Some Yankees-related news as things get underway in Tampa..
- Yankees GM Brian Cashman is still on the lookout for a starting pitcher, either via trade or free agency, writes Chad Jennings of the LoHud Yankees Blog. “If it makes sense, I’m ready to rock and roll,” the GM said. Of course, the Yankees already have plenty of candidates for the backend of the rotation in-house, including Freddy Garcia, Bartolo Colon, and Ivan Nova, as well as youngsters D.J. Mitchell and David Phelps.
- Meanwhile, manager Joe Girardi says that the competition is wide open at this stage. While that could mean that the club's in-house position battle goes down to the wire, it could also mean that there's enough time for a new acquisition to be worked into the mix. “The chances that the fourth and fifth starter role will be answered sooner than later are not very good,” the manager said. “I think we’ll spend all spring evaluating everybody in our camp…So, basically, we have an open competition until March 30.”
- Danny Knobler of CBSSports.com (via Twitter) doesn't blame Yankees pitcher C.C. Sabathia for keeping his opt-out option open.
- Hank Steinbrenner isn't concerned about Sabathia opting-out of his deal, writes Wallace Matthews of ESPNNewYork.com. Steinbrenner also says that fans can expect the Yankees to contend every year.
I like Nova as the #4 and Garcia as the #5 for the first half of the year. After that I can see Phelps, Warren, or the killer B’s pitching in the second half of the season.
What’s really important about CC opting out or not? They Yankees would just make him richer and on we go.
The yanks already have a rotation that’s making people ask questions, imagine it without Sabathia. If Sabathia opts out then, despite the yanks checkbook, there’s a chance he’ll go elsewhere. Thus the importance.
I doubt Sabathia will opt out, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him use the opt out to get an extension.
My guess is, assuming he has another excellent CC season, he opts out an signs a deal very similar to his current contract, without the opt out (as long as Randy Levine isn’t part if negotiations of course. If he is he may get 7 opt out clauses), taking him right into retirement. Even if he loves the Yankees it’s just smart business for him to wrap up his financial career now rather than having to hustle for the old guy, one year, incentive laden contracts in his late 30’s.
Exactly what I’m thinking, even if Sabathia isn’t thinking it his agent is already thinking about the next contract. Sabathia’s contract covers him until he’s 35 and most players don’t get paid a premium at that age. Turning his opt out into a 3 or 4 year extension makes the most sense to all parties involved. Yanks need him and he’ll get top dollar in NY.
I’m not sure it makes sense for the Yankees, but they made their bed (and keep doing so) with these opt out clauses. The only hitch is that he’s really the only legitimate starter on the market next season. We’ve already seen that that doesn’t always work out even if you have the most money. The Angels, Jays, O’s, Nats are among many teams that might open the vault for him. The difference this time around is that he’s lived up to his contract about as well as can be hoped.
Buerhle is on the market. Edwin Jackson. Quite a few other names. POSSIBLY oswalt and carpenter but chances are slim they both make it. CC is definitely the cream of the crop but its not like its completely empty.
I should have said ace-type pitchers. Buehrle, while a great innings eater, and good pitcher, is not the headliner of a contending rotation at this point.
Bingo.
If CC hits the market then he’ll be the top pitcher on the market by a mile and a half. Carpenter is the only name who comes close and if the Cards want to part ways then it makes far more sense to pick up his option and trade him. Thus the yanks won’t allow Sabathia to opt out and they’ll give him an extension if he demands it. He’ll remain their ace and Sabathia will get paid top dollar. Win-win.
That’s the thing though, I just don’t see any chance that he would actually leave, and I actually think he almost certainly will opt out. He seems to enjoy New York alright, they love him and, as always, no one is going to outbid them on anything. Even if they don’t WIN every year, they’ll compete, and that’s about all you can ask for as a player. Why would he leave?
Didn’t we hear this all last year about Cliff Lee?
not really. CC has already taken the top dollar to join the evil empire, why wouldn’t he do it again?
The difference is Cliff Lee didn’t have a bird in hand. The difference is asking if a player will opt out and test an unknown market or keep what is universally accepted as a generous deal.
You don’t think someone would give him a Cliff Lee deal in a heartbeat? That’s one thing about this situation I have no doubts about. If he opts out he’ll get another big contract.
