The Yankees always have interesting offseasons, but this one figures to have a little extra something after the Rangers massively outplayed them in the ALCS. Three of their stalwart players, not to mention the manager, are scheduled to become free agents in a few weeks. Let's round up all the news that came out of Yankeeland following last night's loss, courtesy of Chad Jennings of The Journal News, MLB.com's Bryan Hoch, Mark Feinsand and Anthony McCarron of The Daily News, Marc Carig of The Star-Ledger, and Dom Amore of The Hartford Courant (Twitter link)…
- Re-signing manager Joe Girardi is "the first order of business," said GM Brian Cashman. Cashman also said he has yet to talk to ownership, which gives you an idea of how far along (or not) they are in the process.
- Neither Mariano Rivera nor Derek Jeter would talk about their upcoming free agency after last night's loss. “This is where they belong,” said Cashman, and the general belief is that both will re-sign with the Yankees this winter.
- Andy Pettitte's decision about whether to return for another year or retire will be based solely on his family, adding that he's already accomplished everything he wanted to in his career. Cashman said that they'll give Pettitte as much time as he needs.
- Yankee starting pitchers not named CC Sabathia posted a 5.91 ERA in the second half, so Cashman unsurprisingly said that starting pitching will be a priority in the offseason. They're expected to be major players for Cliff Lee, and will likely check in on Zack Greinke.
“…after the Rangers massively outplayed them in the ALCS”
I love it!!
Considering how well the Red Sox played, I can understand your comment. Oh wait..
a little bitter are we?? maybe if the yanks bump the payroll up to $500mil they can win
Not bitter in the least bit. The Rangers are a fantastic team and they deserve every bit of the Championship. It’s stupid comments from gloating Sox fans that lack class and then you make an absurd comment about raising payroll to $500mm, which just adds to it.
geez yanks fan….take a joke.
they dont let you joke about their team
Well you know full well if the Red Sox just got owned by Texas, there would be more than enough gloating coming from Yankee fans. That’s just the way it is. And if the shoe fits, the Yankees will usually buy it.
You sound like the bitter one, man.
Can’t we put this payroll nonsense to bed already? Money doesn’t win championships in baseball. If the Rangers were all being paid their prime free agent money, their payroll would have been over $200m as well — and would still be over $200m when those players got to their downslopes. It’s about drafting talent and turning impending FAs into new talent, plain and simple. That’s why Texas is winning right now. Not because they’re scrappy low payroll underdogs.
Someone needs to get Hughes an out pitch for Christmas, though. Seriously.
Yea I know. He was a good prospect with high upside of course, and had a breakout season. The dude has an electric fastball and a great cutter but can’t control his breaking ball for his life, you can’t just live off fastballs if you’re a starter. I think Hughes should think about developing a changeup.
You are correct, money doesn’t win championships. However, money CAN get you to the playoffs year after year after year. And once you’re in the playoffs, anything can happen.
maybe 600mil?
That comment is pretty useless since the Yankees won a majority of their championships before they were a 1.5 billion dollar franchise, before George Steinbrenner bought the team.
That was also before they modified the trade rules, when the Yankees could use the A’s as a farm team.
You mean they aren’t? I thought the A’s were the Yankees PCL affiliate.
Has more to do with the payroll, and the fact that the rangers are still paying part of Aroids salary, and the yanks cant beat cliff lee so they will buy him this offseason. Its kind of ironic to me…..but i have to get my shots in on the skankees when i can.
Was anyone else upset last night when swish, whom i like, played it off as not being hit so they could score…..same thing jeter did in a sense against the rays. Just frustrating!
The fact you refer Alex as Aroids sums up your commenting credibility. What part of the Red Sox having a payroll only 10% less than the Yanks are people not understanding. As far as I am concerned, Red Sox fans have zero to add to these discussions today.
and your comments to red sox fans add tons of credibility to your comments! someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed today!
Considering the Yankees are the only team to be consistently over $200M year in a year out, so no, 10% means nothing. And this was the 1st year Boston was that high, in 2009 opening-day payroll was $121M (Cots). Boston has consistently been 3rd-5th in payroll over the years. When Boston is at $190M or $200M or above the Yankees, then you have an argument.
This offseason may be a perfect example why fans show such animosity towards the Yankees. The Yankees got owned, and will probably go on a spending spree because they can. Cliff Lee owned us? Let buy him so we don’t have to face him anymore. Carl Crawford is available? Lets get him too. Boston likes Werth? Well so do we (cha-ching). Two years ago New York committed $423M to 3 players after missing the playoffs. They could beat that number this year.
In all fairness, I respect the Yankees commitment to having the best product on the field. What I don’t respect is the shopping spree style (aka outbid the competition by $10M) to do it. And you can point fingers to Boston or the Mets or Angels all you want, but the Yankees are in a class by themselves in that regard and it’s a joke.
Couldn’t agree more. The simple fact that they will be just like a spoiled little kid who didn’t win the soap box race, they will use their unquestionably ridiculous assets and buy every potential piece they will need, and pick up extra parts to make sure that nobody else can get the leftovers to compete at the next race.
while all non yankee fans are taking their cheap shots while they can our ownership has a committment to winning every year… and you cant say the same about your teams ownership.
When comparing payrolls to performance (i.e. – Rays, Rangers) what your not looking at is the number of years they were below .500 to get top draft picks to build their minor league teams with the best players in the country.
So a better analysis is comparing other teams with an inferior payroll to the to the Yankees , but have also made the post season with the same sucess as the Yankees, thus having picked low in the draft each year.
Finally your ownership loves the baseball revenue sharing it gets from the Yankees and also when we come to your town to play it’s the only times your stadiums get sold out.
at the rest of baseball
I totally and respectfully disagree.In the infamous words of Herm Edwards “you play to win the game”. Are you implying that teams don’t come into spring training with a goal of making the playoffs? How many people gave the Texas Rangers a chance this year? NO ONE. The Angels and Mariners (w/ Lee and Felix) were the favorites to win the West. So that is a very poor assumption on your part that other ownerships are not committed to winning. A commitment isn’t demonstrated just by throwing money around and having a high payroll.I’m not sure where you’re going with your 2nd and 3rd paragraphs. Teams develop young players because in smaller markets, with smaller funds to allocated to player payroll, they’re required to focus on player development to discover young talent. Tampa is a perfect example. They will lose Carl Crawford this year, but have developed a young Desmond Jennings to take CC’s place. So Tampa has to depend on player development to a very large degree in order to stay competitive. As I stated above, high payroll doesn’t guarantee a World Series Championship, but it does increase likelihood of annual playoff appearances, which in the playoffs anything can happen. Revenue sharing and luxury tax (ie high payroll tax) are two separate issues. Revenue sharing is more from television deals, merchandise, ect., basically an attempt to level the field in terms of baseball market size. If not for this, the competitive balance in baseball would be totally out of wack. The luxury tax is what is payed by the Yankees for going over the $170M payroll threshold. This system has been in place for 7 years and does not do as much as you think. In 2009 the Yankees had to pay $25M that was distributed to smaller market teams. What does that come out to? Maybe $2M? How many free agents will that pay for? According to Baseball America, the Yankees have paid $174M in luxury tax over the past 7 years (2003-09). Only 3 other teams (Red Sox, Angels and Tigers) have had to pay luxury tax. The Red Sox broke the threshold from 2004-07, yet has only had to pay a TOTAL of $13M. The Angels and Tigers only broke the threshold once. The Yankees smash it on a yearly basis because they can put more into payroll knowing the luxury tax is just a drop in the bucket.Your final paragraph is full of assumptions and arrogance.
LOL!! Like Boston has never outbid the competition for a free agent it wanted. Dice k ring a bell. How about Schilling. I would rather the team spend money on talent and not the owner just putting the money in their pockets.
Ok, Dice-K was a blind bidding. Did they really outbid for Schilling (that was a trade remember? I guess not since you tried to lump them together). So really no, Boston only has one instance of outbidding.
Yes it was a trade in which they outbid (players instead of money) the Yankees. It would be interesting to see how many of the players from the Red Sox championships were brought up through their farm system and how many were brought in via trade and free agency…Like Schilling Martinez Ortiz Ramirez etc etc.
Sigh, so now you go from the Red Sox outbidding everyone to bringing in all their players via FA? So you name 4 players from the Sox, you can add Keith Foulke, Dave Roberts, Josh Beckett, Mike Lowell, Julio Lugo, JD Drew…then consider Nomar, Papelbon, Varitek, Lowe, Pedroia, Youkilis, Ellsbury, ect. Every team depends on a blend of FA and homegrown talent. Boston is no different. Do you have a point or are you just trying to start a flame war here?
