The Padres have acquired Cameron Maybin from the Marlins, according to Tom Krasovic of Fanhouse (via Twitter). Florida will receive relievers Ryan Webb and Edward Mujica in exchange for the center fielder, Krasovic tweets. The Marlins have announced that the deal is now official.
The deal will provide Maybin with a much needed change of scenery, Jeff Passan of Yahoo Sports writes (via Twitter). The 23-year-old has yet to realize his potential after coming over to the Marlins in the 2007 Miguel Cabrera–Dontrelle Willis trade. Maybin's performance at the plate was particularly disappointing this season as he hit .234/.302/.361 with eight homers in 322 plate appearances. His arrival presumably bumps Tony Gwynn from the Padres' starting lineup and makes him an even more likely non-tender candidate.
The 6'6" Webb appears to be the key to the trade, Krasovic tweets. The right-hander could be a set-up man for the Fish and is not yet arbitration-eligible. Heading into the 2010 season, Baseball America rated Webb as the 24th best prospect in San Diego's system. The 24-year-old has a 94-96 mph fastball with a strong mid-80s curveball, according to the publication. In 54 big league games this year, Webb registered a 2.90 ERA with 6.7 K/9 and 2.9 BB/9.
Meanwhile, Mujica is arbitration eligible for the first time this winter. The 26-year-old hurler turned in a 3.62 ERA with 9.3 K/9 and 0.8 BB/9 across 59 games this year.
$20 says Brandon Gomes is the one going to the Marlins. maybe Anthony Bass.
A 26 year old reliever in AA for a toolsy 23 year old CFer? That would be awful for the fish.
they did just trade a 25 year old Lefty (who still has a shot to be somthing) for a nothing Special Bullpen Pitcher
That’s because Andrew Miller is a nothing starter who gets shelled in AA.
There are probably 40 moves like this per offseason where a team tries to salvage a fallen star. Nothing new, nothing special, likely a meaningless move for either team.
i disagree!
You really think Boston’s front office is that much more intelligent than the Marlin’s?
Two relievers: Ryan Webb and Edward Mujica
Is this what the Padres gave up or just your guess? If they did give up Webb and Mujica they mat not be able to deal Bell now. As Padre fan I was excited to see the Padres trying to acquire an athletic young outfielder, but for 2 very useful bullpen arms, I’m not sure I would like this deal.
Hmmm, they still have Adams, Gregerson, and Bell. They have a long history of finding solid bullpen contributors off of the scrap heap (that’s where Edward Mujica came from), and if there is one area where you shouldn’t worry about, it’s Padres and bullpens. Really. They have extra, they will always find what will work for them on the cheap. It’s the Padre way, so have faith!
The bigger question for me is if Maybin is ever going to be able to hit.
As a Padres fan I like the idea of taking a shot at Maybin, but I don’t like the deal its self. The Padres gave up way too much. As you say, the Padres now cannot afford to move Heath Bell or any other reliever. Bad deal by Hoyer. They should have been able to get Maybin for one of these guys given the state of the Marlins pen.
Too much? Middle Relief is EASILY replaceable, Mujica and Webb are two guys they can either replace for barely anything on the free agent market or internally. If I was GM, I would make this deal as well.
I’m with you. The Padres will have no trouble replacing those two. And I say that liking both of them a great deal. I’d bet they already have ’em covered, and now have Maybin.
I like this deal.
You’re not looking at the big picture. Â The Padres had a chance to trade Bell for a proven bat in the offseason, move Adams to closer, and maybe trade one more reliever to fill another opening on the roster. Â By trading Mujica AND Webb in the same deal, their pen is now thin and they can’t really afford to trade Bell.
I agree that MRP is generally expendable. Â I also agree that trading Webb or Mujica in a deal for Maybin makes sense. Â In fact, I’ve been in favor or dealing Mujica for a while. Â But by trading both in the same deal, they’re turned a surplus into a deficit and have hamstrung themselves in their ability to do other deals. Â Not to mention, Webb has future closer type stuff. Â I don’t think they got max value out of either pitcher by packaging them.
You aren’t looking far ahead enough. You are acting as if the offseason is already in the past tense, as if their turn is done and there are no more moves to make concerning the bullpen. The reality of the situation is, they can still make deals to ADD to the bullpen by both other trades and by free agency. If you look at MLBTR’s 2011 Free Agency list there are a ton of guys available there. The only way to properly judge an offseason is to actually wait until it is over.Also, you are ignoring the fact that they don’t need to necessarily go out and deal a reliever in order to improve other aspects of a team. Jed Hoyer may have his sight set on Tejada or Hudson. Patience, my friend.
Also, you dont know how many relieving prospects they have that can replace those two internally. It’s not like 6th/trash inning work is high leverage. It may not necessarily be a deficit, it may be just a smaller surplus.
Hudson would make a great 1 or 2 year stop over until Cumberland or Antonelli are ready. I agree that the Padres have only reduced their surplus. Plenty of bullpen pieces still.
You weren’t going to get a proven bat for Bell. The rest of this is hard to argue with, though.
I disagree. Â Someone would have given up a solid piece for Heath Bell. Â He’s a proven closer coming off a 40+ save season. Â He’s at peak value right now and there are teams in need of closers.
I’m not saying they’re going to trade him for Ryan Braun. Â I’m just saying they can upgrade over what they had at 2B, SS or in the OF by trading him. Â Maybe something along the lines of a Howie Kendrick at 2B or something.
I disagree Gaslamp. The Padre’s were not going to have a place for Mujica next year, too many other good relievers. Now Webb on the other hand was a valuable young piece imo. The Padres do have Perdomo, DeMark, Inman [might convert to relief pitcher], Gomes, Scribner, Italiano, Brach, plus a few others within two years who have shown very good promise out of the pen. The Padres can still trade Bell for a decent stick. I would still see what Clayton Richard would bring in the form of a good bat. I am not happy at all with the Padres going with Ludwick in the OF at PETCO. I think that will be a huge mistake and is a main contributor to the reason the Padres lost to the Giants. As soon as Ludwick came into the lineup, it changed the dynamic of the Padres team just enough [the Padres always lived on the edge anyway] to make them lose.
