We gave up nothing really. Someone we weren’t going to use for a little insurance on 3b. Not a bad trade, just not a great trade.
The guy we gave up is like 22 and has a 1.00 ERA for the Reds as their setup man. We gave up a very good pitcher.
But he wasn’t going to make it on our team, we have a surplus of pitching. We needed insurance at 3b.. So we gave up very little value to us. +1 Braves.
I wouldn’t call it a win for the Braves since the Reds are reaping more of the rewards right now. But I do agree he wasn’t going to make the team. Even before we let Acensio go (although he wasn’t really guarenteed a spot either) and found out Viz was having TJ surgery, not one Braves fan can sit there and say Hoover had an even halfway legit shot to break camp on the 25 man roster.
True, Hoover wasn’t going to make much of an impact with ATL. We’re deeper than that. Call it a deal done to promote good will with CIN. We take Francisco off their hands, who CIN didn’t want anymore because of his questionable work ethics, and we get a temporary fill-in for Chipper with some upside. Francisco has done a good job so far.
That was a terrible trade by us. Why do we need any more insurance at 3B? We already have several guys on the team now that can play 3B just as good or better then Fransico. Prado, Wilson, Hinske!!!
Hinske could play 3B when he was 50 pounds lighter haha
J.J. Hoover is 24. His ERA is 3.00. The only guy in the Red’s bullpen that’s been in less games than Hoover is Billy Bray. And you’re wrong in writing that Hoover is in games as a setup man.
For the Braves, it looks like they (I use that pronoun since I’m not in any way associated with the Braves organization) made a good trade in getting Juan Francisco. At the start of the season, there just wasn’t a spot in the ‘pen for Hoover. Maybe in hindsight keeping Hoover en lieu of Livan Hernandez might be better right now but who can really say for sure without knowing how results might have come about if the Braves had held onto J.J. Hoover.
Mlb ready, none, Edward Salcedo may be you’re best bet since Joey Terdoslavich(sorry if I misspelled that) has failed as a 3B so far.
Prado is 3b ready. But I don’t see us getting rid of him for something like Dempster or Garza.
Yeah but Prado is Chipper’s replacement
Eh. I love Prado, he’s a great all around player. But I’d upgrade over him in a heart beat.
I just don’t understand this line of reasoning. Other than a staph infection Prado is a consitent .300 hitter who can play all over the diamond. I agree he isn’t the best thirdbaseman in the league, but honeslty who is better that we could get to upgrade?? Wright (Mets would be all about that), Beltre (Not leaving TX any time soon), Zimmerman (expensive, injury prone, and unavailable), A-Rod (30M/yr), Cabrera (Let’s not pretend he’s actually a 3B), and Longoria (Good Luck).
Braves fans need to realize we could do a lot worse than Prado and trading him creates a new hole. I’d personally like to see him locked up for 3yrs 18-20M.
100% agree
…to whom?
And this is the bane of ATL fans. You won’t recognize an underpaid, overused player that has made the transition to 2 new positions (LF, 3B) so the could upgrade by utilizing Uggla at 2B and Chipper still at 3B. He’ll excel at anything you tell him to and so far he looks like he’s having a career year. He’s a perfect #2 hitter that might not be at the plate what everyone expects at 3B to be (power, contact), but we have a power-hitting 2B (Uggla) that makes up for any disparity.
I say keep developing Bethancourt, pick-up the option on McCann and let him walk after 2013, while extending Prado and seeing if we can make a fair deal to Bourn.
Wow….
dempster is currently on the disabled list, so currently i would imagine there would be very little interest in him, however if he comes back healthy and throwing the way he did before then there are a couple players the cubs should be interested in such as: Joey terdoslovich(unsure on the spelling), tommy lastella can play some 3rd, nick ahmed and brandon drury are a few…obviosly though, the braves strength lies in their pitching…sean gilmartin, zeke spruill, billy bullock, jr graham and several others outside of the “untouchable” prospects and players…they will get a deal done if the braves truley want one of those pitchers
It’s just a back tightness though right? I think he’ll still have plenty of interest. I’d rather have Garza, but not what we’d have to give up for him. But, we need to do something.
Yeah, it’s just a tight lat this time… I’m sure if the Cubs were in any sort of contention for something other than the 1st draft pick, he might have pitched thru it… Why take a chance on this dismal season. And they want him healthy for a team that might come calling.