Sorry I thought I had typed slow enough to make an obvious point. The Red Sox do the same things the Yankees do. While most of you Sox fans like to take a holier than thou attitude and act like you arent out there chasing down free agents it just isnt so. No winning team builds strictly from within. Period. My point about your free agents and most of trades is that you outbid teams to get them including the Yankees. I think something that might be kind of interesting is to see how many players the Yankees brought up through their farm system for their championship runs versus how many the the Sox brought up. I havent checked this out yet so if someone has maybe the could post it. The problem with this is I fear is the Sox lack of World Series experience we might not have enough data.
And no is the answer to your silly little flame war comment. I sincerely apologize if enlightening you about the Sox has put you on the defensive or hurt your feelings.
You’re funny man. You have been nothing but an antagonist here today. Well done.
If pointing out the flaws in your whining er arguement is being an antagonist then so be it.
LOL Listen, I know you’re new here with all of your 9 posts, all directed to me (lucky me), but where are my argument flaws? Seriously, what did I say that objectively was incorrect? You’ve done nothing but run around in a circle for a couple days now. I’m sorry your team got owned by Texas. They’re on the golf course with Boston now anyways. Let it go man. And in the future, when you reply to a post, try to stay with the original argument instead of drawing a million tangents. You’ve done nothing but act like a high-schooler with the day off. Thank you.
I am not the one that keeps bringing up NY losing to Texas in the ALCS. I have no problem with the fact that Texas owned us. However if your team is a third place team that can’t make the playoffs you should probably shut yer piehole. As far as my points, they are on topic. They just might be a little to advanced for ya.
Yes, obviously the Red Sox have brought in FA’s from outside (Ortiz, Drew, Dice-K, Manny, Pedro, ect) and via trade (Schilling, Beckett, V-Mart, Bay), as well as excel with homegrown talent (Varitek, Nomar, Ellsbury, Papelbon, Youkilis, Pedroia, Bard, Lester, Buchholz). Every team in MLB follows a similar strategy: a blend of the 3. Agree? My original point is that for the last 5 years, the Yankees have consistently outspent the rest of MLB. It’s not even close (ie Contreras, Damon, Pavano, Igawa, Sabathia, Texiera, Burnett). Do the Red Sox have 4 of the 5 highest paid players in the game? No So let me ask you a few questions. Did the Red Sox commit $423M to 3 players 2 years ago? No. Have the Red Sox consistently been well over the luxury tax threshold? No. Have the Red Sox consistently been over $200M payroll year in and year out? No. So what is your point? Do the Red Sox spend? Yes. They gave up $51M to sign Dice-K (bad move). Do they spend as much as the Yankees? No. Any Yankee fan that thinks otherwise needs a dose of reality. Listen, Boston is ahead of the majority of baseball in spending, with the Angels, Mets, Phillies, Cubs all close. Previous few years they’ve ranked between 3rd and 5th in payroll. This year Boston was high at $160M due to a number of players they still owed money to. Look at their average over previous 5 years ($129M). The Yankees? Try $200M on the dot. You cannot argue that. Saying that teams can spend but choose to pocket the dough is being very presumptuous. Unless you are looking at the team’s budget sheet right now, you have no idea of where teams stand. Yes, the Yankees have won a few world series. They have an amazing history. I will most certainly acknowledge that. But it’s comical that some Yankee fans (such as yourself) continue to hang your hat on that. So what. What does it mean? Yankees won all but 5 before Ronald Reagan was president and before many of us were even born. Since 2000 the Yankees and Red Sox have the same # of titles. So what’s your point? I’m not convinced you have one at this point, you’re just being a troll.
I would still like you to point out specific flaws in my argument. Thank you.
I would agree that some years the Yankees send the most in free agency. I agree the Yankees are a 200 mil payroll. My point is to keep it simple for you….The Sox are just a guilty as the Yankees for trying to win. You guys do the exact same things. You complain about the Yankees, so I guess teams like Pittsburgh and Cincy etc. could use the same arguments about the Sox. Most years you are one the top spenders in free agency your payroll is way out of whack with theirs, you outbid people for free agents etc etc.
I think you are a little jealous of the empire that George built.
No I’m not jealous at all. But I think you are a bit sensitive and defensive. Sorry you couldn’t disprove my points. I think we’re done here.
LOL!! Like Boston has never outbid the competition for a free agent it wanted. Dice k ring a bell. How about Schilling. I would rather the team spend money on talent and not the owner just putting the money in their pockets.
theres also the fact that most of teh key players for the curse breaking sox team was taking steroids.
are u sure about that. dont remember anyone confessing or being accused in 04 or 07.
“What part of the Red Sox having a payroll only 10% less than the Yanks are people not understanding.”
What part of math don’t YOU understand? The Yankees spent 20% more than the Sox this season.
So wait, the Red Sox aren’t going to go out and buy any players to improve their team this offseason?
Is it frustrating when Ellsbury ‘traps’ a ball in the OF but holds his glove up to fool the umpire into thinking he caught it?
Was it frustrating when Varitek was framing pitches for the last decade? Was it frustating when Ortiz and Manny were juicing and winning you 2 championships?
So stop your crying- every team has PED users, and every single player tries to fool the umpire.
Is it ironic that the Sox couldn’t beat Lackey in the playoffs in 08/09 so they went and signed him?
It’s ironic that you criticize the Yankees, yet your Sox do the same things.
you have a good memory! I promise you guys im really not a yankee basher, just messing with all a bit. i knew it would happen so i just help get it started.
Anyways the yanks lost to a better team, congrats to the rangers!
Good points Zack, though I will disagree on the Lackey parallel to Cliff Lee owning the Yankees.Correct, Lackey beat Boston in 2009 playoffs (7+ inning shutout). However lifetime he’s 3-7 with a 5.25 ERA against Boston. Boston took care of Lackey twice in the 2008 playoffs and tagged him again in 2007. Boston has had decent success against Lackey. Lackey just happened to be the #1 starter available. So it’s not quite the same as Lee and the Yankees. The Yankees have problems against Lee, so heck, lets buy him so we don’t have to face him anymore. You have to admit that AJ Burnett’s career #’s against New York (6-3, 2.43 ERA) played a huge role in that signing.Yes, expect Boston to spend, but it won’t be close to what the Yankees did in 2008-2009 or what Yankees do this year. If it happens otherwise I will gladly eat crow.The Swisher play was frustrating (as was Jeter’s bat knob incident) but that’s more fault of the umpires than the players IMO.Let’s keep the PED talk at a minimum because that just becomes a pissing match as you said.
The Yankees going after Lee of course they will look at and hopefully go after him. Prior to the World Series this guy is owning everyone in the postseason his numbers are …..(I dont even know what word to use) unbelievable kind of like Becketts which btw is the exact reason the Sox went after him and Schilling. Look I am not complaining about what you guys are doing its just smart baseball. Just stop acting like you guys don’t do the same thing.
Players fooling umpires has been going on forever and is taught at a Little league level. All teams and all players do it. Stop crying over this one you look silly.
I agree on the PEDS all teams are guilty of it so it doesnt really matter.
The Burnett signing yes I am sure the Yankees were quite aware of his stats when they signed him. We needed pitching badly as other teams were putting together great 1 2 punches via free agency (Boston comes to mind). If we didnt sign AJ whom do you think we should have gone after at the time.
Whatever dude. I never stated that Boston doesn’t spend. But to compare the Yankees and Boston’s spending is silly and a waste of time because EVERYONE knows the Yankees can and will outspend everyone. Period.
Ok man, I wasn’t crying, merely pointing out two plays that benefited the Yankees that the umps missed that were obvious. Don’t be a jerk.
According to Cots, it was a pretty weak FA list after Sabathia. Names like Dempster, Lowe, Pedro, Pavano, Sheets, ect. You apparently missed my point and I merely said the Yankees signed Burnett because he had a good track record against him, similar to why the Yankees want Lee.
So the Yanks signed the best FA pitcher available that has a good record against them. Why are you even bringing this up EVERY team tries to do this. Should the Yanks not be allowed to do this? Do you happen to bring up the first play in which Swisher got hit and it wasn’t called. The second instance with Swisher getting hit and it not being called I actually contend that that hurt us. The Sox do this crap just as much as the Yanks dude get off your high horse its not noble when you guys do it. Its just a part of baseball.