I have no qualms with trading Mujica. Â Trading Mujica and Webb in the same deal was a mistake. Â It’s hard to count on all those kids to come up a fill a role. Â Had they traded say, Webb and Bell in separate deals, they had enough of a surplus to be able to fill their roles without digging too deep into to farm system. Â If they trade Mujica, Webb and Bell, they will be thin.
I still disagree with your take on Ludwick. Â The guy can hit, I think he put too much pressure on himself. Â They have no other options with the ability to hit for the power he’s capable of hitting for. Â He wasn’t the reason they lost to the Giants – there were six other guys in the lineup who all stopped hitting at the same time. Â It’s not fair to lay the blame on Luddy.
I REALLY disagree with trading Richard. Â The Padres are thin sans Garland, trading Richard would completely dismantle their staff. Â We already appear to be headed toward a season of relying on LeBlanc in the rotation, we’d be dead in the water if we had to replace Garland and Richard. Â And that says nothing of whether they bring back CY. Â You just don’t ship off young lefites in their prime when they have Richard’s type of stuff. Â He’s going to continue to improve.
Either way, I’m glad we won’t be forced to watch Gwynn flare out to the SS anymore.
Or Webb and Mujica? Wow. Thats a ton going to the Marlins! Ryan Webb is awesome he throws extremely hard and has an awesome sinker…Mujica I like a lot as well. The Marlins just got two power arms who were keys to the Padres pen in ’10…Nice!
Who’s saying that they acquired Webb and Mujica? I haven’t seen that anywhere. If that is the case though… Wow. Lol
Tom Krasovic reported…Luke will post it in a sec.
And since it is the case, the Marlins totally won this trade!!!! Ryan Webb is the greatest thing since sliced bread!
As a padres fan, I am glad they got rid of Mujica. Looking over his stats is one thing, watching him for a whole season is another thing. For me, it just seemed like every time mujica came in during a close game, he gave up a homer. He seemed to thrive in blow out games though. Now webb, that’s a tougher pill to swallow. No worries, Frieri should fill the void and the padres pen won’t miss a beat. And we got the CF we were looking for. Good trade overall for both sides.
He seemed to thrive in blow out games though.
It just seems that way. The whole “pitchers thrive in pressureless situations” is total BS. All players are under pressure to perform, and have been under pressure their whole pro career to get this far. It’s just a myth someone created to explain it.
I’m guessing you never watched mujica pitch. We’re talking about a guy that would come in during a close game and give up the tater, making a comeback more improbable, or would either come in relief in a blowout game and strikeout 3-5 hitters in 2 innings. I know is K-walk ratio is impressive, but his homeruns given up can come back and bite you.
Marlins are a scary team to watch next year…you have two young bullpens in Atlanta and Florida the East should see a good fight between 3 teams. Not too mention that the Marlins also have Stanton for the whole year with Hanley, Sanchez, and possibly Uggla yep the East will definitely be interesting.
I say possibly Uggla because he might be traded…a trade for Rasmus not a bad idea. Although if the Cardinals were to sign Uggla long term it might get in the way of their contract situation with their other players. Correct me if I’m wrong since I don’t follow the Cardinals closely.
Yeah, Uggla is not going to get you Rasmus. While he would upgrade 2B for the Cardinals, he’ll be a free agent next year. Why would they Cardinals trade a 5-tool, core player, young, cost controlled CF for a rent-a-player?
the term “5-tool” gets tossed around very loosely these days
Nevermind. Just came up in the post for me. Haha. That’s a steal for the Fish. Don’t like the deal from a Padres perspective.
Jeez that Marlin bullpen just got better
As a Giants fan seeing those two the last couple seasons I can attest to their effectiveness.
Absolutley…A ton better!!!
This also shows the confidence that the Padres have in Frieri…
But Sanches, Nunez (possibly), Mujica (underrated), Webb, the Hopper, Veras, Hensley…I very much likes.
Mujica is garbage. Webb has a ton of potential, though. Hate to see him go, but love picking up Maybin.
I don’t see how a reliever with a sub 1 WHIP is garbage.
I’m with YourThird…..Mujica was not consistent enough. Waaaay to many homeruns given up. But he has decent stuff. Stats are not everything. Coming from a Padres fan that saw 95% of the games this past season.
Given the fact that he walked less than 1 batter per 9 and struck out 9.30 per 9, I’d say he was consistant in 2010.
Like I said before, stats aren’t everything. Ask any other Padres fan whether they held their breath when mujica was brought in relief during a close game. A high percentage will certainly agree. I’m not saying he was terrible, he was great at striking out hitters, but those games he lost because of the long ball really stick out.
I’m almost as big a stat guy as there is. But Mujica really isn’t that good. You’ll see next season. I really don’t know how to explain it. Webb is a nice arm though. But SD has about 5 or 6 guys vying for bp spots so cutting out Webb and Mujica was an easy choice probably for a great fielding, and potentially really solid hitting, center fielder. Even if at his 2010 line he represents an upgrade for SD. Remember we had TG out there. Aye..
Everyone loves Mujica’s stats, they’re tremendous. But if you actually have to watch him for an entire year, he’ll make you tear your hair out. He’ll dominate when the game is out of hand, then give up a three run homer when you’re up 2. Webb is by far the better pitcher, he’ll dominate opposing batters for you. He does give up a ton of infield hits with that nasty sinker though.
Mujica may have been tough to watch, but he is an absolute upgrade to what the marlins had to deal with last year. i will happily welcome him to our bullpen.
There actually is Marlins fans? I thought they were a myth.
When you can’t find anything valuable to add to the convo, make old attendance jokes.
But you have to admit it was funny!
Ugh, it gets old. Then the marlins start winning and shutting people up.
Mujica is not garbage; however, he is a guy you have to watch pitch over a season. You can not just go by the guys stats and say he is a good relief pitcher. That being said, Mujica does have good stuff, he just makes too many mistakes and is prone to give up the long ball on a consistent basis. He lost at least 3-4 games last year that the Padres should have won because he gave up the long ball.
Mujica is not garbage. He was the victim of bad luck HR/flyball ratio. He is however, replaceable. I like Webbs potential as an 8th inning guy or possibly even a closer.