Epstein/Hoyer won’t trade Dempster, who has looked like he could receive a Cy Young vote or two if he weren’t playing for the Cubs, while he’s injured. You don’t trade someone when they’re at their lowest value…and an injured Dempster won’t get you the prospects you’d want if you allow him to make 1-2 starts after a DL stint to show his health status.
Our main 3B prospect (Terdoslavich) just got demoted from AAA back to AA after a rough start. However, Prado will probably be the heir to Chipper, so there may not be a real need for another 3B in the system.
Of course, you can always have Juan Francisco!
We’ll give you Chipper 😉
LoL!! Why not just give us David Justice instead…? :o)
Sid Bream combo? lol
You’re right that Dempster would provide that, but that’s not really what the Braves need. Chipper, Hudson, Durbin, Uggla, Wilson, McCann, Ross, Bourn, Diaz, Hinske, and Prado are all guys who have been around the big leagues for several years. What the Braves need more than anything is a guy who can come in and routinely give them quality starts.
The way to sell Dempster is based on his productivity. The Braves need that more than his “veteran leadership.”
No, I meant “leadership” to the starting rotation & not to metion his effectiveness… Put him on a “good” team & he just may “Lead” them somewhere… The Braves seem to be a “good” team.
the braves wouldnt trade any 3B prospects considering chipper retires nxt year. They might trade Juan Francisco but he hasnt been very good and cant be optioned down to triple A
Uh yeah, sure ok. And the Cubs wouldn’t trade Andrew Cashner… Oops.
Epstein/Hoyer didn’t draft Cashner. They coveted Rizzo, which Hoyer acquired from Epstein in BOS. So, why wouldn’t they go after someone they both covet for someone Jim Hendry acquired?
Who said anything about who drafted Cashner or didn’t…? They didn’t draft Javier Baez or Brett Jackson either… And a lot of other guys that Cubs covet in their minors… Cashner is a #1 draft choice & highly touted. No one ever expected him to be traded, but he was. If the Braves want a particular player, then they will pony up or walk away… That was the point you seemed to have missed.
I haven’t missed it because ATL and most other teams won’t be “ponying up” for someone that is a free agent at the end of the season, makes $8M the rest of the season (Dempster), and the team obtaining him wouldn’t be getting compensatory picks if he signs with another team. Play GM for a minute: what about that makes you willing to take someone on that has pitched over his career numbers, isn’t young and is currently on the DL? Not including the fact he’s seen little playoff experience because he’s on the Cubs. Yes, he should get something, but if you expect ATL to send over an “untouchable”, you’re crazy. I wouldn’t mind having Dempster, but not at the price of giving up any of Delgado, Minor, Gilmartin, Teheran, etc.
How far Jurrjens has fallen. Halfway through last season he was an ace, now they don’t even want him as a spot starter. Ouch.
We want him. He’s just not producing. I think he’s too worried about his damn knee. It’s all mental with him I think.
That dip in velocity certainly isn’t mental.
I would take Jurrjens on my team any day of the week. Same with Youkilis
Wonder if Epstein would make a play for Youkilis. He arguably knows him better than any other GM, having brought him through the system.
Youklis is way too old for what the Cubs want. They need players who could fit on the 2015 roster…not interested in any veterans at this point.
Honestly, you’d take the old JJ. Not this years JJ. I’m a huge JJ fan, but something isn’t right with him.
If the Cubs don’t ask for Teheran, Delgado, Simmons, Freeman, Medlen, Heyward, or Vizcaino, they can work something out.
Mike Minor, Sean Gilmartin, JR Graham, Tyler Pastornicky, Joey Terdoslovachik, and Edward Salcedo might interest them
I think that’s why I think they’re more likely to acquire Dempster than Garza. The Cubs would want at least one elite pitching prospect in a Garza trade. I don’t think the Braves want to part with Teheran or Delgado.
I have a feeling that maybe sometime soon, when Delgado, Teheran, and Vizcaino grow up a little, get some more experience, we could have another Maddux, Smoltz, and Glavine combination. And go on a run again. We can’t trade Minor, either, for he may get big one day. We should wait a 2 or 3 years before considering parting with Mike. He’s got potential. Pastornicky would only interest them if Starlin Castro gets injured or starts slumping. We COULD give him to another team, maybe one that needs a young SS? They could raise him. Possibly the Yanks, if Jeter leaves soon? We could get a HEALTHY prospect, for maybe people like Salcedo or Terdoslovachik?