Yes the Yankees of late will outspend other teams on payroll, but not on every free agent out there as you make it sound. Lets make no mistake about it though the Red Sox are out spending almost every other team and are well above the league average in payroll.
Sigh,If you go back to my original post, I was replying to someone saying it’s the same as Sox signing Lackey because apparently the Sox could never beat Lackey, which I demonstrated as false. I never said the Yankees couldn’t spend, nor do the Red Sox not spend. You need to stop putting words in my mouth man. Please point out where I said this. However, you’re trying to downplay the fact that the Yankees consistently blow the rest of MLB away and it’s not even close. I’ll get off my high horse as soon as you get a grip on reality.
Whatever dude. I never stated that Boston doesn’t spend. But to compare the Yankees and Boston’s spending is silly and a waste of time because EVERYONE knows the Yankees can and will outspend everyone. Period.
Ok man, I wasn’t crying, merely pointing out two plays that benefited the Yankees that the umps missed that were obvious. Don’t be a jerk.
According to Cots, it was a pretty weak FA list after Sabathia. Names like Dempster, Lowe, Pedro, Pavano, Sheets, ect. You apparently missed my point and I merely said the Yankees signed Burnett because he had a good track record against him, similar to why the Yankees want Lee.
I thought when Aroid voided his contract and signed a new one with the skankies the Rangers got off the hook.
I believe you are correct. According to info on Cots Baseball Contracts under A-Rod, the “financial obligations are eliminated if Rodriguez voids”. Also, Texas was obligated to pay $9M as part of deferred compensation, but that ended in 2010.
Appears that Texas is finally rid of that awful contract.
Indeed. There was a 1 team bidding war vs themselves and the price kept escalating until they eventually won…
No, Texas owes Arod $29 mil worth of deffered money that was due him while he was in Texas I think. It’s was an issue when Texas was facing bankcruptcy. The payments that Texas was paying the Yankees was seperate from what they were paying directly to Arod.
Yes the Rangers definately outplayed us in all facets of the game. I cant think of an area where we outplayed them. Im glad you Sox fans noticed this as you watched the playoffs from home. I guess losing in the ALCS is better then taking third in your division. Although not by much granted.
Grow up already.
Sorry didn’t know third place in the division was such a sore spot with you still. Perhaps if you guys could build from within better you also could have a dynasty. I suspect Sox fans have cried during all the Yankee dynasties the only thing that has changed is the excuses.
Sure, oh and I’ll get off my high horse the day you check your pompous, condescending entitled attitudes at the door.
LOL!!! You go girl!!
Still waiting for you to point out specific flaws in my argument sweetheart.
Well Texas did beat the Yankees and were clearly the better team this go around..But Cashman will fix that for the 2011 campaign. At least it gives them something to shoot for as a goal. Im sure the Yanks will go all out for Lee and trade for Greinke. Im sure they will look for a bat like Crawford or Werth as well.. I dont think Thames or Berkman will be back or Kearns either…
Boy did the Yanks pitching ever stink in the AlCS ! Pee-yew !! Bad ..they gave up too many 3 run homers…
Greinke pitching in the Bronx would be a terrible move. If the Yankees want to trade for anyone on KC it’ll be Soria.
Agreed…either gor for Soria or Soriano
I doubt they go for an outfield bat
Can’t Greinke block trades to NY?
Greinke may block deals to 15 clubs in 2011. I seem to remember he has to make the decision fairly soon, like the next week or two. What do you want to bet he blocks all of the big market teams?
Finally the devil was defeated. In the end, good conquered over evil. Anytime the Yanks and Red Sox lose, it is a good day. I am sure the Skanks will look to raise their payroll to 300 million after their humiliating defeat. Adding more steroid users must be the first order of business
oi vey – there must not be cartoons on this morning and no fruit loops in the cabinet, because it seems like the children are bored.
There are plenty of fruit loops but they’re not in the cabinet today if you know what I mean.
You know it was comments like that that made me a Yankees fan in the first place. No other team takes the pure abuse the Yankees do. When other teams are having a bad inning you don’t hear “XYZ sucks” over and over again.On the other hand no other team wins as much. Oddly, the combination of the two created our fan base. The promise of victory in the future, combined with the intense hatred of our opponents makes the fan base grow.I was once like Span-D, just a fan of the game. Then came the ’76 Yanks and their crushing defeat against the Reds. No sympathy was offered for a team that hadn’t been in the playoffs for years; no applause came for an owner who had rebuilt a franchise that had become irrelevant. Here, in NY, nothing but abuse, abuse, abuse.From whom did the abuse come? From bitter Dodger and Giant fans whose teams had long abandoned the region. From Met fans who had become accustomed to having their team be the toast of the town since their ’69 WS victory. From NL fans who were convinced their league was 100% better than the AL, and whose All-Star team victories were supposedly proof of that.Angered as never before by seeing a team I liked so laughed at and dishonored, I waited all winter for a chance at revenge. I followed the ’77 Yankees as if nothing else in baseball mattered, and when they won, I had never been so happy for anything in sports. The only thing I didn’t like: I wanted the Reds. I wanted to crush the Reds as bad as I ever wanted to punch a bully in the face.So, board members, please continue to piss on the Yanks. I know from experience, that you’re growing our membership and adding new fans to our fanbase. For whether you choose to believe it or not, losing makes as many fans as winning. For proof of that, ask fans of the 1918 to 2003 Red Sox or current Chicago Cubs.
I’ve been through good and bad with this team. No Yank fan can forget the 13 years under Steinbrenner where we didn’t make the playoffs. But that’s what makes a fan – the hard times more than the good. And given who the Yankees remain to be in the post George Steinbrenner era, I expect good will follow the bad.
Strangely, the Yankees surge when their homegrown talent comes of age, in the 90’s it was Williams and Jeter. Munson in the 70’s, but then they get away from that paradigm and begin to fade again. What position players besides Cano do they have in the pipeline?
Also, I’m not sure that focusing on starting pitching is where they need to be, clearly they need bullpen help. Cliff Lee would be a nice addition and would probably help them along quite nicely, but aside from Wood and Rivera that bullpen is brutal. If you could add a couple of middle guys for half the money you would pay for Lee, you would greatly enhance your post season chances on that move alone. I wouldn’t give up on Hughes yet.
A-Rod is also not the presence he once was, although I think he is still a pretty good defender. I would look for a corner outfielder before I went with a starter.
Those two changes alone would have forced a game 7, as the Yankees are always a late inning presence, but the Rangers put games away in the middle innings.
A) I love how the Yankees losing in the ALCS instantly initiates the “let’s all hate on the Yankees for overspending” crowd. Let’s face it, Texas outplayed the Yankees in the postseason and seemed to just want it more. And admit it, if your team could spend what the Yankees spend on talent you’d want them to do so.B) After a Yankees loss and checking with 6 sources we find out no new information. Of course they want to bring Girardi back. Of course Mo and Jeter are expected to return. Of course we won’t know about Pettitte’s return for awhile. And of course they’ll be looking at Cliff Lee and potentially Greinke. To anyone who has paid attention to the team these were all certainties that we expected.
It comes from the opposite quarter from a certain fringe group starts blasting away here and other places when Boston loses, have seen it for years.
Me? More worried about John Farrell leaving and heading to Toronto rather than worried about any holes filled via FA. letting them build the team via the farm system is the right way, just like they started doing 2 years ago and getting fewer and fewer pieces via FA, maybe wait for the bonanza market of Pujols/Agone to hit with Tampa looking like a pitching only team next year and letting MORE rookies play like Kalish and Doubront.
There is no need to imitate the city to the south when more are on the way.
One thing though with regards to 10% payroll difference noticed above between NYY and Boston last season.. that is incorrect, even at the start of the season before the Yanks acquired high PT vet’s Berkman and Wood that they still get taxed on am pretty sure, the difference was 20%.
I don’t think the actual % was the point he was making. I think the point was that the Red Sox also have a huge payrol andl as much as the Red Sox love to talk about building from the farm up they are more like the Yankees than any other team. Let’s not forget, this team is paying Lackey and Beckett a combined $33M through the 2014 season. If the Red Sox had the extra revenue the Yankees did, don’t you all think they would have a payroll just as high? The Red Sox are going to spending big on free agents this offseason too. They have too with 2 of their best offensive players becoming free agents.
PS..What will the Nation say if the various farm system rankings come out over the winter and the Yanks are ranked ahead of the Sox? Not saying it will definitely happen, but it is a real possibility.