Mujica was not the victim of bad luck lol. He was the victim of pitched balls left out over the plate lol.
agreed.
you can’t blame the moon shots he gives up on bad luck. he has good stuff but tends to leak over the plate far too often. webb is a stud
“a ton going to the Marlins”
Middle Relief help is always available, and if you just traded a 23 year old OFer for some, I gotta give the deal to the Padres.
Webb will instanty become one of the best relievers on the Marlins. As for your assertion that middle relief is “always” available, ask the diamondbacks if webb and mujica would have made a difference on their team this year.
2 things:1) Just because Byrnes didn’t make the necessary moves to improve the bullpen in the offseason, doesn’t mean the opportunities to acquire those pieces weren’t available.2) Middle Relief =/= Back End Relief. The diamondbacks kept blowing games because they didn’t have anyone who could step in high leverage situations. The diamondback relievers who might have found success in the same roles as Mujica/Webb (Gutierrez) weren’t cut out to be closers and setup men and were thrusted into those roles. Therefore, they failed. This is a discussion about 5th/6th/trash inning relievers which Webb and Mujica were.
EDIT: After further analysis I found two things. Juan Gutierrez had a leverage index of 1.43 when he entered the game, Aaron Heilman: 1.33, Chad Qualls: 1.08
Edward Mujica? 0.58. Ryan Webb? 0.88.
It’s apples to oranges, man.
So, are you saying Byrnes was incompetent? He may have been.
Also, Webb and Mujica were only 6th inning and game in hand relievers because of how great the bullpen of the Padres is for late inning relief. Just because Cole Hamels was the 3rd starting pitcher amongst halladay and oswalt doesnt mean he is a “middle of the rotation starter”.
You are missing my point here.1) I’m saying that Byrnes, pre-season, thought his bullpen was much better than actually ended up becoming2) It is not at ALL like starting rotations because each stater has their own independent game. Again, its apples to oranges. No matter when a starter starts, the leverage of the situation is exactly the same. This is not the case for relievers because certain relievers cannot perform in high leverage situations such as in the case of Gutierrez, but he is still viable to pitch in middle relief. Mujica/Webb had good numbers last year, but again, those were only in middle relief as well. You never saw them enter a game in the 8th inning with 2 outs and down by one. You don’t know how they’d pitch in that situation. Juan Gutierrez, on the other hand, was placed into that situation and failed, but Mujica/Webb are still judged as middle inning relievers because they have never pitched in a situation with meaningful leverage. That’s what makes it an irrelevant comparison.
I get your point. Webb did pitch in some close games late in the season. He also has the stuff of a late inning guy and the Padres believed he was mentally tough. He proved it by changing his throwing angle and succeeded quickly. I actually dont have a problem with this trade because the Padres can easily replace these two. I just disagree with your analysis that Webb is middle relief. Only time will tell as Webb will likely get the opp to be 7th/8th/9th now.
My point isn’t that Webb is permanently a middle reliever, its that his role on the Padres was middle relief, and that is the only role that needs to be replaced.
“Webb was 3-1 with a 2.90 ERA in 59 frames for the Padres and earned important innings late in the season.” This is from Corey Brock, the Padres blogger and writer on MLB.com.
Talk about selling low. I’m not sure how I feel about trading a 23 year with a plus glove and plus speed.
Really like this move for the Padres kid just needed a change of scenery look for him to have a big year next year
I like this deal as well; however, if Maybin can not hit in the National League East parks, he is really going to have a difficult time playing in the cavernous National League West. That being said, the Padres really needed a Center Fielder. I was hoping for Ellsbury. I do not think that Agon or Bell are going anywhere now. If the Padres could pick up Orlando Hudson for second base, they would have added even more speed to their lineup.
When a player moves to Petco (and the NL West in general) it’s of greater concern if said player is more of a power hitter, which Maybin is not and has never really been. I think that if Maybin can hit something near .270/.340/.395 in ’11 then the Padres will be happy with this trade.
I like the return but CF is now vacant.
Dan Uggla for Trayvon Robinson and Allen Webster? #Justsaying
I don’t think the Marlins and Dodgers match up very well for an Uggla deal.
Dan Uggla to the Twins for Anthony Slama and Ben Revere, and Matt Tolbert? Leo Nunez for Ben Revere?
Can’t see the Twins being interested in trading Ben Revere either, though, I think Dan Uggla may be a point of interest for them. I really think that the Red Sox are going to wait and see what happens with Beltre. If they can’t grab him, they may be interested in plugging in Uggla at third, and he’s got a swing that would work well in Fenway.
Absolutley. I know your a Phils fan, but what do you think about Polanco for Pap?
You’re kidding right?
Hahaha. The deal that Greg made on Hot Stove? Wouldn’t be a fan of that deal. While I think that Pap may completely dominate the National League, he’s not the kind of character the Phils like bringing into the clubhouse, and he’s going to cost a fortune. I’ll cross my fingers and hope Lidge has turned a corner, yet again, and go from there. Polanco is one of the most clutch hitters in baseball, and he’s shown that he can be an outstanding third baseman. I think that losing Polanco would hurt the Phillies more than acquiring Pap would help. Plus, they’d be losing yet another right handed bat with no immediate replacement to step in.
Yeah Greg is funny
Yeah he’s one of my favorite hosts. Cracks me up. Lmao
I may be wrong but I think that if the Sox can’t/don’t resign Beltre they’ll move Youk to third and do something at first whether it be a trade for Agon/Fielder or a fill-in until next offseason when the big name first basemen hit free agency.
Trade uggla for Rasmus. or not. bullpen petty much solved though.
Uggla will not get you Rasmus. You’d have to add in a lot more to get him.
No chance. If Uggla comes to STL for Rasmus, GM Mozeliak better get in his car and drive as fast as he can out of St. Louis.
“#Marlins with the Maybin to Padres deal being finalized, Marlins will give Scott Cousins a strong look in CF” – Joe Frisaro:
twitter.com/JoeFrisaro/status/3557794280116224
Naw man….. Dan Uggla can play it
Wow, those two relievers look like they could be pretty good…but just two relievers? Really? Would have thought it’d take some prospect to get the deal done as well.
Webb is a typical 96-99 hard throwing late inning reliever…Those don’t grow on trees…Especially palm trees.