I’d personally rather go for Garza than Dempster, because Garza seems to have had a little better career, and Dempster will still need some rehab. Even then, I doubt he’ll pitch the same way. Garza has a good history, too. Good years with the Rays, and he even has a No-No under his belt. (Should’ve been a perfect game, umpire missed the call on the walk. Still remember that on Sunday Night Baseball a couple years ago) I personally think the Cubs Organization isn’t comfortable to Matt, and he might need a better place to play?
Just ideas. We don’t need either one. We could get a prospect for a smaller prospect? Jeremy Hellickson, Matt Moore, Danny Duffy, etc. Either way, we need a good gun, so in a couple years, we can rule the baseball world again! =)
My only question is: who would you consider Maddux in that scenario??? I don’t see any of them getting there. I like their abilities, but that’s a country-mile stretch. But, we only won 1 World Series with them…and that’s when the budget wasn’t a problem.
We don’t need anymore pitching that doesn’t deliver with playoff experience. TB won’t deal Hellickson/Matt Moore. And I wouldn’t want Danny Duffy. We have some southpaws with a brighter future.
I don’t think Gilmartin is going anywhere. I don’t see us giving up a MLB pitcher to get one in return (Minor) either. Although I’m not sold on Minor, we kinda need him at this point. I still think Julio should be called up instead of JJ. Unless they hope he can do well for a couple of games to increase his trade value.
You’re not getting out of a Garza trade with your top 5 prospects intact. You’re not getting out of a Dempster trade with your top 10 in tact.
Kinda like we weren’t going to get Bourn last year w/ out letting go of one of our top 4’s? Granted, Theo is probably smarter than the Astro’s GM – but never assume.
Gotta give to get… Have to look at both sides of a trade & be somewhat realistic. Especially for a 28 yr. old #1 or 2 starter from another team with a yr. of control.
Dempster, I’d have to agree w/bb52… gotta get a top 10 prospect. Or don’t make the move & see if you can waiver trade him or sign him cheaper next yr. Somebody will pony up for Dempster, could be the Dodgers. Just depends on who wants him more… Like I said earlier, this will be very interesting seeing that there’s very few sellers out there.
I would trade Gilmartin, have to give something to get
You’d trade a 1st rd pick for 8-10 starts and no compensatory picks when he bolts?
For Garza, Demster is different
Minor and Gilmartin would probably interest Epstein the most but right now I don’t see Wren parting ways with the first 4 just yet, even if it is needed for an extra arm. The latter 2 are ones Wren would most likely pull the trigger on IMO.
Joe Terd at 3rd was the flavor of the month all Spring but that experiment went sour extremely quickly and considering he hasn’t played 1 pitch their since being demoted to AA, I’d be willing to bet the Braves are no longer considering him in their future 3B plans. Salcedo has improved some with his defense but still makes alot of errors. Both guys could benefit from a change of scenery since it hasn’t exactly worked out how the Braves envisioned when they were both signed, but its a different story if the Cubs want it to be their scenery.
Your 100% wrong Joey T has played 3B since being demoted to AA.
My appologies then, just going off the info my brother has been giving me since he is living in that area. Although I should probably check in more myself or fine a more reliable source 😉
But he is hitting over .400 when playing 1st base.
But he had like 22 errors in AAA in less than 50 games
So, basically, if the Cubs don’t ask for a good prospect then something can be worked out. Is that right?
Do you realize that Garza is a top of the line starter with another year of control? Some B or C level prospect won’t get it done.
All I’m saying, is that if that I’m Wren I’m not trading them. I don’t want another Mark Texeira deal. Garza has another year of team control, that’s why I wan’t him, but he is making 9.5 million, and will get a raise next year, so it’s not like he is cheap. He is a front line starter, okay I can accept that statement, but he isn’t having the year you hope out of a front line starter with an ERA over 4.00.
Just to be clear, remember the Mark Texeira deal? Elvis Andrus, Neftali Perez, Matt Harrison, Jarrod Saltalamacchia, and Beau Jones for Mark Texeira and Ron Mahay.