The NYY system may very well be ranked ahead, one must look at BA last season rankings being before Ryan Westmoreland’s life threatening brain surgery. That alone will be a major factor, perhaps offset some with progress made by Ryan Lavarnway and Drake Britton, but not nearly enough to help the loss from one of the top prospects in the game being virtually erased for at least a year, if not forever from the system.
I would not be so sure that Boston is going to pursue the pricey FA this season either, sure Crawford and werth are being thrown about, but I don’t see either as a fit worthy of any kind of LT investment vs the cost. Will the same “beach ball tossing” fans have a hissy fit if they don’t go out and sign one? Sure they will, then they were clamoring to get Drew also, who other than defensively, has been just about average and Werth IMO is no better fit at Fenway for the cost, just take MORE money to sign.
Also.. there is a pretty big difference in making market moves in resigning players (Beckett) rather than going out and signing FA’s to contracts like they did Lackey, don’t confuse the 2 and overall Beckett has been pretty solid when he has been healthy since they acquired him.
Take a look at Boston FA signings over the last several years, Drew@14M, Lackey@16.5M, there are not but those 2 large ones and why they constantly build, build, build through the farm system and it works. Spending 10M+ on the Rule4 draft is the best and smartest way for any team in MLB to compete. If the NYY start to use it more to their advantage now (they have last 3-4 years) then more power to them. They will be one of the 4-5 teams smart enough to exploit what 25+ teams foolishly waste.
To be honest with you, how on Earth do you expect the Sox to compete in the AL East with the Yankees spending the way they do? The sox, and other teams as well, have to spend the $$ to even rank in their league.
The Rays did ok. Didnt they?
First, the backpage of the NY Post says it all: “$210M Bust!”
Second, why should the rest of baseball conform to the way the Yankees spend? Who says the Yankees are the model of how to run a franchise (and no that doesn’t mean 27 world championships haha, that’s not where I’m going…)
Third, there’s no guarantee even if and probably WHEN the Yankees offer Lee the most, that he’ll leave Texas. An article in Yahoo today quotes Lee as saying “I definately enjoy it here. Great group of guys. And it’s going to be a good team for several years to come. And I really wouldn’t mind being part of that.”
Century makes a good point below (Mike Francesa said same thing the other day) about taxes and cost of living. Yankees will have to beat Texas offer by a hefty amount to even have a chance and even then there’s no guarantee Lee packs up house again. Just saying.
Just in case you forgot it is the Yankees for goodness sake. They can and will outbid any team that competes with them (Especially if it is someone as highly coevted as Lee).
True, I forgot who I was talking about haha
The Yankees have the resources to get both Lee and Greinke, if they’re determined (and if Greinke is actually traded). Lee is the easy on, he’ll only cost money. For Greinke they wouldn’t be playing on their home turf (money) but rather on a relatively even playing field, prospects. Not every team has the prospects for him but the Yankees have Montero, which is a great start. Could be interesting.
but Greinke doesn’t want to come to N.Y.C.
Hows this for a trade as crazy as it sounds
AJ & Joba for Soria and Greinke
the Yanks would pick up the tab for AJ who is headcase and needs out of the bronx badly..& Joba is just not what the Yanks expected
Dude, generally I’m vocal about intelligent Yankee fans, and this sir, doesn’t qualify in that category. Come on man, this is open session for stupid Braves and Red Sox fans to complain. Let’s leave the stupid comments to them.
Sigh, lets keep the condescending comments that do nothing at a minimum hmmm? I know you’re a bit rattled today but come on. And yes, it was a silly proposal.
Next time you think of a trade proposal, don’t write it and make Yankee fans look bad.
HHDMS’s trade proposal is the last thing you need to worry about making yank fans look bad…
yeah seriously.
Here’s a fair proposal…
Montero, Betances, Adams, and Joba for Greinke.
Or Gordon, Robinson, Webster, and Jansen for Greinke (Dodgers).
Uhhh no?(to the top one)
Think about it. It actually makes perfect sense.
When Grienke cracks under the pressure in NY no it won’t
Right now it makes sense. When he “falls apart” as some say, it won’t.
KC wouldn’t make that trade in a million years. If they are going to part with Soria AND Greinke they will ask for young, controllable, cheap, premium talent. I still think Joba may have a bright future–and could perhaps benefit from a change of scenery–but Burnett is clearly an unattractive option for almost any team given his contract and track record. If the Royals are going to trade their two top chips, they will get a lot more than Joba and Burnett (even if he comes at no cost).
Just because it was accepted on your video game doesn’t mean it could actually happen. This is reality, Sherlock.
lol….
You can get Zito for AJ? Maybe.
noway man…even as a crazy trade proposal guy i know that is off…
Pull up a chair pal…lets play the baseball video game. You know the one where you can trade a bunch of old expensive junk and get awesome younger talent.
Those video games are BS. I simulated a whole season and Roy Halalday had a 5.80 ERA while all these other no names like Vincente Padilla finished with a 2.70 ERA
doesn’t Greinke have a limited NTC and one of the teams he blocked is the Yankees? maybe i was seeing things somewhere
I believe that was for the 2010 season only- he got to list 20 teams for the 2010 season, and only gets to list 15 teams for next season. Although I don’t think anyone officially knows what day it gets cut from 20 to 15.
Actually there was a recent post on Greinke’s availability and mentioned 8 teams, including Boston and New York, that ZG had NTC to.
Actually I just found the article on MLBTR, mentioned it’s about half teams in baseball ZG has a NTC to.
Bittersweet, but kudos to the Rangers. They were the much better team this year, and definetly massively outplayed my defending champions in the ALCS. I wish them the best of luck in the World Series. Now that the offseason is starting to begin, hopefully Cashman does bolster the pitching. I don’t care if we get Lee or Grienke at all, I just want to see our pitching improve, after pitching was pretty much were the Yanks downfall this year.LET’S GO GIANTS PHINISH THE PHOOLS
Does Lee going to the World Series add no value to his chances of staying in Texas over NY?
I’m sure it does, but let’s not be naive. If Yankees offer 20-30m more then he’ll be in NY, 99% of us would.
I agree, however if my math is correct, the Yanks will need to offer meaningfully more than the Rangers due to state income taxes, cost of living, quality of life. The Yanks will need to outbid the Rangers by about $40mm in order to have a chance. Meaning if the Rangers put up $120mm for 5, the Yanks need to go to $160mm and you know what; at that point, I say pass. I am one of the biggest Lee supporters, but not if it is going to cost this team in a few years.
You also have to think of how much more he would earn in endorsements by being a Yankee. Forbes just had an article on it. The Yankees have their own 24-hr cable network in what is by far the largest media market in the country. Forbes estimated he would make about $50M in endorsements over 6 years.
I really think for Lee to stay in Texas he would have leave tens of millions of dollars on the table and I don’t see why he would do that. He made a total of $17.5M over the past 3 years despite being worth about $90M. He is going to cash out as he should. It is the American way.
Hell yea, it’s the American Way, huh?! That’s the same mentality that has gotten this entire country mired in the crap we’re in now.
Not quite true even if the Rangers offered 5/$115 and the Yanks 5/$125 he would still make considerably more in NY, even w/ the higher cost of living and taxes, because of endorsements he could have being a NY player as opposed to a Texan.
Smart alec comment, but I can’t resist.
You don’t think they have endorsement deals in Texas? 🙂
Not quite like they have in NY. As great as Hamilton is how many commercials have you seen him in over the last two years compared to Jeter, Sabathia or Arod? Shoot even Girardi has a Taco Bell commercial. The WS appearance will probably increase the marketability of some Texas players but still, the advertising world lives in NY and there’s a lot more access available.
Yeah, I knew what you meant. It just seemed funny to me at the time in the way it came across.
Do they have running water there yet in Arlington? That could be a major selling point to Lee.
I keed I keed
Well said. Mike Francesa on YES made similar points the other day on his show.
No one really knows what’s the Yankee budget…i wish we did know…but i know i want Lee if they can afford him,know matter what…but if money is a stickinng point…then what the Yanks should do is ask Arod to take some of his salary deferred…pay it out over 10 or 15 years after his player contract is done and add 1 mil a year for each year it’s paid out…and keep getting the big free agents…just only bid enough to beat the competition not themselves…maybe they could ask Arod to accept a trade if 10 mill a year is deferred and they split the cost of the remaining anual salary…with let’s say the Angels they could save a little money even if they picked up Beltre and recieve 3 good prospects/players to fill holes…like getting Napoli in a package for Arod…the Yanks are aging so maybe this would be a good time to just switch gears…?