Actually, they pretty much do
…Mujica is..bizzare.
2010: 9.30 k/9, .78 BB/9, 1.81 HR/9.
That’s right. 1.81 HR/9 in Petco. I’m so confused. I can only assume Mujica needs a pitching style adjustment. Be willing to give up some walks or he’ll end up giving up 2.50 HR/9.
Other than that, I would definitely want Maybin over 2 relievers. Mujica is arb1 in 2011 too.
In nearly 70 innings his SO/BB ratio was 12. TWELVE. You can’t peg a guy for striking out more than 9 an inning and, me assuming, that the guy gives up home runs on decent pitches. Junkballers don’t K/9 9.30.
Blowing games is also a myth. It just seems like he sucks because a team gets lucky. Just saying.
But I’ll admit that those SO/BB numbers were possibly inflated because the year before it was a decent 4.00, but he did start 4 games for what it’s worth. People will have a better understanding about his talent next year.
How is the other team taking the lead “lucky”? Is everything on offense now attributed to luck? It’s really getting out of hand. Why even play the game any more, just flip coins and see who wins.
Blowing games is no myth, I watched him blow games myself lol.
The Padres made a great deal here. A potential 5-tool outfielder, for a middle and back of the bullpen reliever.
The Padres bullpen core is Stauffer, Gregerson, Adams and Thatcher, so it won’t be too hard to replace Mujica and Webb. The Marlins gain two much needed relievers, but I don’t see how this effects their outfield situation. Stanton and Morrison have the corners, so who gets the middle?
I think Stauffer will be in the rotation next year and you forgot about Frieri. I wouldn’t mind the Padres signing Zavada for a second lefty out of the pen.
I think Adam Russell and Ernesto Friero will adequatley replace Webb and Mujica.
Interesting that the Marlins have now acquired three relievers in the past 24 hours. Definitely makes you think Leo Nunez is a trade candidate this off-season.
Leo Nunez was really thrown under the bus…He has great stuff but they over used him in my opinion…I really see him dominating in ’11…I could see the Orioles, Jays, Nationals, Yankees, Mets, Royals, Astros, Rockies, Mariners, Cubs, Brewers, Twins, Reds, Pirates, and A’s, Dodgers, and Cardinals being interested…Say for example…
Ben Revere for Leo Nunez…I’d do that…It also fills the void in CF.
I agree with you that the Marlins misused and overused Nunez last season.
He’s a prime candidate to have a bounce back season and a dominant one. Man, he would have looked good in a Padres uniform. Whatever. Now I see him as a perfect fit for the Mets.
I seriously could see 25 teams in on him. The circumstances are that interesting.
I like his trade! also now could Maybin and ony JR be in a platoon in leadoff???
This is an absolute STEAL for the padres. The bullpen won’t miss a beat. Webb will be very good and Mujica is very inconsistant but Maybin could be great.
Wow, the Pads got Maybin cheap. I like Webb, and have him in a few sim leagues, but if Maybin blossoms into a Granderson-type, getting him for two middle relievers is a steal.
Non closing relievers….are just relievers.
You trade two of them 10 times out of 10 for a potential all-star CF, who is already ++ with the glove.
Would have like the Jays to trade two of their surplus arms for Maybin and stick him as their 4th OF and see if he develops.
Getting to the closer was one of the toughest things for Marlins last year. This should improve it. I don’t think many people realize that.
Tony Gwynn non-tender anyone?
No way. The Padres are drawing about 3800 fans a game who actually think that that Tony Gwynn is the Hall of Famer Tony Gwynn. If they non-tender or release him, they won’t be able to trick those 3800 fans into coming to the stadium unless they can find a guy named Ozzie Smith, Dave Winfield, or Trevor Hoffman (wait a minute, they actually could sign an MLBer named that – did they just clear some space in their bullpen to bring Hoffman back for a swan song of Hell’s Bells?).
And that makes Gwynn’s days in San Diego numbered
no way the padres release Tony Jr, He means to much to the fans, and he is a solid OF that is still really young himself. Losing Webb will hurt, anytime you lose a guy that throws in the high 90’s it will hurt. But Marlins fans have to remember that stats look better at petco than other parks. Majica gives up to many HR’s and that will only increase leaving petco.
Could be Denorfia’s days are numbered. Keep the lefty with better speed and defense and pass on the 30+ year old awkward righty.
Padres fan here. Echoing others about Webb…tough loss, no doubt about it. Mujica was indeed great with nothing at steak…trailing big or big lead he was dynamite. Put him in with game on the line and pow goes the baseball. Lots of HRs surrendered in tight situations. He was well-known as a gopher-ball pitcher to Padres fans.
Two decent relievers for a one dimension player, and on paper, Marlins won this trade. Maybin is good in CF, except for 2010. He plays one position, and he doesn’t provide anything on the offense. Webb and Mujica also provides more as relievers than Maybin offered as a Marlin.
Yeah that made no sense. It may have something to do with the absurd lack of grammar. But hey, like most CFers, Maybin would be more than competent in RF and LF, thus actually playing there positions. Maybin’s an offensive prospect, having the potential to hit for average, as well as hit for modest power. Just because he hasn’t yet doesn’t mean he won’t. And I don’t really care what Maybin offered as a Marlin. What’s he going to offer in the future?
Agreed. Maybin has only the equivalant of about 1 season of MLB at bats. Another full year should tell us something.
Sorry that no one can be always perfect on typing. Maybin might be good in RF, but his numbers are horrible in LF. Maybe Maybin might be an offensive player in 2011, but 2007 through 2010, his numbers are not that impressive. He might be good in the future, but right now, Marlins won this trade on paper.
And after the way Beinfest put together last year’s BP, this is nice to see. Instead of giving every burnout a ST invite.
I like the potential of Cameron Maybin, but Ryan Webb is just awesome :, i’m 50/50 on this one.
Frieri is just as awesome. I also think Adam Russell will be very good if he works out his control issues, and they are not that bad now.
