The Cardinals have removed Adam Ottavino, Nick Stavinoha, Daryl Jones, and Steve Hill from their 40-man roster according to MLB.com's Matthew Leach. All four players will now be exposed in next month's Rule 5 Draft.
Jones, 23, hit .244/.335/.361 in 518 Double-A plate appearances this year. Ottavino, 25 on Monday, made five appearances with St. Louis this year (three starts), posting a 8.46 ERA with 12 strikeouts and nine walks in 22.1 innings. Hill, 25, received just three plate appearances with the Cardinals this year, hitting a home run for his first career hit. The backstop is a .289/.341/.510 hitter in the minors. They were ranked the 4th, 11th, and 24th best prospects in the team's farm system according to Baseball America's 2010 Prospect Handbook, respectively.
Stavinoha, 28, has received 278 plate appearances with the Cards over the last three seasons, hitting .234/.256/.325 with 54 strikeouts and just seven unintentional walks. He is a .301/.345/.469 hitter in almost 1,400 Triple-A plate appearances and has experience playing both outfield corners as well as first base.
Looks like there will be some talent available via Rule 5 this season.
So, who do the Pirates take with the first pick, any favorites?
Why would they expose Ottavino to the Rule 5 draft??? He should be healthy by next season and could definitely stay on someone’s 25-man roster! I hope they know something we don’t because that could be a big loss.
Yeah I was shocked as well. Jones likely won’t get picked since he was so bad last year. And Hill is nice and probably will get picked, but not a huge loss for the Cards. Ottavino seems like an odd one, he will almost definitely be picked and should have no trouble competing for a bullpen role.
Dodgers should pick up Hill in the Rule 5 draft. Platoon him with A.J. Ellis and send Martin packing. Maybe we can still get some value out of him.
Hill has played only nine games at AAA. He was added to the 40 man and called up from AA Springfield as an emergency catcher when La Rue was kicked in to retirement by Cueto. The AAA Redbirds were out in Vegas, iirc, so they had to bring in a guy who could get there immediately.
When La Rue was eventually placed on the disabled list, they brought up Brian Anderson and only sent Hill to AAA to replace him. Otherwise he would have finished the year at AA.
I wouldn’t waste a pick on him. Furthermore, as a Cards fan, I’m glad he isn’t taking up a spot on the 40 man any longer. He could be useful eventually, but he isn’t ready yet.
yeah but he still isn’t a bad option as a Rule V catcher since most backup catchers are replacement level players, and you are going to bring in multiple catchers for ST anyways. Even if he doesn’t make the roster he only costs a team $25K ($50K if he makes it) and if he shows enough during ST he could make the team or get traded.
Agreed, I just doubt he would stick with a club all year. Some expect him to move to first base or left field at some point, in fact. So perhaps a team with a lot of holes could find enough playing time for him…
I understand not putting Hill on the 40-man roster. There’s no way he sticks with any big league club. He’s talented but his defense at catcher is not where it needs to be. He has a good bat but that’s about it. By the time he’s ready to be called up for good he may not be a catcher anymore.
can any Cards’ fans tell me a little about Ottavino’s stuff?
Heavy fastball, can consistently hit mid 90s. Decent command with it as well (effectively wild in some situations). Hangs breaking balls a little to often but they do look very sharp on occasion. Don’t know much about his off speed but his fastball alone is enough reason to take a chance. First round talent, I DON’T KNOW WHY HE IS OUT THERE. MO better know something we don’t
Mo is likely betting that the shoulder injury will concern teams enough to pass on him.
Ottavino had the torn labrum which he opted to rehab instead of surgery..Many have suggested this was a mistake. Future health of the shoulder is a concern.
very nice, how’s the movement on his fastball? does he have a change? is his breaking stuff more of a slider, curve, slurve etc.?
Teams should be all over Hill. I obviously can only go by his numbers but they look great for a young catcher.
Drafted in 2007
@ age 22 – 2007- .320/.355/.513 w/ 12 hrs in 300 AB @ A/A-
@ age 23- 2008- .293/.334/.544 w/ 17 hrs in 287 AB @ A+/AA
@ ag3 24- 2009- .282/.333/.470 w/ 19 hrs in 464 AB @ AA
@ age 25 – 2010- .271/.345/.529 w/ 24 hrs in 395 AB @ AA/AAA
His career CS% is decent @ 30%.He can play some 1B/LF/RF as well. He doesn’t walk much but doesn’t seem to strike out at an alarming rate either.
Can a St. Louis fan tell me what the knock is on this guy and why with Molina a couple of years away from FA would they let him walk?
I know the Cards have some catching depth, but it seems odd to leave him unprotected off the 40 man. I realize his upside is limited, but yeah with those numbers he looks like he can be a solid backup, with a little pop.
YOu would have to imagine they could’ve at least traded him for something at the minor lge level at least?