LOL ! All these comments to me for a crazy trade idea 🙂 funny stuff..
I dont think it would happen just sayin’ basically…
the truth is the Yanks will sign who they need to to get # 28…if they cant sign them, they’ll trade…Everyone knows they are going to after Lee like crazy
But I can also see them going after Soria and Greinke over the winter..
And offensively Crawford and Werth are probably on the Yanks radar as well..
So basically the Yankees will keep an eye on every available good player? Thanks for the breaking news.
Yes ..shocking isnt it ??
the Yankees have a few claring weaknesses now that so many teams have improved around them…they have just two pitchers for playoff competition and one may retire…they are weak defensivley at catcher and Posada is an injury waiting to happen…and their bullpen like most is unpredictable and their shortstop is old and in decline…what will they do…i don’t know but i think if they make some trades instead of going into the wallet it could keep the payrole from getting to big and that will make them look less like the bullies of baseball…but whatever they have to do i hope they do it…but if i were in Cashman shoes i would not bring Jeter back unless i couldn’t get a ss who was better than him in a trade…i hope they bring in Cliff Lee trade for Jeremy Guthrie and StephenDrew and pick up John Buck and if they lose Granderson to get that done…then getting Carl Crawford to replace him makes sense…
Um, every single bullpen in the league is unpredictable- complaining about that is stupid. There are about 5-7 good players each at C and SS around the league, so again every team is in the same boat except for a few.
The “trade Granderson” crowd disappeared about a month or two ago you know that right?
Granderson was a monster in the 2nd half (17 home runs).
I assume alot of NYY fans were down on him and expecting 40 HR’s but he’s someone (as a Sox fan) I’m a little concerned about in the future if he gets it all together.
so what do you think it will take to win the AL East if Boston is healthy and what do you think it will take to get past Texas if they are…and i know the bullpen and ss situation around the league is weak but i think these are the moves that could get a WS ring…and if the Yanks did add Crawford then that means they trade either Granderson Swisher or Gardner…i just thought Granderson would attract the most interest…i didn’t think he was a bust…on the contrary the only reason the Yanks might move him is because there is a free agent out there who can take his place and if he was packaged right he might bring back a serious pitcher to add to the #3 spot behind Lee if they get him and Sabathia…and maybe that is what it will take to actually win a WS…because Lee can only win 1 game every 5th day…
It is not as bad as it looks. The Rangers were unbelievably hot, and the Yankees couldn’t deal with it. Texas reminded me of the 2002 Angels, whom no one could pitch against. Neither of those teams, Texas or California, were as good as they looked. Nor were the Yankees teams that faced them as bad as they looked.I’m not trying to downgrade the Rangers or Angels. Those teams played hard, they played smart, they deserved to win, and win they did. But in the vein of looking at what the Yankees need to do to beat a team in the future, you have to be calm and realistic about what needs to be done.Worrying about being beaten by a red-hot teams is a mistake. If you react to that, you’d want to rebuild the Yankees because in this series they didn’t look like they belonged on the field with the Rangers. That’s simply not true.For instance, Hughes is a 24 year old pitcher who should to improve. In fact, he improved between game 1 and game 6. Giving up on him being a shutdown pitcher is foolish. The Bosox kept faith in Bucholz and Lester and we should keep faith in Hughes.The pitching does need to improve and, as much as I’d rather not have Cliff Lee on the team, we might have to go that route if Andy Pettitte retires. The need for someone to set up for (and later supersede) Mariano increases each year, and currently, Joakim Soria is my favorite candidate. We also need one more short man, so that when Robertson goes into a bad stretch he can be brought back slowly rather than inserted into every high leverage situation.If there was one really troubling thing I saw, it is that Swisher and Teixeira haven’t hit in the postseason. Our two 30 year old switch hitters have to produce for us to balance the lineup and keep from being easy to beat when lefties are on the mound. They could both be around for a long time, and we’ll need them to make life for playoff pitchers difficult.Even in that, I’m not sure there’s anything to work on. Playoffs are by their nature small sample events, and next year Swish and Tex may carry us as much as they hurt us this year. In fact if those two hit better, and AJ Burnett reverted to his 2009 form we could’ve beaten the Rangers this year. That’s how close we are to being a WS team right now, and no Yank fan should forget it.
I think the Yankees got beat because they couldn’t get a starter past the 6th inning. Wood and Rivera were pretty effective, it is the rest of the bullpen that killed the Yankees. I agree with your position on Lee – only if Petitte retires. The Yankees would get more bang out of bullpen additions.
They also need a middle of the order guy too. The reason Tex was flacid is that A-Rod is no longer able to catch up to a fastball. Since you KNOW Jeter is coming back, it looks like an outfielder. Since Swisher has RF, Crawford is your guy.
Blaming Tex’ performance on A-Rod is not fair. Tex’ was bad in last year’s postseason, too, and A-Rod was great then.
Otherwise, I think we agree on most of what the Yanks need to do. Not that it matters to a certain Mr. Cashman, who will make his own decisions!
So in one breath you say the Yanks need a middle of the order bat (maybe) but then you say they need to get Crawford. Crawford would have zero effect on being a true middle of the order bat. Tex struggled this year because he got of to his usual slow start and was then hit with nagging injuries towards the middle-end that kept him from being 100% of the hitter he can be. Right now, Cano, Swisher, Tex, Granderson and Gardner are the young offensive players to build around with Montero coming soon. And Arod has shown that he can still be an effective hitter w/o hitting 30+ hrs. He made the most of situations w/ men on base @ .296/.368. Hopefully, Montero will contribute in the near future and pick up some of the slack.
So move him up or down the lineup, but get him out of the middle where he (A-Rod) is not much of an eb threat anymore. I still like his D. But, unless that bullpen is fixed this is not much of a discussion, and the Yankees are going to fall right back into the situation they were in from ’02-’08, having enough to get to the postseason, but not enough to get through.
I agree, Cliff Lee has beat them all over, but the Yankees still have a good team. They have a great outfield, with Swisher doing what he always does, Granderson getting hot late, and Gardner exceeding all expectations. Their pitching, like 09, wasn’t great, but that was due to several things that didn’t work out, like Javy Vazquez, AJ Burnett, and Andy Pettite’s injury, but that is no cause for an overhaul. We still have pitching prospects in the minors (Brackman, Betances, Nova if he is still a prospect) and we could have gotten farther is Nova pitches game 4 instead of Burnett.
The Yankees need pitching behind Sabathia, but where should they get it from? Cliff Lee will be at least 23MM, probably more, and before 2008, Cliff Lee was pretty bad, and it is still possible he could revert to that form. Greinke has some anxiety disorder, and I don’t think he could perform in New York. I think Lee seems the best bet currently, but I’m still uneasy about the the Yankees committing over 25 million to an aging 32 year old. Reminds of a guy called Barry Zito.
Please don’t let Jeremy Guthrie fool you. He had a good year but he isn’t the FO guy the Yanks need. Add to the fact that he’s under contract with the O’s and they have aspirations to be better and don’t want to help another AL East team then that seems unlikely to be an issue. Also, you make picking up Drew and letting Jeter walk seem so easy. (Sigh) this isn’t an EA Sports game my friend.
Jeter got 21 mill this year…Now,if he is brought back at 20 mill a year and we add Curtis Granderson’s 8.25 mill in 2010 10 mill in 2011 and a club opt. for 13 mill…The Yanks start off at 28.25 mill in 2011 for Jeter and Granderson…Now,if they got Crawford for 18 mill a year and traded Granderson with Nunez and maybe Ivan Nova which is probably more than they need to get the deal done for Drew then they would actually save money because Drew will only get around 5 to 5.5 mill in arb in 2011…and i think that acutually makes them a better team…i might be doable
ok…guthrie # over the last 4 years are…2007 3.70 era 175.1 ip/2008 3.63era 190.2ip /2009 5.04era 200ip /2010 3.83 era 209.1 ip…pitching in the AL East on the weakest team in the east facing the strongest lineups…he might be just about to break out…and he only made 3 mill last year so he would make no more than 6 mill in his second arb.but he is 31 so he maynot be apart of the Oriole’s future…
Agreed. Jeremy Guthrie would be an awful mistake if the NYY acquired him and counted on him for anything rotation wise.
Have an awful (?) feeling the fans would be almost wishing they had Vazquez back come June.
I like the weaknesses points. See, there are a few things that most Yankee fans don’t understand.
1) MOST other teams have areas of weakness. What the OTHER teams do is either
a) deal with the weakness and maybe a strength on their team will absorb the weakness’ underachievements or
b) bring someone up from the farm and give them a chance to develop into what might be the solution.