Russell has enjoyed decent success at the MLB level for the Padres. I think Russell will tuck in nicely where Mujica was and Frieri will do just fine slotted into Webbs place. If the Padres still want to trade Bell, I think the relief core in the Padre organization is deep enough to absorb it. A bullpen of Adams, Greggerson, Freri, Thatcher, Russell, Perdomo, and possibly Simon Castro [could be the long man just like Stauffer was in 2010. This would be a great way to ease Castro into the major leagues and continue his development with Buddy Black and Darren Balsey coaching him].
at least the marlins aren’t just saying their going to fix their bullpen this year, they are doing it.
This trade doesn’t speak much for Maybin’s stock. The Marlins can only get the Padres’ 5th- and 6th-best righthanded bullpen arms for what was a Baseball America Top 10 prospect in 2007, 2008, and 2009.
This is an enormous mistake by the Padres. Rather than trading arms from the back end of their bullpen for yet another defense-speed guy who can’t hit, they should be trading arms from the front end of their bullpen (where they are exceptionally deep in closers to potential closers) for offense-biased players. The Padres front office is extremely naive if they think they can contend again in 2011 with the type of club they put on the field in 2010.
Or you can look at as the Padres probably are, and wonder what the heck did the Marlins do to him?
I doubt that the Padres are done at this point. Keep in mind that power doesn’t play the same way in Petco as it does in other parks. Speed, speedy gap hitters, and gap hitters are about all that works for them. They can go after all the power they want, and then sit back and watch it all die on the warning track.
I agree. The idea of putting a team based around speed, defense, and pitching is the only way the Padres can contend.
Maybin is already an offensive upgrade to T Gwynn Jr. If Maybins defense is good, this could actually be an improvement in CF.
Maybin’s defense is just as good as his bat, don’t worry. He’ll be the star of your Triple A team!
What I find amazing is that just 1 year ago, fish fans wouldnt even consider trading Maybin for Heath Bell.
Not true, I was eager to see this day come after the Maybin failure in 2008.
You hit the nail on the head my man. Now if the Padres could deal Bell for Upton, my off season would be complete. They don’t need power hitters. They need guys who can run the ball down in the outfield and when they get on base, run. The price was steep, but if maybin can realize even 3/4 of his potential, this will be a good deal for the Padres.
I’m from the school that you don’t go out of your way to tailor your team to your ballpark when it is somewhat quirky (a la Petco), as half of your games aren’t played there (yes, I know the Padres home and road records were identical in 2010). Instead, you construct a team that can win in any ballpark if your aim is to win championships.
Yes, the Padres do play half of their games elsewhere. Your speed guys work fine anywhere. Your speedy gap hitters are still going to drop hits in on the road. Your gap hitters are going to hit some out. It sure doesn’t mean these guys can’t PLAY anywhere else, just that they CAN play at Petco.
Since you play 81 of your games at home, I think it’s smart to make use of players that fit your park.
To a point the strategy does makes sense, but there’s also such a thing as taking it too far, which is where I feel the Padres have gone with their OF especially.
I’m looking at this deal a little differently now than most, as I wouldn’t be surprised to see Maybin open the year at Tucson and for Trevor Hoffman to wind up the bullpen given the space that was just created at the tail end by moving both Webb and Mujica.
Man, I would love for Trevor Hoffman to retire a Padre. That gesture would probably cost them way too much money for it to realistically happen.
Bleh, as a padres fan I don’t think I like this trade. Maybe if Maybin were a bit more proven. Webb has closer quality stuff. Great movement on his fastball. Mujica I am lukewarm on, though he does have an insane K/BB ratio.
If we were going to trade Webb I think I’d rather it was for a SS or 2B. Now there is no way we can trade Bell this offseason to fill those needs because it leaves our BP too thin. On top of that we are stuck with Bell’s likely 7 million this year which gives us little payroll flexibility. We’ll have about 10-13 million to spend on a 2b, SS, SP, and back up Catcher.
Now I really don’t know what trade chips we have that I’m willing to part with and free agency is a little thin at 2b/SS.
Padres should bring back Tejada and sign Orlando Hudson.
Webb has closer like stuff, but Bud Black stresses throwing strikes and Webb struggled with this at times and once Frieri came up Black seemed to fall in love with him cause that’s all that guy does is throw strikes. Padres can’t trade Bell now though, but they should be fine. Getting Cameron Maybin is exciting could end up being very similar to the deal they made with the Rangers a couple of years ago that enabled them to acquire a former top prospect that was still young but whom they had seemingly given up on.
Termel Sledge?
Why couldnt the pads trade bell, Adams can close no problem. Bell and AGon are both gone. No way the pads can cover the salaries, and get the other pieces they need.
The bullpen which was a team strength last year would potentially become thin of Bell is traded especially if Adams gets hurt which is highly probable.
Yeah, hopefully a contender really needs a closer at the deadline next year and we can get something for Bell. Also I hope the Pads buyout Adams last 2 years this offseason for something like 2.5mil each season or he could be getting a hefty arb raise post 2011 if he closes for half a year.
Adrian Gonzalez?
Good point.
Good point. Fans liked Aki but the Padres clearly won that trade. From the Padres perspective they can replace webb and mujica easily in house. This is sort of like gambling with house money.
A good trade benefits each team … this might well be a good trade.
Maybin sucks. Sorry folks, for a guy who’s that close to arb, you want to see a 1 WAR season somewhere (I’m using FG). Padres got fleeced, and it’s REALLY hard to get fleeced in a trade in which you’re only giving up relief pitching.
He’s not arb eligible until 2013 right? He’s got a ton of upside, hopefully it pans out. Certainly an improvement in CF for the Pads. Even as bad as Maybin hit last year it was still better than Gwynn and Maybin has a lot more upside.
No. He’s arb eligible now, actually, if Cot’s Baseball Contracts is to be trusted.
Weird baseball reference has him as arb eligible in 2013. Cot’s has him eligible this year in one spot, but another list of 2011 arb eligibles doesn’t list him. Traderumors didn’t list him in their Marlins arb eligibles post either. Perhaps it’s 2012 and not 2013, but I don’t think he is arb eligible this year.
so with CF open does that mean coglan goes to center? Because matt dominguez is the marlins up and coming 3rd baseman. I would perfer to see stanton in center because of his wide reciver past in college. also lomo looks pretty solid in left. Thoughts???
looks to be scott cousins in center. a decent fielder, below avg. bat.
