Nine years ago today, MLB announced it had withdrawn its plan to contract the Twins and Expos due to legal issues and major opposition from the players' union. Minnesota has won six division titles and moved into Target Field since then, and they now boast a $100MM+ payroll. The Expos have since relocated to Washington and moved into Nationals Park, and this winter they handed out their first $100MM+ contract.
Here's some links for Saturday…
- Enrique Rojas of ESPN Deportes reports (on Twitter) that Vladimir Guerrero is scheduled to take his physical with the Orioles this upcoming Friday in Baltimore.
- Brewers principal owner Mark Attanasio spoke to Tom Haudricourt of The Journal Sentinel about letting talent dictate the team's payroll as opposed to spending for the sake of spending.
- Yankees GM Brian Cashman wasn't terribly interested in the starters that were left on the open market after Cliff Lee signed with the Phillies, writes Chad Jennings of The LoHud Yankees Blog.
- In today's blog post at ESPN (Insider req'd), Buster Olney says there does not to appear to have been much progress in talks about a long-term contract extension between the Cardinals and Albert Pujols. The Spring Training deadline is about two weeks away.
- Jeff Zrebiec of The Baltimore Sun says the Guerrero signing has created some questions, such as what the Orioles' Opening Day payroll will be.
- Minor league contract signees Eric Chavez and Ronnie Belliard will compete with four homegrown players for two spots on the Yankees' bench according to Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports, but he notes that Ramiro Pena and Eduardo Nunez have an advantage because they can play shortstop.
Maybe if the Jays hadn’t traded him for Estaban Loiaza way back when, they wouldn’t need to be interested.
But I like them as a fit.
Am I the only one who thinks I’d rather have EE at third?
yes
Yes please tell me you are still feeling a little tipsy after last night with a comment like that.
Edwin, is that you?
YEEEEEEAAAAAAHHHH
EE Sux Period! would be one of the 3 worst 3b in baseball!
Im on board with another year of E5. If he can keep putting work I with his throws he can only improve. Pretty sure his second half last year was nice at the hot corner.
I think the Angels would have been a very good fit for Young if they hadn’t brought in Wells. He’s cheaper than Wells and better offensively, he’d play 3B and be a team leader.
I agree. MY could still fit with the Angels, if the Rangers are willing to trade to their rivals, but who would the Angels give up in return or would they take on the full brunt of MY’s salary?
Speaking of Tipsy!
With Gardner being able to play center and Jones being able to play anywhere in the OF, there is a chance that the Yanks can carry 2 extra infielders and instead of 1 and two of the guys on this list could make the team.
When people speculate about teams that could take Michael Young, they seem to ignore that the he still has 3 years(!) left on his deal. Sure, the Jays, for example, could use a third baseman for 2011, and have money to spend, but no one wants to be stuck with that in 2012 and 2013, when the Jays would have Brett Lawrie ready.
Yes, but teams like the Angels and Rockies have a definite need at 3B and others might use MY at 2B or SS and he would be an upgrade from bad to average in those cases. It isn’t the best solution, but for some teams, if the price is right and the Rangers send salary relief, then it could be made to work.
Maybe, but Young at SS or 2B just sounds like a big disaster. It does all depend on how much the Rangers are willing to eat from that contract. It just seems like they’d have to eat so much of it that they would be better off keeping him.
I agree that Young at SS or 2B makes me shiver. Even Young at 3B could be a problem in the next year or 2.
If the Jays got Young, would they consider putting him at 2B and Hill at 3B? I thought I remember Hill volunteering to move there.
Hill is a plus fielder at 2B
Young is a bad fielder at 3B
True enough, but Young is best suited to 2B, according to scouting reports, and maybe Hill can make the transition. It was just a thought.
Obviously, it sure looks like the Rangers and Rockies are going to make some kind of a deal. At this point, the Rangers must be looking to move MY just because of his contract and that he is taking up a roster spot, because they sure don’t need him to DH with Napoli there and they have 3 guys who can play 1B.