2) MOST other teams do not have the opportunity/availability to “free spend”. The Yankees have bottomless pockets. Hence, more options:
a) Trade established, farm-raised stars for either prospects or 2 “good” players to fill necessary voids on the team.
b) Do nothing and wait until young talent matures and contributes to an above-average team (i.e. Tampa Bay Rays).
Fact is, and I’m not trying to poke a stick at a beehive here : Steinbrenner was greedy. He wanted wanted wanted and put a hell of a lot of people through the wringer trying to get it. He was successful, but look at what he has done. He helped make the game of BASEBALL into a BUSINESS. It’s a shame.
Are you a Yankee Fan?
The games was turned into a business during the 1st game every played when a fan paid an admission fee to watch a game played by guys being paid a salary by an owner trying to turn his investment into a profit. It became an obscene business when those same owners charged $4 for an under cooked hotdog and $6 for a warm beer.
Honestly could see the Yankees getting both Lee and Grienke after seeing how bad their SP was outside of CC and Andy, and CC wasn’t at his best this postseason. Also could see them making a play for Werth or Crawford as it wasn’t all the pitching fault they didn’t beat the Rangers, they batted .201 as a team in the ALCS. I also think trying to resign Wood should be up there, he was great in the Bronx and is a great set up man for the Hammer of God. A deal to get Grienke though would have to start with Montero, Joba and at least 2 other of their top prospects, it’s going to cost a ransom to get him even after a down year and see the Rangers being heavy players for him as well.
I’m pretty sure Grienke will block a trade to the Yankees.
It would be interesting if Yankees lose out on Lee, they might have to trade for one. They also need bullpen help.
He very well could, but I’ve never understood that, because if you pitch well for the Yankees, you’ll get paid but I’m also not sure of the teams he can block a trade to. And agree about the ‘pen, which is why I think they should try to resign Wood even if he’ll cost more than what the Yanks usually pay for bullpen help.
I don’t think Werth would be worth it (haha like the pun), he reminds me of JD Drew and the Red Sox. Drew might have been older, but he’s the same type of player as Werth, decent power and RBI’s, and .285 to .290 average.
The thing with Werth though is as far as I’m aware still plays very good defensive OF and is always a beast in the playoffs, which is a must playing for the Yankees.
You say Werth doesn’t seem worth it yet you use Drew as an example even though Drew has been worth his contract so far. Kinda contradictory.
Nice to see Nolan Ryan victorious as an owner. Couldn’t happen to a nicer guy. Good also to see ‘W’ at the Ranger home games. Yanks look old. Their pitching looks weak and I don’t care for the way that Girardi falls back on the IBB. Curious as to how the Rangers will match up against either the Phils or the Giants. Interesting baseball season, almost made unbearable at the end by horrible TV coverage from TBS and Fox.
If Ernie Johnson and Joe Buck never do play by play again, it’ll be too soon.
After listening to the Giants broadcast team all year, both TBS and Fox have a long way to go. McCarver was a fool when he was still in control of his mental faculties, now I have a picture of Joe Buck having to wipe spittle from McCarver’s chin every minute of so. I like Smoltz and Darling actually, but Ernie Johnson… And that field guy is just weird.
Craig Sagger(Saggs as Johnson likes to call him)? I think he’s weird too
what video game ? boy i love all these snide remarks…no wonder we all get along just so well in the world today
well at least someone knows Sherlock Holmes..and thats a good thing ! 🙂 Love Sherlock Holmes ..
What if the Yankees sign a guy like Chris Young to an incentive laden contract? He definitely has ace ability, he proved it with SD and would be a mid-end of the rotation starter, which would take a lot of pressure off of him. I think it could work, its a worth a try.
You’re serious?
His fastball didn’t even average 85mph this year.
He has a GB% of 30, which means 70% of the balls that are hit off of are him in the air- that’s fine at Petco, not at Yankee Stadium.
He used to strke guys out, now he doesnt and just walks 4-5 guys per 9 innings.
How that equals “ace ability” is beyond me.
I bet the boston would pay his contract to sign with the yankees!!!! are you kidding me? ill pay for him to play in new york
I’m just curious, but I’ve heard a lot of different figures get thrown around for what kind of offers Lee will get this winter. Any educated guesses from intelligent Yankees fans (or fans in general) on what kind of offer they might give him this winter?
I feel like the Rangers will pull out all the stops for him this winter, including giving him a massive payday. And if the Rangers win their next four games, then I think it really would be hard for him to leave. But obviously, the Yanks can pay him obscene amounts of money. Just wondering if they have a ceiling or not w/ their offers (especially when it comes to weakening the Rangers going into next season)
We are hearing that the Yankees may offer Lee up to 27 million a year.
6/172
Unbelievable I know but if the Yankees want him they will get him.
I hope they do sign him to that. It’ll be one of the worst contracts in the history of professional sports.
I don’t think you can make that statement until the end of the contract. He has been worth an average of $30M per year since 2008 and although he does have a minor injury history, his pitching style reeks of longevity. He is not a hard thrower, in fact it looks like he puts amazingly little effort into his delivery. He is all about movement and location ( and he throws 5 pitches with that movement and command in any count) and with that recipe he could still be very very good even at the age of 38.
Good lord…
I think my absolute limit for the Rangers would be about 6 yrs 132 mil, although I might need a few beers before I did it. My ideal would be more like 5 yrs 112. 27 mil a year is terrifying, even on a short term deal
Are you kidding me??? Lee is good but I’d much, much rather wait out at least 2 seasons for Betances, Banuelos, and Brackman to be ready
Wow, for a 32yo SP?
they’ll sign him for anything as long as they get him on their team and off the market from other teams
If I had to guess, he will sign for 6 years, around $160 or so. They would probably give even more but I don’t think other teams will push them much beyond this. The Yanks basically print their own money so if they really want him they will get him.
I truly think ppl are insane w/ some of these proposals. Cliff Lee is great and has proven himself in terms of his ability in the playoffs. However, look at comparable pitchers that have hit the open market or have signed recent ext instead of going to the open market.
Johan Santana 6/$137.5 ($22.9 mil per)
CC Sabathia 7/$161 ($23 mil per)
Roy Halladay 4/$80 ($20 mil per)
Who are the players? Most likely he will go to the Rangers or a big market team. The big market teams are usually the Yanks , Red Sox, Angels, Mets, ChiSox, Nationals, Orioles, Tigers, Phillies, Cubs and Dodgers. I think we can strike off the Red Sox, Angels, ChiSox and Phillies off the list because they don’t have as urgent of a need in their startng rotations to spend upwards of $20 mil + to bring another pitcher in. Then for various financial issues you can probably strike the Dodgers and the Cubs off as well. The Cubs may have a need for SP but they have a lot of holes to fill and a lot of money all ready tied up. Cliff Lee mentioned he wants to go to a competitive teams. I expect him to listen to all offers but can’t see him signing with mediocre teams like the Nats and Orioles. The Tigers said they won’t be looking for expensive pitchers but we’ll see. The Mets could be a real player here depending on whether they’ve recovered from the Bernie Made-off “with your money” scandal. They have a need but have to weigh that need with these facts.
They already have an exp pitcher in Santana who will be coming off of his 2nd arm related surgery this year and is getting more exp in 2011 (22.5), 2012 (24 mil) and 2013 (25.5 mil). They have a lot coming off the books after 2011 (about $58 mil) but also have some major holes to fill this year and/or at the end of 2011 if they let some guys walk @ 2B, SS, CF, RF and Closer/bullpen. A lot of that $58 mil may have to be reinvested elsewhere.
So that leaves basically the Yanks and Texas to act free and clear w/ regards to Lee. The last time the Rangers invested in a $20 mil per year guy it didn’t turn out to well for them (Arod). Will they be willing to do it again? Also, they have Cruz, Hamilton, Murphy, Wilson and O’Day arb eligible and need to improve their team in other ways as well. Would offering Lee big money help them in 2011 but hurt them in retaining and improving the roster in 2011 and beyond?
So let’s assume Texas is the main roadblock and assume Lee is interested in going somewhere where he can make the most money AND compete every year. Assume the Yanks make an initial offer of 5/$105 but are ready to move it to “CC money” @ $23 mil per. Can anyone see Texas approaching the $20 mil mark much less motivating the Yankees to up it to something crazy like $25-$27 mil per? I think if the Yanks came out the box and offered him 5/$115 that sets the market and I can’t see anyone topping that offer. I also can’t see Lee become willing to offer a hometown discount regardless of whether or not they win it all. He could, but from what I’ve heard of him, what I’ve heard him say about wanting to perform on the biggest stage and the fact that he and CC are close friends, their wives are close friends and his agent also reps AJ and Dustin Mosley it would seem that the Yanks have a lot in their favor.