So no Teheran, Delgado, or Simmons, not again
The only one from the last I could see going is possibly Minor and Pastornicky. We’re shallow at 3B and we’re not going to get rid of Terdoslavich or Salcedo (or we signed for record money internationally) who provide depth, and they’re young enough to fully mature with more seasoning. Graham might be a possibility, but he’s shown great stuff and if it’s a package deal, I can’t seem cutting bait on him just yet.
Wow this is going to be a lot of fun, seeing what players Epstein can snap up in exchange for trading Cubs piece by piece by piece.
I’d love for Theo to come to Atlanta. I think he’s one of the best in the game. I bet the Cubs win a WS by 2018.
I agree… This will be telling on how good (or bad) we can expect them to be going forward. Personally, I think they’ll be good. It just won’t be overnight. But I want to see how this trading period goes & then again in the off season w/trades & FA signings. Also on who they bring up, when they do it & how they play them… Gonna be really interesting.
It’s been 100+ years, I don’t think many Cubs fans are expecting overnight changes. They’d prolly be happy with <10 years lol.
A WS in less than 10 years? Yes, we’d take that in a heartbeat.
Send Zeke Spruill and another prospect to Brewers for Shaun Marcum. Send Cory Gearrin or Jaye Chapman to the A’s for Grant Balfour and call it a day.
Hanson
Hudson
Marcum
Medlen
Delgado
Kimbrel
Venters*
Balfour
EOF*
Martinez
Durbin
Minor
Medlen isn’t a starter IMO. I’d rather have Julio
I wish Wren would let Julio pitch tomorrow instead of Jurrjens. Give Julio a chance and lets see what he’s made of.
Minor won’t be in the bullpen either unless the Braves happen to make the playoffs and they go to a smaller starting rotation. He’s more likely to go back to AAA than spend any time in the pen.
Marcum…are you kidding?! No thanks. MIL GM wouldn’t do that if nothing else than if he traded him from MIL he’d have to admit publicly that his Lawrie-for-Marcum deal was a fleecing.
I wouldn’t deal with Billy Beane after “Moneyball”. I’d worry too much about looking like Mark Shapiro.
It is amazing how budget conscious the Braves are these days…The days of Ted turner truly are long gone
Having just watched the Braves play against the Yankees, I can tell you that regardless of any needs they have in the rotation the future for them is bright. Guys like Heyward, Kimbrel, Minor, Freeman, and Hanson to go along with older/veteran players like Chipper Jones, Dan Uggla, Tim Hudson, and Brian McCann is the perfect winning combination of young and veteran talent. I was completely blown away by Kimbrel’s 9th inning performance, his fastball is electrifying. I think the Braves would be smart to play this one out by ear. Let Jurrjens come back into the rotation with the injury to Brandon Beachy and see how he does. There was a point last year when he was in discussion for CY Young. That type of talent and know how doesn’t just evaporate. Give it time and Jurrjens could bounce back to form. With Hudson and Hanson at the forefront and a healthy more composed Jurrjens the Braves still have the goods to compete in the tough NL East. The performance of Randall Delgado and Mike Minor will determine their fate. Having young arms in the rotation is always a good thing and the Braves are loaded with SP depth. If they feel the need to bring in a starter, I agree with the masses that a veteran presence who wouldn’t cost much in terms of prospects would be best.
That’s possibly the second smartest post I’ve seen in the 4 years that I’ve been frequenting this site.
The #1 was when someone posted about a human life being more important than baseball on the Wilson Ramos kidnapping thread.
I still think JJ’s problem is in his mind. He’s worried about his knee. I think most of these guys come back way too soon from these major injuries.
It would be reasonable to assume the Braves have interest in Greinke? What would be a fair starting place in terms of what goes back in Milwaukee in any potential deal? Any of the big pitching prospects (Teheran, Vizcaino, Delgado, Minor)? Heyward? Freeman?
Knowing Frank Wren and the Braves, if he moved a top pitching prospect at all to get Greinke, I for one would think it’d be Minor. I wouldn’t count on Heyward being moved for alot of reasons but one IMO that gets overlooked is who would replace him. The OF depth in the minors in terms of capable everyday replacements is absolutely atrocious up and down the board at all levels. They’re already going to have 2 holes to fill next year when Prado will almost undoubtedly move to 3B with Chipper retiring and Bourn leaves in free agency.