I have my doubts about teams that can afford Sabathia. Yanks and maybe 2 other teams are the market.
and the market for cliff lee was the yanks, rangers and phillies (perhaps the nats too but they didn’t seem serious after they spent their money on werth). so three teams in a race can mean quite a payday.
True true, but I think Lee’s contract was unique.
O’s were very in on Texeira. Nats gave Jason frigging Werth a 9 figure deal. CC is not that old. The Jays have almost no payroll committed beyond this season. Cubs are in a similar situation. The Angels would be very aggressive and have the money. There will be no shortage of teams willing to give him another $160 mil contract, especially now that he is no longer CC of the Indians, but CC of the AL East; he’s a superstar now and someone you can build franchise value around.
Cliff Lee didn’t sign for the most money, that’s clear. CC HAS the most lucrative deal already in terms of overall dollars.
5/$120 mil guaranteed < 7/$161 mil total guaranteed
Even though Lee is averaging more per year he clearly would've been guaranteed more total $$$ if he signed with the Yanks or Texas. At age 37 or 38 do you think Lee will earn enough on his next contract to make up for the difference? Hard to see.
I never said he signed for the most money. What I did say is that the situation proves having the most money, mystique and aura to throw around doesn’t guarantee anything.
I’d be shocked to see Sabathia in anything but a yanks uni in 2012. Between the money, the history, and the constantly being in the postseason mix it comes down to what you said, why leave. That said, his agent would be negligent to not turn this situation to his advantage.
Apparently Hank missed the end of the 2008 season.
I read that too and thought, “He mentioned that the Red Sox missed in 2010 but didn’t mention that the Yankees missed in 2008.” It must be great to be born on third base and think you hit a triple.
What would it take to get Liriano without giving up Montero or Banuelos???
God would have to come down from where ever and say he’s no longer an unbiased fan?
My bet is the yanks can keep Montero since the Twins don’t really need a C/1B/DH, but they’ll lose top pitching prospects.
I think it would only take one of Betances or Brackman plus other prospects not named Montero, Banuloes or Sanchez. Why do I think this? The prospect hauls for Greinke, Halladay, Lee (Phillies) and Haren (Angels) were nowhere near as impressive as many projected.
Cano
So tha Yanks weren’t in the running as of August 1st 2008 when they were only 5 games out before Wang and half the rotation went on the DL?
Would you have considered the Sox in the running as of August 1 of this past season? They were only 5.5 at that point.
With that starting staff, Yes. I think if they had swept the Yankees on the last series at Yankees Stadium (Sept 23rd thru 25th) they would have been 5 games out but Paplebon blew the Sunday night ESPN game.
Yes I did. Didn’t breath easy until late september when they were mathematically eliminated.
Did you read the article?
Yeah I did and I’ve learned to filter out what Hank has to say about anything. However, I think what he says is truthful in theory. The Boss’ Kids are going to be dedicated to winning and fielding a championship caliber team every year. I think that has been the truth every single year since 1996. It doesn’t mean that it’ll happen but does anyone see the Yanks as non-contenders in 2011 even with the current ??? of the rotation? Obviously, they are the underdogs for 2011 but they are still one of the top 3, 4 or 5 teams in the AL and anything can happen to improve or downgrade their chances between now and September.
Did anyone think the Sox would perform as bad as they did in 2010? Did anyone think the M’s would be in last place after all the acquisitions they made last winter? But as long as the Yanks are commited to fielding the best team they can they will be contenders.
I don’t disagree with much of this at all, but the quote was the quote. By Hank’s criteria, they’ve already failed. Not saying anything more or less than that.
Sox underperformed due to injury…and even with all those injuries they were still competitive.
Thats a totally different scenario than having AJ Burnett as your ace…Phil Hughes as your #2…and….?????
Yanks won in 2009 with CC, AJ and Pettitte. If you sub out Hughes for Pettitte and AJ rebounds then who is to say they can’t have a repeat? My point is, and to an extent what Hank was saying, is that the Yanks and Sox are probably the two teams who you can count on to be contenders year in and year out. They may have “bridge years” where they are more “pretenders” hanging around seemingly as “contenders” but they will always be in the thick of things, in most years, playing meaningful games in late August/September.
Even on Sept 2008 the Yanks were 7 games out of the wild card w/ 6 games vs TB and 3 vs Boston means they were still in it, despite the fact they were trotting our a rotation including Sidney Ponson and Darrell Rasner.