Also, fact that they are still under the weight of the Arod deal ($25 mil owed), just came from bankcruptcy and have a roster full of players that are going to get expensive might they decide that Cliff Lee is too expensive and instead turn to their farm to get a top starter in a trade (Greinke, JJ, Nolasco, etc)?
The only problem is Texas is well aware that the Yankees covet Lee. They know it will take $20M+ a year over 5-6 years to get it done. Problem is say Texas offers 5 years at $100M and Yankees offer 5 years at $115M, do you automatically expect him to turn down Texas? As posted here above, you need to consider property tax, income tax, cost of living, ect. Mike Francesa estimates Texas has a $40M advantage as it stands right now. Then factor in proximity to home in Arkansas. As he made some interesting comments in Yahoo today about not minding being a part of Texas going forward.Obviously I’ve read in the Daily News today how Yankees will use CC’s friendship with Lee to recruit him blah blah blah. But it’s not a done deal by a long shot like many people think.
He might turn them down initially just to try to increase the Yankees offer. The same reason he talks about loving Texas and all that. It is just him hanging on to his leverage.
By no means do I think any Yankee fan feels as if it’s a done deal. Also, while there are different advantages to living/playing in Texas you simply can not overlook the advantages of playing in NY the advertising capital and largest media in the world.
I agree with your assessment on the market for Lee, I think it definitely boils down to the Rangers and Yankees (maybe the Tigers too). To answer your question about their willingness to pony up on another massive contract though, I think they will. The difference between now and 2000ish (w/e we signed A-Rod) is that we already have a really good team in place for cheap (around a $60 mil payroll this year). Now, yes they’ll need to start paying up for other players as well, but the way the game has evolved, it seems like you almost need to have a payroll around 100 mil to succeed on a consistent basis in the league. Which gives them about $40 mil to work w/ (not including the money they have coming off the books). We also will have a lot of extra revenue coming in from our postseason run this year, and seeing how we’re set up for a sustained run of success, it’s not hard to imagine generating more money than usual for the foreseeable future from more ticket sales, TV coverage, merchandise sales, etc.
Also, when push comes to shove…I’m sure the Rangers would rather bring Cliff Lee back than a lot of the other guys due up for raises in the near future (excluding Hamilton and maybe Cruz). They could afford to let guys like CJ Wilson, Colby Lewis and some of their relievers walk down the road if guys like Derek Holland, Martin Perez and Tanner Scheppers emerge over the next few years. That’s the beauty of having a deep farm system.
So I would think the Rangers are set up to make a seriously competitive offer for Lee. The question is how much more the Yankees are willing to pony up to pry him away from TX (especially if we win our next four games). B/c the Rangers would have a limit at some point, I’m sure. You guys, however, would probably not
And as a side note to the Yankee hate going on…I don’t think the problem is w/ them spending money…b/c let’s face it, if any of our teams generated as much revenue as they do, we would all have $200 mil payrolls. The problem is the system. There needs to be a salary cap. Revenue sharing helps, and I thought they had a point a few years ago when they called out the Brewers owner for not spending their share to pony up for CC. But it still leaves open scenarios where teams will pony up and give legitimately competitive offers to guys like Lee, and still get blown out of the water by the Yankees. Can’t fault them for doing everything within their means to win, but I really think it’s in the best interests of the sport to create a salary cap. Although the MLBPA would never agree to it
I love the Yankee haters, I really do. It just means that you guys have been hurting inside for the majority of your lives. LOL.
The Yankees reload and will be even stronger next year.
Congrats to the Rangers, I just hope Lee only has to pitch 1 game, I would hate to see him tired when he signs on the dotted line with the Yankees around Christmas.
Do you want a tissue?
A few things…
-To the Rangers. From one fan base to another, congrats to you and yours. You kicked our teeth in and outplayed us in every facet of the game. Good luck to you in the WS although I haven’t decided who to root for yet. Enjoy today, because success is a lot harder to sustain.
-To Yankee fans. Don’t let the haters get to you. This is what they do. The Yanks have lost more WS than any other team has won WS. We are a still a great team that somehow managed to make it to the ALCS despite epic fails and struggles to AJ and Vazquez and our 2nd best pitcher, Pettite, spending 2 months on the DL. We certainly have to make improvements but we should be back in the thick of it again next year.
-To the front office. DON’T PANIC. I’m sure you won’t. We all know what has to be done. Work swiftly to bring back Girardi, Rivera and Jeter. Help the cap save face w/ a 3/54 deal or 4/72 deal. We all know he’s isn’t deserving of it but suck it up anyway. Give Pettite time to think about things but don’t sit on your hands. Cliff Lee is obviously the #1 option this year and he would make life a whole lot better. With CC, Lee, AJ and Hughes we would be in a good place. If Pettite comes back then we’re set. If he doesn’t then Ivan Nova, David Phelps or Hector Noesi should be in the mix for the #5. Greinke should not be a serious option. The farm is in a great place right now in terms of pitching prospects and we need to retain them for whenever Pettite retires and AJ comes off the books. The offense needs some fine tuning. Arod and Jeter are not getting younger. DO NOT TRADE MONTERO. He can really infuse some youth into this lineup. No need for Werth or Crawford either. However, Posada is in decline defensively and offensively, and can’t be counted on to stay healthy. He’s going to be 40 and needs to be cut loose after 2011 when his contract expires. That being said Montero isn’t going to be an improvement defensively and probably can’t handle the staff (Pettite, Sabathia, Hughes) as well as Posada. However, I think the kid will rake and give the lineup that much needed combo of power, contact ability and run production. The catching game can’t be changed over night defensively but for some reason Cervelli has regressed somewhat in the running game. He went from throwing out 43% in 2009 to only throwing out 14% in 2010. Posada wasn’t much better @ 15%. All that being said, start Montero off in AAA and hopefully he’ll get off to a great start and then call him up when his confidence is high. Might I suggesting signing a “throw away” defensive minded C? A catcher who is adept at throwing runners out, won’t cost much in terms of money and can be cut easily if Cervelli looks better and/or Montero is ready to be called up. How about Gerald Laird? He’s a FA, won’t cost much and threw out 34% in 2010 and 42% in 2009. Make Posada the primary DH in 2011 and have him catch 25% of the games, primarily the ones in which Pettite starts seeing as how Pettite himself is a deterent to the running game. Let Cervelli and Laird catch the rest with a preference towards Cervelli early as you want him to improve. If Cervelli catches a good game overall and Montero is ready then you cut Laird and call Montero up. Let Montero DH more than he catches and use Posada more at C. Cervelli returns to being the backup.
Offseason personal improvements-
-Cervelli- Work on defense.
-Tex- Get healthy and start hitting earlier so you don’t start off as slow.
-Cano- Do what you do.
-Jeter- Whatever you did in the winter of 2008/2009 to improve your range you need to get back to doing. Work on your swing and stop beating the ball into the groud so much. YOU MUST REBOUND from 2010. You get a pass this 1 time but not again in 2011.
-Arod- Come in, physically fit and work on your swing. You had a good year driving in runners but your power wasn’t up to par for a guy earning $30 mil.
-Swisher- Keep up the good work.
-Grandy- Continue to follow Kevin Long’s teachings.
-Gardner- Take some lessons from Ricky Henderson and try to be more aggresive on base. You can be a 70 SB guy if you try harder. You had a good year (.389 OBP) but let’s learn to be a little more aggresive early in the count. You’ve had far more at bats where you’ve gotten yourself into a two strike count (330) than when you’ve been ahead in the count (144). When you’re @ a two strike count you’re a .227/.316 hiteer. When you’re ahead in the count you’re a .306/.549 hitter. Be selective but also be aggresive when the pitcher is aggresive in the strike zone.
-Hughes- You were made the #5 starter over Joba because you flashed a decent and developing Change and Cutter. Then for somes reason you put those two pitches in your pocket and relied heavily on your FB and Curve. Because you were aggresive with the FB you got ahead in the count but then seemed unable to get them out. That was a major problem in the ALCS. Either refine your CH and make it a ko pitch or learn how to get more GB outs like CC.
-AJ- Wow……you really need a 3rd pitch. Work on that Change up.