Unless the Phillies make Hamels available or the Brewers somehow turn their season around, Greinke will be the best pitcher available at the deadline. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to ask for one of either VIzcaino, Teheran or Delgado plus maybe Simmons or Freeman and a prospect from the lower levels. Whatever the Cubs are asking for Garza or Dempster should not be enough to get Greinke in my opinion
Never said it was unreasonable, the Brewers would be downright stupid and brain dead not to ask about any of them in return for Greinke. I’m just saying that with Wren’s history, I think he’s going to want to hold onto Teheran, Viz, and Delgado if at all possible.
Fair enough, guess we’ll find out in the next month
are u kidding? one of our top pitching prospects and freeman or simmons AND another prospect?!
Didn’t say they’d do it, just said it wouldn’t be bad for Melvin to ask for that with five weeks to go before the deadline. And if he’s available, Greinke will bring back a greater haul than anyone on the market. You have to know that. The braves have all sorts of young pitching, would it be absolutely crazy for them to include one of them in a potential deal? Maybe I don’t put as much stock into Freddie Freeman as you do. He’s a good player with room for growth. But I don’t see a superstar ceiling.
IMO, you’re not getting Simmons or Freeman for anything.
that sir is bananas
Freeman no, Heyward, no. Unless he just falls off the wagon 100% in the next year. I doubt they’d go for Greinke, but they could. Not sure I’d want him though. Minor would be included I’m sure.
How aout Peavy to the Braves?
Why would the ChiSox trade away their ace when they are in first place in the ALC?
Betting on Detroit getting hot
We’ve been through that one already and it was an absolute nightmare
You don’t wanna go down that road, Morris
Whats the issue moving Medlen to the rotation? He was a very solid starter prior to TJ surgery. Hudson, Hanson, Medlen, Delgado and then take your pick for #5 (Minor, JJ, Tea) its not dominant but that’s as good as most rotations. I like Garza but that’s alot of dough and if he gets a raise next year. I want the Braves to have as much financially flexibility next year. Bourn is a FA, assuming Prado moves to 3rd- the Braves will need to get two OFers for 2013.
I’d like them to keep Bourn. Medlen to me just isn’t a SP. A fill in, sure. But long term, no. I like him in the relief role.
They are not going to deal for Greinke; they might make a run at him on free agent market, but no three-month rentals that cost major prospects.
Agreed. The Braves tend to migrate around the year-and-three-month players
Especially w/ no draft pick compensation.
wow. wren has veen a fine gm..the red sox are horrible and theo molded the current roster. fredi seems like he is still learning. there are a lot of questionable calls but at least he can back up his decisions afterwards. how many times have u questioned a call and its worked out fine? look at how gooddurbin has been since his rough april…point is Prado is a great player who had a tough 1st year in leftfield and put that behind him..i can hardly see wren trading away valuable pieces for a two month rental when we have so much depth that will last us for years. everybody likes tp bash the team when we arent playing good but i believe we have a ws team and have had for 3 years…did anybody pick the cards last year? No. keep the faith
I firmly believe if we hit like we did at the beginning, we can make a run. I’d rather not face the Yankees, but I think we could win a WS. I like our depth, I just dislike our managerial choices. I question a lot of them, even before the results are in.
I was at the Sunday night game vs Washington.. He brought Livan H in – in a tie game or down 1 run. That to me, is not the choice you make when trying to win.
Of course, we lost and Livan blew.
…
Can’t believe how many Braves fans on here tried to bash me pre-season when I said “you can never have enough pitching.”
I still think we have plenty, but we can afford to move some. We have other holes. Never know how things would turn out if we had moved one though, so no point in dwelling on the past.
I’d honestly be happy with trading Medlen right now, while his stock is semi-high.
you guys will get Wandy and like it…..the Braves clearly are over Julio Teheran….he will look good in the Stros rotation.
They are obviously done with Teheran. He’s already 21 and he’s already made 4 big-league starts, time to send him packing. Wandy is probably too much. Maybe Carlos Lee, assuming the Braves take on all of his remaining salary and throw in Simmons.
I’d go for Dempster.