My scenario presented was assuming Burnett bounced back..and Hughes improved…
if CC opts out, you still are missing 3 starters…
if CC opts out, and AJ does NOT rebound…u have 1 bad starter..& ur missing 3 more
thats 4/5ths of the rotation in question.
in 2009, u had CC, AJ, Pet, and Hughes…
and the difference between the Yanks and the Sox…
the Sox have a SURPLUS of major league level pitching.
anyone of their starters would be the yankees #2 right now.
Beckett
Lackey
Lester
Clay
Dice-K
all are locked in for next year…
u take Sabathia out the rotation…and u guys are fighting for 3rd place.
Assuming they didn’t replace Sabathia, then I would probably agree.
PS-Not really a “surplus”. You mentioned 5.
In 2009 we didn’t have Hughes as a starter and btw I think you are really selling Hughes short. Regardless, you need at least 3 good starters to compete in the AL East so I get your point. We need CC. Gotcha. Sort of a no-brainer.
excuses. August 1st isn’t september 1st.
More than half the teams in baseball are still “contending” on august 1st.
Hank’s definition was “World Series” contender, which is why he said that the Red Sox weren’t “in it” last year.
August 1st represents 2/3 of the season.
As of August 1st 2008 there were only 6 teams that were either in 1st place or w/in 5.5 games of 1st place, so no, half the teams in baseball were not still “contending”.
I haven’t checked, but I’m doubting your facts here. There are only 6 divisions. That would mean no 2nd place team was within 5.5 games?
It’s accurate if he meant to say just the American League. Which doesn’t make any sense, however, since the discussion was about all the teams in baseball.
In fact, on August 1 2008, 14 teams were either in first or ≤5.5 games back. So almost exactly half of the teams in baseball were still contending.
I would also assume that you could add a few more teams into the “contending” category, that were within striking distance of the Wild Card. So I would say easily half the teams in baseball still considered themselves “contenders”
Wow…ok. So if I have to be more specific about it (He was refering to the Yanks who play in the AL) then..
In each leage you have 3 teams currently in 1st place. Everone else is either “contending” to be in 1st place or they are out of it.
As of Aug 1st 2008, the AL had 1 team tied for 1st and 2 teams w/in 5.5 games of the 1st place team. In the NL you had 5 teams that were w/in 4 games of 1st place.
It’s not really a matter of being more specific about it, both he and you said in those first two posts “in baseball”, not in the AL.
And yes, those figures are correct, which adds up to 14 teams. Which means basically half of the teams in baseball were contending (by this 5.5 games cutoff), which makes qbass187’s comment pretty accurate (to be fair he said “more than,” but it’s pretty darn close). So I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make?
AL
That’s what I figured, though it sort of makes your point against qbass187 moot since he was referring to all of baseball.
Well he was responding to my post which was abbbbbooooouuuuttttttt? The Yanks who play whhhhhheheeeeeerrrreeee? AL.
No problem, semantics.
To be entirely fair to the point, six is only one shy of half of the AL. Even if you meant AL inititally (And to be honest, this kind of reeks of backpeddaling), you’re still wrong. Literally almost half of the AL’s playing field was “in it” by your definition on August 1, 2008.
“If it makes sense, I’m ready to rock and roll,”
translation: I am going to be the 5th starter!
– B.Cashman
whoops. why can’t you delete posts?
please let me respond to the post i want to respond to? thanks.
Keep at it.
Speaking of Pitching, anyone in the NYC area watch ABC news tonight? They showed pitchers and catchers reporting, and then Joe Girardi talked briefly. It showed the name Joe Girardi, and underneath it, instead of Yankees Manager, it said Yankees Pitcher, LOL.
Problem solved
Sabathia
Hughes
Burnett
Nova
Girardi.
Although Pride often gets in the way of logic…Yankee fans must admit…the dried up market…Plus small market teams playing keep-away with their young pitching talent all puts the yanks in a very vulnerable position if their ace leaves..
Hey maybe the mets can trade Santana to the Yankees for Bunuelos and Batances !
“Hey maybe the mets can trade Santana to the Yankees for Bunuelos and Batances” !
Joke right?
And actually, I meant contending for the wildcard.
The Yanks need pitching and could get Johnny Cueto for Brett Gardner
Yankees are going to stink this year, at least by Yankee fan standards.