Or even cash considerations, they will get $50 K from Rule 5, I bet they would have gotten 4 times that or more to trade him. I’m sure plenty of teams would love to have him on their 40 man, but not on there 25 man roster, so they could have an emergency catcher in AAA.
Even if he wasn’t a catcher with questions on his defense and game-calling abilities, I don’t see how a player who hasn’t even proved he can hit in AAA yet can last a full season in the Majors
Unless Brian Anderson wins the backup catcher position, the Cardinals will be adding a catcher at some point. They just replaced Hill on the 40 man with Tony Cruz. It would be tough to carry five catchers on the roster. Hill is the most expendable.
but that’s kinda the point, I think Anderson or Hill could be the backup catcher, neither is a top prospect so its not as though they need a full season of AB’s to develop. Why waste the money and roster spot on a backup catcher, when you could actually get some production from within.
If the situation was that Anderson was still a top prospect, and you needed to develop him, then I get your thinking (though would still at least give Hill as shot at the backup role), but he’s not Anderson’s profile right now at best is backup catcher. Just seems like an odd move overall.
I’d be surprised to see Hill essentially skip AAA altogether and make the roster out of spring training, though.
Ideally, Anderson wins the the job, Hill is passed in the rule 5, and splits time behind the plate in Memphis with Cruz. Best case scenario, anyway, in my opinion.
how odd was it that pagnozzi received all the playing time he did down the stretch, and is now already a minors FA, while anderson rode the pine? was the manager blocking anderson, because he’d already determined he wants a backup from outside the org for 2011? was he limiting anderson’s exposure in sept. intentionally?
conspiracy?????
Apparently management (LaRussa) thinks differently than we do. I too would use a catcher from within. Supposedly this year, the backup will catch more due to Molina’s knees. Believe it when I see it.
I think you seriously undervalue the catching position. You really don’t want some kid that hasn’t played past Double AA handling your pitching staff. Especially if your St. Louis, since they put more responsibility on the catcher than most. It doesn’t matter to them what a catcher does offensively because they want someone with experience, that knows hitters, and knows how to makes good decisions. Catcher is not a position you can look at from a purely statistical perspective.
Cruz is likely to be a better option in the future than Hill.
Hill seems kind of “old”… kind of a slow progression through the minors when you consider he is 25 and is only now reaching AAA.
He was drafted in 2007 @ age 22. It’s not like he’s a career minor leaguer or something. And his stats have been consistantly good each year.
@ age 22 (A/A-), @ age 23 (A+/AA), @ age 24 (AA) and @ age 25 (AA/AAA)
He moves up a level every year and except for about 15 games @ AAA he performs well.
Because Molina will be a Cardinal till he dies.
I’ll say that it appears from what I’ve seen/read that Hill is still a bit of a project defensively behind the plate. He does have a decent arm, as evidenced by his CS%, but his receiving skills and understanding of the game still are developing. However, he has improved a bit since being shifted almost exclusively to the catcher position. I saw an awful lot of him when he was still in A ball and was being shuffled from position to position, but he’s had a lot of time to work since then. It’s not a stretch to say that it’s his bat that has kept him in the lineup wherever he has been – and that will likely be his ticket to any consistent time on an ML roster if it happens.
First off, I don’t think Molina is not going anywhere soon.
Hill’s main knocks against him surround his ability to call games, handle a staff, and defensively maintain himself for long stretches at a time.
His bat has always been his best asset
No I wasn’t implying that Molina was going anywhere but wouldn’t it be nice to keep good catching prospects around in case?
“Hill’s main knocks against him surround his ability to call games, handle a staff, and defensively maintain himself for long stretches at a time”.
Still sounds like something a good coaching staff could help him with.
Those are a lot of negatives, but if he can hit and throw out runners, someone’s going to try to fix some of that stuff.
See in the Cards situation, his bat being his best tool is an advantage. Most teams look to have a ‘defensive’ specialist as their backup catcher, but St. Louis was in a position to have some offensive talent for those 30+ games Molina won’t catch. And it makes even more sense considering they get A+ defense from their catcher most of the year. I know they have Anderson, but it just seems odd to lose out on cheap, young catching depth
They seem to be much higher on Bryan Anderson, particularly because he is left handed
except they don’t like his defense, and won’t give him a start behind the plate. Everyone’s saying they should have moved him to 2B years ago, because his bat is just wasting away in the minors. He’s not a big power bat, but a professional hitter for sure.
On the surface, as a Red Bird fan, its expected that your immediate reaction would be “What the hell Mo!?”But think about it, Will any team commit a spot on the 25 man roster to these guys for a whole season? Ott is coming off big surgery, and hasnt even proven he belongs in the Majors yet, it would be different if he had like 20 decent outings. Hill offers you nothing behind the plate at this point. And dj-tools is just that, alot of tools and not much else.I cant really see any team committing a 25 man roster spot to these guys, for a full season. It seems that we are just daring a team to take one, give is 50k, and then just take them back and make 25k on a guy.