Personally, I wouldn’t make the deal at all because of what MY means in the clubhouse and that he can play all the IF positions in a pinch and play them adequately. The same can’t be said if Beltre gets hurt and the Rangers have to shove somebody else to fill in.
there’s no way the Jays would take M Young for two reasons: $16M per year for three years for a <.800 OPS just makes no sense; they didn't trade Marcum for Lawrie so that he can rot in the minors while Young cashes cheques, and when you throw in Hecheverria who will be ready this time next year, ffffoooooggggget about it
exactly. They need a stop gap for a year before they move either hill or lawrie there. eric chavez would have been a good stop gap. another reclamation project i can think of is brandon wood. also willy aybar is still a free agent. also i believe at somepoint this year escobar will be trade bait(given that a Adeiny Hechavarria proves in the minors that he will be ready for 2012)
Come on Cardinals, get it done and pick up Michael Young
They are having trouble enough locking down Pujols. Young is an extra $16m/year.
Love the Seatle Pilots logo. A lot of people don’t know that 1969 was the only season they ever played.
Thanks. I am actually a Cardinals and (sigh) Royals fan, but the Pilots were one of the most interesting teams of all time for the reason you mentioned.
So, its not our money
Get it done Cards
I guess it isn’t our money, but if they trade for Young and let Pujols walk for that reason, they are boneheads.
nahh im hopin they dont i hope he signs with the mets next season
reyes
murphy
wright
pujols
beltran
bay
pagan
thole
pitcher
pretty damn good lineup
I love over optimistic Mets fans.
hey thats what mets fans do…you have to be a true met fan to understand why we are very optimistic.
Why would Mets fans sell Ike Davis short without seeing what he can really do? He played great defense and showed off some of that power the Mets sought when they drafted him. He took a huge stride in Double-A Binghamton in ’09 and showed he was at least a major league regular in ’10. He’s only going to get better, so why not give him a chance?
well yeah thats the only reason why i dont want pujols…other wise you get some one of pujols’ caliber and get some nice pitching for davis…or maybe a ss and trade reyes away for something else that we need…it all comes down to rebuilding…even though ike would be a great start to the new mets look
yankee bench
Jones
Cervelli
Nunez
Laird or Chavez
I wouldn’t want to see Laird waste away on the bench. He’s only 23 and can use a full season of seasoning @ AAA.
25 roster for Yanks
4 Starting IF (Tex, Cano, Jeter, Arod)
3 Starting OF (Ganderson, Gardner, Swish)
3 C’s/DH (Martin, Posada, Montero)
5 Starters (CC, Hughes, Burnett, 2 more…hmmm)
6 in pen (Mo, Soriano, Joba, Robertson, Marte, Felicano)
It leaves 4 spots (if Montero makes it…) (5 if Montero is not ready)
Jones, Montero, Nunez, 1 of Belliard/Chavez…and then I bring in an extra P (Colon, Garcia, Nova, Mitre) as a long man.
Jones can fill in at any OF
Swisher or Montero can fill in at 1B
Nunez can fill in at 2b, 3b or SS and run bases late in games
Chavez can fill in at DH, 3B or 1B
Belliard can fill in at 2b or 3b
(if either show ANYTHING in spring training they give vet presence off bench and have much higher upside then Pena)
Damaso Marte had shoulder surgery late last year and he is out until the All-Star break.
I hope Montero and Nunez make the team and Gardner isn’t traded for pitching. It would be good to see some new home grown talent in the Bronx.
You left out Logan out of the bpen. Montero isn’t there. Cervelli is still on the roster I believe.
Since most feel Montero can’t play catcher, I would say let Swisher or Granderson leave after their contract is up (Swishers is up after this year but there is a club option. Grandersons is up after 2012 and also has a club option)
I say get rid of one, move Gardner to CF, make Montero a full time OFer in LF or RF. The Yankees already have excellent depth at C. Montero doesn’t need to be a C.
Wow, Rosenthal updates that a Young to Rockies deal could come as soon as Monday: Source: #Rangers talking only to #Rockies about Young. 2nd source: Deal could come as soon as Mon.
3rd source. Deal is done pending a physical
/sarcasm
Pujols to Cubs in FA looking pretty good right now.
Not a chance Jntg.
There certainly is a chance. If you guys don’t sign him the next 2 weeks he said that he’ll test the free agent market and the Cubs have a TON of money to spend this off-season.