Should’ve just brought back Kiko Calero! 🙂
I’m not sure how Coghlan would do in center but he adjusted very well to left field. Not sure if that’s what the Marlins are planning on doing. Also, I hope they fill their void at catcher with a trade rather than signing a free agent.
Coghlan in CF would be a horrendous experiment.
agreed and I think either Peterson/Cousins will platoon in a defense-first outfield…Or maybe another trade in the works sometime soon? I could see the Marlins trying to acquire a leadoff hitter or number 2 hitter…Maybe someone like Ben Revere, Trayvon Robinson, Jarrod Dyson, or Angel Pagan.
you don’t think cogz could be the leadoff? he was before getting hurt.
I said revere in the leadoff OR batting second. I think Cogz is a fine leadoff hitter.
i was asking not critiquing.
IF Maybin clicks, it is a steal for the Padres. Don’t like seeing 92 strike outs in 291 ABs. The OBP is very low at .302. Being a right hand hitter, his power will be ok at Petco. He will probably challenge or has already pushed out Tony Jr from center. Webb looked like he was putting it together. Agree with a previous post, they probably will not move Bell now. Hate to see Fieri go if he subs for Webb, I think he did well in the short time he was here. I applaud Jed.
Since the day I saw him hit the majors with Detroit I’ve been underwhelmed by Cameron Maybin. That being said the Padres need any bat they can get. I’m just not sure Maybin will bring one with him.
Two former Marlins are 2010 playoff MVP’s. Maybin can possibly be one also.
There goes the Ellsbury to the Padres rediculous trade for AGon rumors…
you watch your mouth….ells is going to play left! or maybe 2nd or 3rd! ahhh who am i kidding, this just ruined all hope in getting agon…..thanks again for not pulling the trigger THEO.
Ellsbury wasn’t going to get traded there anyway. He’s to important to the sox lineup, he’s fast, terrific leadoff hitter, excellent defender.
there was no trigger to pull….
i was kinda joking but there was def a trigger to pull.
Kelley
Buchholz
Rizzo
Iglesias
Ellsbury
Lowrie
Bard
There more than enough there to offer the pads for agon and they would have accepted. Point is a trade could have been made. Obviously that is way too much but it could have went down if Theo really wanted him.
Well there’s always a “sell the farm” trigger but Theo would probably be one of the last GMs to do so.
ya the conversation would have gone like thisTheo: so yes we would love to make adrain a part of our teamHoyer: well it’s gunna cost you KelleyBuchholzRizzoIglesiasEllsburyLowrieBard Epstein: (shocked silence) OVER MY DEAD BODY!!!
Freiri and Radhames Liz will be the next bullpen surprise next year, the Padres knows exactly what they are doing.
Terrible deal for the Padres. Maybin’s going to have trouble hitting well at Petco and doesn’t hit good pitching.
Maybin never was a real power hitter so Petco isn’t really going to limit his “base hitting” ability.
Yeah I know. Just don’t understand why they got him then because 8 in 80 translates to 16 in a full season which is pretty good for a CF and an upgrade for the Padres except for the fact he will now be hitting in Petco Park like I said.
Tigers officially traded the Marlins a gift basket for Cabrera.
No, in hindsight, that deal’s now more like “If you take Dontrelle Willis and his contract, we’ll let you have Miguel Cabrera and his contract.”
not really. The tigers where the ones that gave Willis the awful extension, so in general, everyone fleeced themselves.
That’s true, but Willis’ contract was already bad pre-extension. Surely what Loria was set to pay those 2 guys factored into the decision to make the trade.
Not really because Dontrelles contract was in its final year I believe. DD signed him to 3 year 33 million dollar extension after the trade.
Gift basket full of Burke Badenhop lol. Been the only bright spot of the trade.
I don’t think this was a good deal for the Padres. I’m not a fan of Maybin at all, but maybe if given the time and with good coaching he could improve. They only gave up two bullpen arms, probably could have just given up one, but a team with an already lacking offense probably shouldn’t waste their time with Maybin.
Absolutely love this trade! This kid is 23 years old and hasn’t even had a full MLB season. His numbers through his first 548 AB’s are better than anything the Padres could have put in CF and he’s a good defender. What are the chances Maybin’s bat doesn’t get any better at only 23 years old? Mujica is nothing special. Webb is a tough loss, but he can be wild, and was our 4th or 5th best reliever.
He hasn’t had a full season cause he can’t hold down a ML spot. See April ’09 and May ’10 stats. He was given chances.
Two months isn’t being given a chance. Put him in CF for the entire year and see what happens. He hasn’t been given that chance yet. Derek Lee is the perfect example.
He’s been given plenty of chances. 200 ABs in 54 games. This was after he started poorly in the beginning of 09, was sent down and then all we heard was OMG MAYBIN IS TEARING UP TRIPLE A, so he was called back up and promptly struggled in the OF and went back to hitting .230 – .250 (after hitting something like .330 in AAA). Same thing last season. Sucked hard in the beginning of the season, sent down, tore up AAA and then met big league pitching again. He’s out of options so the Padres are stuck with having him work or losing him. The Marlins in 2009 couldn’t keep a struggling guy like him on the field, they were a good/solid team that was in playoff contention until the end.
Maybin is a risk the Padres are able to take. Low risk, possibly high reward.
This is the most amazing news I’ve had as a Marlins fan in a long time. Miller and Maybin gone, I’m speechless. I’m sure Cousins will get a strong look for CF.
I like this trade for the padres, Maybin is still 23, not quiet a bust. Plus go easy on the relievers, Mujica has been moved around a bit, and for Webb, see Cla Meredith, im not saying they are comparable, but he kinda proves relievers can be better then they seem at petco
Truth from a padre fan:
Ryan Webb is legitimate. The Fish wouldn’t go wrong making him their closer but they’ll probably be best letting him set-up and sometimes throw the 7th as well. Probably a top 20 middle reliever in baseball.
Mujica: His numbers were above average, and it’s possible he puts up great number for the Fish; but I am glad he is gone. Seriously, if the team DFA’d him and replaced him with someone from within I would’ve been happy because they have at least 4 internal options that are better than him. He also sucks in pressure situations and was absolute garbage for the pads every time they counted on him.