Exactly. Also, if one of them does manage to stay on a roster all season, it wouldn’t be a huge loss.
Ottavino never got the surgery, he mended with rehab and was said to be ready to pitch had be been in the pennant race the last week of the season evidence of his presence in the bullpen
I can see Hill getting a spot and sticking for a full year. Especially in an organization like the Dodgers where there is a dearth of catching prospects.
Any club that’s set on their #1 catcher and looking for a backup could pick up Hill and he’d probably stick for the whole year. I don’t know if he’ll ever develop into a starting catcher, but for 25-50k a team can take that chance. Unfortunately, the Cards simply have/had too many players of his ilk to keep him on the 40 man.
I’m surprised the Cards didn’t try and trade these guys outright. Or maybe they did and we just didn’t hear about it.
Yeah, but it’s not just the $50,000 price tag for making the selection in the Rule V draft(or $25,000 if the player is returned to the original team), but also the cost of an MLB contract for the team making the selection, since the player selected must remain on the selecting teams’ 25-man(and by extension, 40-man) roster for the whole season.
Admittedly, that’s why teams participate in the draft, so that they could find someone who could fill a need on their team without a huge cost attached(as there might be in free agency), but it does cost more than just $25,000 and/or $50,000 being the point. š
Stavinoha will probably be taken by someone. He is a good platoon corner OF, and bat off the bench. A lot better than that .234 average states. One of those guys that was always the odd-man-out in the STL/Memphis shuffle.
I really hope someone takes him. Good riddance.
Good riddance indeed. Actually a lot worse than that .234 average states. TLR had a weird man crush on him only exceeded by the inexplicable Aaron Miles man crush. Mo has to get rid of those guys so that TLR can’t over-rely on them again.
stav, miles, and suppan are the same person, though, right?
Why yes, yes they are.
Yes, but sadly they took up 3 2010 MLB roster slots.
Stavinoha is actually a pretty good pinch hitter. He’ll easily be taken. Also, Miles has hit at least .263 (with a high of .317) with decent defense all 4 years he’s been with the Cardinals. What’s wrong with that for a backup middle infielder?
For a backup infielder, it’s not a problem. However, when he started 50% of the time, it became a problem.
That’s because he was hitting a lot better than Ryan; while Schumaker also took steps backwards, both offensively and defensively; Lopez was just plain awful; and similarly to Ryan, Feliz was also all glove, little bat. Did you actually want the others to get more starts this past year?
I’m surprised about a lot of these names. Admittedly I don’t know much about Tony Cruz, Adron Chambers, Adam Reifer, Blake King, or David Kopp. But we’ve been hearing about Ottavino, Jones and Hill for a while.
I think Hill would be a strong backup catcher for any club, so I wouldn’t be surprised to see him claimed quickly and stick for the whole year. Ottavino has promise, but lacks performance. He’ll get picked up too, but might not stick. Jones really tailed off last year. I don’t know if he’ll get picked up.
Stavi looks like John Gall v2.0. Incredibly strong guy, just can’t seem to put things together at MLB level. If a team’s got room for him, he’ll stick too. The Cards kept him on their 25 man pretty much all last year… Is he out of options then?
He’s spent time in St. Louis the last three seasons so I assume he is out of options.
I understand the Chambers move, he has been tearing it up in the AFL, at the plate and on the base paths.
I haven’t seen this mentioned anywhere on the site, so I’ll go ahead and say that the Reds have added the following players to the 40-man roster: Zack Cozart, Todd Frazier, Kris Negron, and Daryl Thompson.
That means the following players are available in the rule five draft: James Avery, Scott Carroll, Danny Dorn, Jerry Gil, Jeremy Horst, Jordan Hotchkiss, Jeff Jeffords, Jake Kahaulelio, Matt Klinker, Joe Krebs, Justin Lehr, and Miguel Rojas.
If I was a GM, I would definitely take Ottavino and hope for the best. His stuff is legit but he’s probably best suited for relief
These 4 guys were outrighted off the 40-man roster. Which means that they had to clear waivers. Which means that all the other teams already passed on them. Which means there’s probably very little risk of one of them actually being selected in the Rule 5 draft.
Please no one take Daryl Jones…He’s the one of the only black guys we got.
I’m no fan of affirmative action MLB style, but it would be nice to have more prominent black players in the game, especially in St. Louis. Jones has always had Crawfordesque tools, finally seemed to have put it together in ’08. One injury-plagued year and an ineffective 2010 have really dropped his stock, but his tools haven’t gone anywhere. He hasn’t shown enough to warrant a place on the 40-man, but at the same time the team that takes him has a lot of upside for minimal risk.