Have to agree. Reports were the Cubs also made a run at Adrian Gonzalez during the offseason and depending which sportswriter you want to believe their package was similar value to the Sox. They definitely want to add a big bat at first, they have the money, and they certainly could use him. Add to it, it’d be strengthening their own team while seriously wounding a division rival.
I will personally give you my address, so you could come to my house and punch me 500 times anywhere you want if Pujols goes to the Cubs.
That’s too tiring.
Can I use an engine propelled boxing machine?
why dont the Yanks get involved in MY..I mean theres a good chance Arod will be out some, he always is, Jeter is getting older and may need some days off… teix and cano have had minor injurys that kept them out a week or 2 or the last two yrs and their DH is a 40 year old man who could get hurt at any moment.. I say Yanks trade for Young!!!!! There looking for a utli guy there he is
Nice idea and I agree 100%. I dont think it will happen though because Colorado is willing to give up Jose Lopez who can rebound and be a very nice player for them and the Yankees can’t offer a similar type of player. Nunez and Montero are being held onto if a pitcher becomes available and I dont know who else the Yankees could offer that Texas may want.
i disagree. although the yanks have tons of money it’d be unwise to acquire MY. texas would expect the yanks to take on tons of salary, just because its the yanks, the money could be much better spent on a midseason acquisition, after apparent needs have been exposed, rather than a preventative maintanence player in MY. the yanks bench is already quite extensive and the bullpen is obviously strong, the offense will again be a force, they need pitching, so unless MY has a nasty splitter, this is a waste IMO.
a) Cano has never missed more than 4 or 5 games a year.
b) Arod has only had injury issues over the last 2 years and last years injury was a hamstring and not a hip related issue. He also got the “clean bill” to resume normal offseason work out routine as well.
c) Jeter and Arod might need time off but it would probably be no more than 15 games throught the year. Paying $16 mil for Young to be a utility INF is way too much.
d) If Posada does get hurt playing DH then the Yanks would probably call up Montero 1st.
YanksFanSince78, Ill be honest your the only guy on this whole board that I respect so I take what you say with the highest respect…
But, theres no way that any team takes on all 16M per year… I say Yanks could prolly get him for about 10-11M a year… Jeter or Arod might need a Defenisve replacment toward the end of the game, and we both know as being Yankees fans theres almost no chance that Montero stays with the Yanks… There’s a good chance that Yanks are going to move him. I say if you cant have the best starting rotation then why not have the best lineup, utilty player and bullpen in the MLB… Young could take some of the pressure off of Arod and Jeter when times are hard like they have been before… i think getting MY is smart, especially because Nunez might get moved to for a arm… I say give up an outfielder, an arm and some other guy for MY
I appreciate the complement but I guess we agree to disagree. No way in the world would anyone look at Young as a defensive replacement other than in name only. As bad as ppl view the defense of Jeter and Arod, they both rank higher defensively than Young on just about every metric. Young would be an ideal acquisition if God forbid, Arod were to go down for a prolonged period but he is way too expensive to acquire to be a utility player and wouldn’t get enough forseeable playing time to warrant his salary. Also, I think the Rangers would eat some salary but not enough for him not to be an everyday player.
As for Montero, the Yanks prime offensive threat, Arod, is getting an older and the Yanks need a prime offensive RH bat. Montero would have to be worse than Posada not to be the everday catcher and if he is, then he can probably DH for the next 2 years before we have to worry about moving Arod to DH, and Arod should be the ONLY player worthy of being an everyday DH after 2011. Jeter should sit on the bench on his offdays or play an OF position rather than be a DH. I can see Montero being used to acquire an elite youngish starting pitcher but I don’t think the Yanks are in “we must move him mindframe”. If he’s as good as ppl say he is, then he has more value performing on the mlb level then being traded if his position and Arod’s situation becomes a problem.
There’s no way in Hell Pujols leaves St. Louis.. Cardinal for life he needs to sign a blank contract and they compromise what he gets depending on his numbers and all contracts should be like that… that way no one will get a 500mil dollar contract for having one good yr..
Please explain to me why Cardinal fans find it utterly impossible that Pujols would ever even consider leaving St. Louis.