Padre minor league bullpen replacements.
Russel: pitched some last year, some fans think he can close; probably just average in my opinion. He’s not even a top 5 pad prospect reliever to me now.
Freri: Got called up last year; gets zero national attention but really excited padre fans. Was the teams minor league pitcher of the year in AA as a starter. Last year he exceled in AAA as a closer and dominated in the majors when he was called up.
Brach: Has led his league in saves the last 2 years and his numbers are phenomenal. Should be the AA closer in 11 and possible replacement to Heath Bell.
Gomes: another relief pitcher who’s excelled and is close to being ready.
Scribner: A pitcher that I think is ready and one of my personal favorites.
Frieri, Scribner, Brach, and Webb all have a chance at being great imo. All the other pitchers I discussed are or should be average RP.
Maybin: we are all familiar with him but the jury is still out. It will be interesting to see how he does in a new environment with new coaches and instructions.
I think this trade can favor both teams if Maybin pans out because the padres traded from one of their strengths.
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As a Sox fan I have to say this sounds a little like a Theo type of deal, buying low on a guy who was supposed to have great potential. It could also be part of the means to another end if you know what I mean, just kinda have to wait and see.
Will Venable plays CF for the Padres.
Just put Uggla out in CF.
The marlins got rid of cody ross because they had maybin. Now they get rid of maybin. Wow! Good pickup for the Marlins in an area where they needed help.
I know the Padres are good at getting and developing bullpen arms, but why would they trade two dependable pieces from last years pen if they’re going to try to trade Bell?
this is the start they going to trade Bell and Gonzo before start next season you’ll see it’s what’s I think.
on what basis? they had a surplus of relievers and a need in CF so they filled it, im fine with it. What would signal geting rid of bell or gonzo would be trading for a Closer or a 1b. your logic is flawed.
we don’t have 2b ss cf and catcher.
actually we have our CF now, and your statment about what we didnt have was true before todays trade. So it still doesnt push towards us signaling other trades to get those players. Maybe if we traded for a 1b today or traded away other positions that could be filled by a big trade then yes, but we dealt from a surplus to fill a hole not to backup people we traded away. Logic isnt difficult, you are concluding because we made trades that that means we are ready to make more.
logic is, we don’t have the money we don’t have the players to compete be realistic last year was magic, this year I don’t think so not even with Gonzo and Bell.
this move stinks. still not a power bat.
I feel like we all need to give Maybin a chance to see what he can do. Not sure what his struggles are in the mlb other than his ko rate but he has a great minor league pedigree (.306/.393/.478), decent AAA numbers despite only 428 AB (.325/.401/.477) and only a small sample size in the majors (548 AB, a slash of .246/.313/.380 w/ 24 dbls, 5 trips, 13 hrs and 19 SB over the span of 4 years. He’s never had more than 291 AB in a season so it’s hard to say he’s been given a chance to fight thru rookie struggles.
I don’t have a problem with the Padres wanting him but have a hard time thinking he couldn’t have been had for less than what they gave up ( 2 decent mlb relief pitchers).
I have to say, this is a great deal for the Fish based on Maybin’s performance since we acquired him. Maybin has been a B, B- fielder and nothing to applaud at the plate and on the basepaths. He, like Miller seemed to be over rated. The Fish have two if not a trio of future ALL STAR outfielders in Logan Morrison (stud), Mike Stanton (beyond stud), and now I assume our next center fielder; 2009 ROY Chris Coghlan. They will switch off him and Cousins at center i’m sure, and spot Bonifacio on starts as well.Webb is going to be an awesome addition to the pen. My assumption between him and Veras (and possibly Leo Nunez), their 7-8 innings should be covered pretty solid. They still need 2-3 more quality lefty spot pitchers for the lefty dominated NL East All-Star hitters. Clay Hensley can go back to his long relief role, and maybe even close like he ended 2010 (even though I don’t think he will be best here).In end, now I can’t see the fish trading Uggla unless they can get a quality catcher, closer, or lefty starter. Dominguez will probably start @ 3rd, unless they can convince Uggla or Hanley to move to third and get Renteria for his final season and stick him at second or SS.Liking the Fish for 2011-2012.
With the addition of Maybin, it’s been announced that the starting lineup should be Venable in RF, Maybin in CF, and Ludwick in LF, with Anthony Gwynn or Denorfia staying on as the fourth outfielder. Just curious, why is no one mentioning Cunningham? Is it because he still has minor league options (still grappling with the contract/relegation aspects of baseball)? In his playing time, he had an above-average offensive output with good speed and defense.
Also, what does it mean when Anthony Gwynn is non-tendered? Lastly, where does Scott Hairston factor in? I know he had an abyssmal year, but his 2010 numbers are noticably lower than his career averages, and I think the team thinks pretty highly of him.
hairston gone, gwynn deno stairs bench and durango and cunningham minors. Seems like a good move.
Much obliged. I’m liking the move, even though the Padres seemingly have a dearth of outfielders. Gonna miss Mujica and Webb, though Frieri and Russell/Liz/someone should fill in just fine.
definitely, thanks for seeing what others have been overlooking. Cant forget scribner either
What a swindle for Dave Dombrowski… Miller and Maybin were the 2 key players – not sure where the other 4 are now – for Miguel Cabrera. Even though Dontrelle didn’t work out, hindsight states that the Tigers benefited from one of the most lobsided trade since, well… Doyle Alexander for John Smoltz.
CL bell
SU luke
SU adams
MI big E
MI russell
LS thatch
LR FA
Time to bring some logic to the table. Simply put Both sides won.
Pads sold high on 2 non integral parts of the BP 1 MR and 1 Mop up guy.
Marlins sold low on someone based on potential
Maybin Is he strug right now? yeah. But he has the potential to be an impact player, which the padres dont have, they took a risk geting an potential impact player. Cant fault the Marlins for giving him up or the pads for wanting him.