I know he and his family are happy there with the great fans, good town to live in etc…
BUT, there are lots of nice towns, with great fans, who will adore Albert and his family and pay him what he deserves to be paid.
The idea of St. Louis getting a huge discount because St. Louis is so wonderful is not going to happen. The Cards are going to have to pay up if they want to keep Pujols.
Story of the year would be if Pujols goes to KC 15 mil a year and another 5 mil in a % of ticket sales and merchandise. thats a 150 mil contract that can equal 200 mil…the kicker…is that he still collects a % of their ticket sales and merchandise for the next 30 years…so it never comes up on their payroll however his pockets stay Phat like Albert..
I truly hope that Pujols and the Cards can work something out. However, you sound like Whitney Houston pleading to the world that Bobby doesn’t have a drug problem. OBVIOUSLY, the Cards and Pujols are far apart on the money issues. The fact that Pujols gave them a spring training deadling and said he would veto any mid-season trade makes the possibility of him walking more than a slight possibility. Comes to grips with that.
seriously…it almost seems like pujols kinda wants to explore the free agency avenue
How have the Twins done in the postseason under Gardenhire with their 6 division titles? 6-21, 0-9 since 2006. Looks like MLB had the right idea back in ’02.
Shows how weak the AL central is
AMEN AMEN AMEN alphabet soup. Finally someone else who understands. They play in the weakest division in baseball and last year if you switched them with the Orioles they may have finished in last place in the AL East.
They should have been contracted. Do you know the reason behind the idea? It is because they have no fan base outside Minnesota. Some say the 91 series was so great but guess what? Nobody watched it. The ratings were low and would have been lower had they not played the Braves- who were on a national station TBS, at the time and had been for years and as a result had a bigger national fan base than most. Imagine what the numbers would have been had they played the Expos in 1991? Selig wanted to contract them because he figured out that when teams like them and the Bluejays start winning very few people care and will not watch and baseball suffers.
Who cares what the Minnesota fan base is outside of Minneapolis? They still have a loyal fan base that shows up. You can’t constrict a team simply based on how many titles they’ve won or how the tv ratings do. They’ve been averaging about 2.2 mil in attendance over the last 5 years and that’s not bad for a smaller market team.
Major league baseball cares because when a team likes that makes the playoffs and goes beyond the first round the ratings are low, so that is who cares. Look at the ratings of the Championship and World Series and you will see that the teams from the larger markets draw better ratings which means more revenue for Major League baseball. I have news for you- major league baseball can constrict a team for whatever reason it wants and the precise reasons would be that a team is not successful and does not draw the ratings they want. This is why Selig wanted to do it to begin with and the players association stopped it because it would have meant 50 left big league jobs. I don’t care that they draw 2.2 million a year- if they would draw 3.5 million in Charlotte then they should be moved there.
And my point is the league isn’t and shouldn’t get rid of a team in a small market where they annualy draw over 2.2 mil ppl and make the playoffs ever year. You can’t base a teams location striclty on tv ratings because then that means that effectively, the league will only be based in major markets. And in comparison, Atlanta metro is about 5.2 mil ppl. Minneapolis metro is 2.8 mil. Yet over the last few years the Twins have avg’d 2.3 mil compared to the Braves 2.5 mil. I would say that they are doing a better job drawing a crowd than the Braves. If anything, I would get rid of teams in the Florida market before I touched the Twins.
Your argument is flawed and does not make sense. Seating is not unlimited and no team can draw more fans than the number of stadium seats over 81 games. The Braves can only draw crowds based on the number of available seats. The Braves may only draw 2.5 million per year but there could be many more people who would like to attend games but can’t because they simply can’t get a ticket. The Braves have a large waiting list for luxury boxes that Minnesota does not. How can the Braves draw more people than there are seats available? So Atlanta has more people- which means there are more jobs the schedules which might not allow for attending baseball games. Compare the median incomes- Atlanta has many people who can’t afford to attend games but would attend if they could afford it. Your argument assumes that Minnesota and Atlanta are similar in many ways and they are not and that is the point. Minnesota has a limited fan base and even if they attend games, baseball is a business and the Twins are an anchor around MLB’s neck because nobody wants to watch them on the National level and the game suffers in the form of lower ratings and fan apathy when they are in the playoffs. Having a major league team is not a right. No market has the right to have a team and teams should only be in major markets. It is ridiculous the Yankees, Redsox and others have to participate in welfare so small markets can have a team. The luxury tax causes ticket prices to rise in the same manner as signing players to large contracts.
I want to know why the league only having teams based in a major market is a bad thing as you imply. You say “effectively the league will only be based in major markets”. Why is that a bad thing? When did having a sports team become a god given right of a small market? What would be wrong with teams only being in major markets therefore those teams having larger profits and being able to sign players absent revenue sharing? Why does Minnesota deserve a baseball team over another market that would make a franchise more profitable because it would offer a larger fanbase meaning larger crowds and more TV revenue?
“Your argument is flawed and does not make sense. Seating is not unlimited and no team can draw more fans than the number of stadium seats over 81 games. The Braves can only draw crowds based on the number of available seats. The Braves may only draw 2.5 million per year but there could be many more people who would like to attend games but can’t because they simply can’t get a ticket”.
Answer: The Metrodome held a standard of 46,500 compared to Turner Field which hold about 50,000.
2010- Metrodome avg’d 39,790 vs Braves avg of 31,00
2009-Twins @ 29,466 vs Braves @ 29,304
2008- Twins 28,425 vs Braves 31,269
2007-Twins @ 28,349 vs Braves @ 33,891
Obivously 2009 and 2010 were good years because of the last year at the old and 1st year at the new but aside from that the Twins are relatively close to drawing what the Braves due despite being in a market with 2 million fewer ppl. Also, the Braves do not come anywhere near selling out so I’m not sure what the heck you’re talking about. If the stadium holds 50,000 and they avg around 30-33k then that leves well over 15,000 tickets to be sold. The majority of fans are not coming to buy expensive luxury seats.
“Compare the median incomes- Atlanta has many people who can’t afford to attend games but would attend if they could afford it. Your argument assumes that Minnesota and Atlanta are similar in many ways and they are not and that is the point”.
This correlation you try to make is so outlandish but let’s look at it. Atlanta’s median income for 2010 was $42,173. Minnesota’s median income for 2010 was $41,829. Not a major difference. Face it, the Twins fans are coming out on a higher level compared to the Braves, relative to the % of the metro population of each city.
“Having a major league team is not a right. No market has the right to have a team and teams should only be in major markets. It is ridiculous the Yankees, Redsox and others have to participate in welfare so small markets can have a team”.
Answer-From 2006-2010, the Twins have out drawn Baltimore and the Miami Marlins every single year and the same for Texas except for two years where the Rangers out drew them by about 100,000 ppl. So the Twins are drawing the same, if not better, than two major markets.
Being a fan of a major market team who is also the biggest contributor to the revenue sharing pot, have always been critical of teams that claim to be broke and just put the charity gifts in their pockets instead of using it towards their players. The Twins are an example of a team that uses the money THE RIGHT WAY by ivesting in the draft and recently extending Mauer. They are one of the best ran teams in baseball even though I agree they can do more. There are teams that might deserve to be contracted but the Twins aren’t one (see Pittsburgh, Marlins, Rays).
Baseball would become increasingly less enjoyable if the only teams in baseball are in major markets. Take away teams because they’re fans aren’t showing up to support a good product and push poorly ran teams to produce a better product or loose their funding, but not because they draw poorly over a 3 wek span during the playoffs.
Also, according to Sports Media Watch:
“Including the Cardinals (#21 TV market), mid-market teams drew four of the five largest average ratings. The aforementioned Twins (#15) ranked second with an 8.77 average on FS North, the Reds (#33) ranked fourth with a 7.47 on FS Ohio, and the Rays (#14) ranked fifth with a 5.99 on Sun Sports and FS Florida”.
So by that info, the Twins, with the 15th highest tv market, drew the 2nd highest ratings among all the mid-market teams, so they obviously have a high viewership which I’m sure translated into good advertising dollars.
You say that having a team is no God given right then why should it be so for a larger market team when you have examples of those markets drawing less than the Twins (see Baltimore, Miami and the Dallas metro market for many years)?
Did I miss something? How did the Twins make it into the conversation?
lol I was wondering the same thing.