Webb has sexy tangibles: movement, high velocity, tall, decent numbers
Pads didnt need him, the bullpen as crammed and he moved from AAA/SD all year. If he was legit he would have had a role. Padres didnt have time for a project reliever (mechanics yielded poor control). Sold high on him cant blame them his upside is closer or setup man
Trading Mujica was easy. LR who they got for nothing Sold high with sexy stats, 9.38K/9 decent ERA, hard thrower, nasty splitter. Much like Webb he wasnt needed. He was going to get a raise and he wasnt important in the pen, he was mop up person. Also had one of the worst stat lines, out of his 59 H this year 14 were HR. Think about that roughly 25% balls that went for Hits would leave the park. Ugly
As for people complaining the Pads should have traded Bell, demand for Bell isnt going to net you anythign right now with Closers on the market, highest value for Bell was midseason when Nats got Wilson Ramos. Price wouldnt be that good now before FA. Also it would have been dumb with Gregorson struggling and Adams has only cracked 60IP twice.
So you can now go back to bickering, but like a good trade both sides got what they needed.
If anyone cares or wants my opinion, here goes:
Cameron Maybin may or may not be a bust, but it’s far, far too early to make that deterimination. This is a guy who will be 24 for all of the 2011 season and who has a .306/.393/.478 batting line in over 1,500 minor league at-bats. His K/PA rate of 23% is admittedly a bit high, but certainly not at Deerian levels. He has walked in 12% of his PAs, which is just fine, and I’m confident the 20 HR power can materialize, though perhaps not as a Padre. It is true that he’s fared less well as a big leaguer, but this is still a top-10 draft pick with a solid minor league track record.
On the other side you have a couple solid relievers in Webb and Mujica. The Marlins had an average pen (9th in the NL in reliever ERA) in 2010, but it seems likely they will deal Leo Nunez to save money, so this will help. On the other hand, they now have a depth chart with Scott Cousins or Chris Coghlan as the starting CF, neither of whom would be an adequate defensive LEFT fielder. They need to go outside the org to upgrade that position now.
Verdict: No, I haven’t watched Maybin play as much as the Marlins have, so perhaps they know something I don’t, but a cost-controlled 23/24 year-old OF with his upside for a pair of relievers? Don’t get it AT ALL. Win for the Padres, who, even if Maybin doesn’t pan out, haven’t lost much. Webb I like a lot, but the Padres could pick up cheap relievers on a Friday night in the Gaslamp District, put Padre uniforms on them, and have a solid pen.
Terrible trade for the Padres. If Maybin can’t hit in Florida he won’t hit in San Diego. Also why trade for an outfielder? You need middle infield help. Now who are you going to trade if you can’t sign any middle infielders this offseason?
we can trade Gonzo and Bell and we will.
Im surprised the Padres are so willing to trade their two best players right after they won 90 games. Why not go for it, you guys have the pitching.
Sadly, the Padres are not yet in a stable financial position to take another run and risk Adrian walking without any compensation, or paying $7 million (roughly one-fifth/sixth of their projected budget) to their All-Star closer.
The Padres do still have the bulk of the pitching that carried them last year, but a lot of questions remain as to their effectiveness for this upcoming season. Will the Padres find suitable and cost-effective replacements for Garland and Young? Will Young return, and if so, will he be able to remain effective/injury-free? How will Stauffer hold up over the course of a whole season? Will Latos be able to avoid a late-season slump? Can Frieri effectively replace Webb’s position in the bullpen? If Bell is moved during the winter or at the deadline, can the bullpen shift up a spot (ie. Adams to closer, Gregerson to eighth inning set-up, Frieri to seventh inning set-up)?
I’m hoping the Padres can repeat some of the success of last year’s squad, but I want my expectations to remain tempered. A lot of deals happened last year that would almost be impossible to fathom with this year’s crop of free agents.
The Padres did not give up their top 3 pen arms (Bell, Adams, Gregerson) and they got a 23 soon to be 24 year old 5-tool OF with massive potential. I believe this is a deal that benefits both parties. The Padres deal from a strength, (the bullpen) and get a young controllable high ceiling player at a premium position.
Of course the jury is still out on Cameron Maybin however, I wouldn’t say Webb is exactly set in stone to close out games starting the 2011 season. Webb is not what you would call “proven” either at this point. Cameron Maybin has been one of the most highly touted players in recent years with less than 600 MLB Ab’s. Most HS players usually take a good 2,500 Ab’s to be able to fully evaluate a players potential. Right now, the Padres upgrade at CF, one of their weakness’s.
Trading from a teams strength, (pitching) for a premium position center field, (which was an obvious weakness) especially when considering you A. The Padres have massive bullpen depth which mean they were expendable, B. Can acquire a legit potential all-star in return, C. Do not have to trade your two time all-star closer, set up man or even 7th inning guy to obtain him, low risk very high reward move. Most moves in baseball are “risks”. You have to give up talent in order to receive legitimate talent. Or.. “potential”.
So, yes, I like this trade.
Mickey-
Hoyer stated that Maybin had the best defense metrics in 2010 and that it’s not even close. The pads got him for his defense and the FO wants to move Venable to a corner. Hoyer said on the radio that Venable’s defense is gold glove worthy on a corner but average to slightly above average in CF. If Maybin blossoms the deal will swing in the pads favor. If not they got a CF that can cover the ground in Petco. Either way I think Maybin will be a better hitter in Petco. The OF is huge and if you’re not a home run hitter or trying to hit home runs you can use the field to your advantage.
Webb’s career splits are ugly…
Home: .223/.263/.312 1.05 WHIP
Away: .318/.395/.426 1.81 WHIP
Viva la Petco!!
good move by the fish here. Add two very solid bullpen arms for a player that never seemed to be able to put it toge. They could trade Uggla, Coghlan/Matt Dominguez and Bryan Peterson for Colby Rasmus.
However, also not a bad move by the Padres. they got a player who has massive potential. He could hit plenty of triples and doubles in Petco and steal plenty of bases. In Florida, they weren’t able to fully utilize his speed. Interesting to see if he rebounds in Petco. They should have tried to trade Heath Bell for a bat like Howie Kendrick to fill second base though instead of 2 solid relievers
This likely means that Emilio Bonifacio starts for the fish on Opening Day.
Maybe they trade Uggla to the Dodgers for Kenley Jensen and Elbert.
I like this trade if your the padres (go Padres) lol , talk about giving up early on prospects, marlins have two world series rings though amidst the bad decisions, cleveland indians fans have a small victory on the battlefield (though the war, long over)
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