^This
“Nine years ago today, MLB announced it had withdrawn its plan to contract the Twins and Expos due to legal issues and major opposition from the players’ union. Minnesota has won six division titles and moved into Target Field since then, and they now boast a $100MM+ payroll.”
I missed that. Thanks.
I am not the biggest Cashman fan but I give him alot of credit for one thing. In years past he ignored the bench and this year after it became clear he could not obtain the starter they needed he has done a great deal to allow the Yankees to have one of the strongest benches in baseball if all goes well.
Andruw Jones hit 19 homeruns last year and is an upgrade over Thames in that he provides better defense. Chavez and Belliard if both are healthy and both are not forced to play everyday due to an injury can be very valuable as both have pop and can pinch hit and fill in in the field and at dh allowing the Yankees to give guys occassional days off. Of the three mentioned none of the players are what they were in their primes, and can’t be expected to perform as they did back then but its not a stretch to think they may perform like they did back them if given very limited playing time. 150-200 abs may see them putting up good numbers. A strong bench is essential and you get one by finding players who can perform well when they do not play everyday.
The Martin signing gives the Yankees a better bench as well. If he is healthy again and Montero has a great spring you have him start with Montero as the backup and Posada as your third catcher. If Montero tears it up and wins the job Martin is still better than Cervelli. Either scenerio gives the Yankees a better bench.
The signings also allows Nunez to play everyday at AAA which allows them to show case him for a potential deal for a starter. He is regarded as a decent prospect and of all the Yankee prospects I think they would like to deal him before any others and him playing well everyday at AAA makes this a bigger possibility.
All these signings can make the Yankee bench a strength when in recent years it has been a weakness. If this happens, which I believe it will, then they have a great lineup, a great bench, a lights out pen with Soriano and a rotation that even though it has questions, does have a strong top three starters. This is still going to be a good team and if anyone of Nova, Garcia or Colon can be solid as a fourth or fifth and they acquire a starter in the spring or before the deadline this team may find itself playing very deep into October.
Nova, Garcia or Colon
…or Brackman or Noesi or Phelps
I think the young guys are on strict innings limits so they can’t factor in from the beginning. I dont think there is a situation where anyone of the young guys would be allowed to pitch anywhere near a full season as a starter.
I can see Nova, Noesi or Phelps being allowed to pitch 175 innings or more. Nova passed that last year and Noesi and Phelps were around 150 IP as well.
And those attendance numbers are based off of the attendance from 2005-2009 and not the new stadium which drew 3.3mil in it’s 1st year.
And those attendance numbers are based off of the attendance from 2005-2009 and not the new stadium which drew 3.3mil in it’s 1st year.
Now of all the ‘Quick Hits’ I found the Brewers article the most interesting. The short version is that the Brewers hadn’t set a predetermined amount to spend-but they would spend if the right players were available. Duh. I agree with what they have done, I just don’t know if it will be enough.
The Orioles are doing their best to make an impact but I think they will fall short. At least the fans will have something more interesting to watch.
Cashman was right to not go too hard after anyone left on the market not named Cliff Lee. Now they could have tried to trade for Greinke or Marcum, but I don’t know if they would have been the right fit for a trade with the Jays or the Royals.
I actually like Belliard for a bench spot for the Yankees-Chavez is unlikely to avoid the DL. Belliard, plus one from the farm.
The biggest key for the Yankees is what will A.J. Burnett be, that is quite scary given his makeup.
He needs to perform better.
Lets be honest by the time you get to the back of the rotations of teams over the regular season its a toss up on most nights, unless you are the Phillies next season.
With the Yankees bullpen strength what they need is an effective Sabathia, Hughes, Burnett and innings from the other two rotations spots to get to the 6th inning of games.
The old keep it close, bend but not break.
The Yankees will likely have to make a move in the middle of the season in the upcoming campaign.
As it stands the rotations is
Sabathia
Hughes
Burnett
Nova
Garcia/Mitre/Colon/minor leaguers like David Phelps
to go along with a bullpen of
Chamberlain
Logan
Feliciano
Robertson
Soriano
Rivera
It is the bullpen that is the strength of the pitching clearly, the rotation is thin as of now.