-Joba- Work your butt of this offseason. Come into ST in top shape. Master your mechanics and try to summon the Joba of 2007.
Do these things and maybe #28 will come next Oct/Nov.
Get yr own blog, they’re free.
I know but I like it here. I feel so at home.
I enjoyed this post very much and thought it gave intelligent insight to the situation the Yankees will be facing this winter and the next year.
I think the Greinke deal is unnecessary and most likely won’t happen. Would I be happy if it somehow did? Perhaps, depending on what we gave up for him. I think we need to tap into our farm system more than we have in the past. Who knows, great things like Cano and Gardner can come up (just to mention the most recent farm system successes).
Ivan Nova, although having a brief season in the majors, showed some good stuff and maintained his poise while pitching. I think he’ll be a great number 5 starter.
Assuming there is a good chance we get Cliff Lee, having the rotation of CC, Lee, Pettite (possibly), Hughes, AJ, and Nova, seems pretty good to me. I like my chances with Nova next year rather than what we had this year with the ever-shaky Vasquez. If we lose out on Pettite, I would even give Mosely another shot for the 5th spot and maybe move Nova up to the 4th. I’m personally done with Mitre and Gaudin and am sick of seeing the two of them come in games. They have proved to be good at times, and to be terrible at other times. I realize that is the dichotomy of this game, but there is something about the two of them that even if they pitched a no hitter for the Yanks, I probably would still not like them. Granted, personal likes and dislikes shouldn’t really factor into contracts or trade decisions, I’m just making a point.
Resigning Wood would be great for the Yankees as the 8th inning man, especially having CC and Lee in the one and two spots. Sometimes we may not even need his services, but it’s great to have him there rather than someone else.
I trust Robertson will shake off his poor outings in the ALCS and continue to do well in the regular season this next year. He would be a great 7th inning man to match up with Boone Logan. Joba can stay in the bullpen and work out his troubles and take his turn with Robertson.
I do believe Jeter will be back to his normal self this next season. His work ethic is unmatched and he knows and realizes what New York and all of the Yankee fans expect from him, as well as the organization. This season was a fluke for him, that cannot be attributed to turning one year older. He goes from having one of the best seasons in his life last year to his worst, one year does not make that difference. He’s been putting up almost the same statistics his entire career, I expect a return to those habits next year.
Maybe Tex will get off to a better start next year after he rests up this season and heals the various injuries he has. He works himself to death it seems, rehabing from his injuries may be the thing he needs to take his mind off of everything and just hit with the ability God gave him rather than think about it and start the season with a BA below 200.
I love Gardner and how he plays (enough to order his jersey and pay the extra money because its not in mass production lol). He and Cano are the two young guys to watch bring this Yankee team to future playoffs and hopefully world series. Hughes can be there too. Who knows, Pettite, Jeter, and Mo may decide not to hang up their spikes 10 years down the road when these become the new core four, perhaps with the addition of Montero. Of course I’m kidding, I don’t think there could ever be a new core four, but boy it’s wonderful to dream.
I agree with DHing Posada most games and having Montero catch the other. If Pettite stays, as you suggested, having Posada catch those games would be perfect. I’d like to see the Yankees keep Lance Berkman as a backup 1B and DH when Posada gets a day off. I think he really grew into the Yankee organization and towards the end became a very important part. Pena and Nunez would be great backups still for their positions, especially if Pena keeps working on his outfielding abilities.
A deal for Crawford or Werth would be unnecessary and a luxury (plus the Phils would be very dumb to get rid of Werth). I like the speed and power from Granderson in CF and the speed and guts from Gardner in LF and the power and suave from Swish in RF. Position wise, with the exception of catcher, I think we’re set to go for 2010.
A-Rod looked out of shape this year. Down year and still #3 in RBI’s but he really looked out of shape.
Root for the Giants. Although I am a Giants fan I find it hard to bring myself to dis-like the Rangers.
Only because they beat the Yankees. Don’t lie
Super utility type infielder would be immense to play the infield YFS78, especially one that can hit. I despised Billy Hall, but someone that K’s less, can play IF, maybe fill in the OF some even like that is well withing the NYY payroll ranges and think you would admit the bench before July deals was a major weakness.
You forgot to tell to brush their teeth and clean under their fingernails.
Seriously, I agree with just about the whole posting, except on Pettitte and Werth. I really believe Andy will call it quits, he almost broke down when answering the question when it was posed to him on two previous occasions.
I also think the Yankees will go after Werth in order to bolster their Right handed attack. Swisher has improved over last year during the season, but has been a bust in the Play-offs two years in a row while Werth has been stellar.Keep in mind that Swisher was brought in to be a 4th OF before Nady got hurt and ran with the job when it was given to him. Werth is a superior player. Otherwise you’re right on the money .
Greinke is a noted head case with stress issues – and that’s playing for the Royals. NYC would eat him alive. The move would reek of desperation and probably kill the kid’s career, too.
Greinke won’t be a yankee. I don’t see him wanting to come here. The yanks are going to re-sign Mo and Jeter. Then Sign Cliff lee or go to war against the rangers for him. The Only Bat I really want is Jim Thome to DH. Forget Crawford and Werth.
*********Not bashing Yankee payroll******************
What is the estimate for the 2011 season?? It was around $210 mil this year. They already have $140 mil spent on 8 players. Mo will get his $15 mil. Jeter at $15 mil??? That’s $170 mil without AP and Cliff Lee. Even at $10 and $20 mil that $200 mil on 12 players. Hughes and Joba are arb elig. You pretty much have Cliff Lee and the same 2010 team less JV, Berkman and Wood…
Actually, once you factor in Hughes/Joba, as well as fill out your bullpen and bench players, and resigning players (they want to bring Wood back) you’re probably looking closer to the $215-220M range in 2011.
I believe that if the yankees wanted to they could get whoever they desire. For instance just look back at the 08 offseason. No one even thought about the idea of one team bringing the top 3 free agents.
Point being if the yankees want Lee no team will even imagine the sort of money the yankees could put out there; even if that means incerasing the payroll.
As for Greinke, a package of the following should be enough:
C Austin Romine
P Ivan Nova
P Joba Chamberlain
Throw Jesus in there, and they might listen.
I can’t imagine a deal for Greinke being done w/o Montero and/or Betances being in the deal over Romine. That being said, I hope the Yanks pass on Greinke.
If you call AJ & Joba old expensive junk that is a game that was designed poorly ;D
Any team with ownership that actually wants their team to win would do the exact thing that the Yankees, and the Red Sox equally so, by utilizing their revenue to put the best possible product out on the field. Teams that do not do so simply have owners that worry more about lining their pockets in the short run than they do about winning and ultimately creating an organization that has continued success both financially and record/ championship-wise. Yankees produce the most revenue because they have the largest fan base, who actually fills up the stadium day in and day out, and has best marketing. If other organizations had the same loyal fans or the intelligence in extending their brand by means of top merchandise and their own network, they would be able to hang when it comes to free agency, but to hate on the big boys for their success and ability to spend is an ignorant thing to do.
What the Yankees should do is take precoatuion to Grienke’s illness, I don’t care what people say, but pass on him. At this point Cashman should just make Montero and Betances untouchable. That said, I agree with what YanksfanSince78 said and the players to come into spring training in much improved condition and shape. To bolster the rotation, I say bring Pettitte back, look at some options in he FA market and inquire on pitchers not named Grienke. I don’t care about Lee just as our pithing improves, besides I think he’s staying in Texas, and I’d rather not offer him a massive contract. I’d rather wait 2 seasons for Betances, Banuelos, and Brackman(might be ready earlier), than offering him a contract like 6/172$. Other than that Posada should be the primary DH in 2011, Berkman would just cost more at this point and wouldn’t get fulltime. The lineup should go:
SS Derek Jeter
LF Brett Gardner
1B Mark Teixeira
3B Alex Rodriguez
2B Robinson Cano
RF Nick Swisher
DH Jorge Posada/Jesus Montero
C Jesus Montero/Francisco Cervelli
CF Curtis Granderson
Rotation:
CC Sabathia
Andy Pettitte
Phil Hughes
A.J. Burnett
Joba/Ivan Nova
No one can or will ever be an untouchable.
Rangers win the series and it’s become a war between Sox and yanks fans. I’m finding that to be a little pathetic.
Congrats Rangers. Rooting for you in the World Series.
It’s all these little instigating “tough” internet sox fans. I thought they were much better than this, all the Sox fans at Fenway I meet with my Yankee cap on are pretty down to earth
And yet it always seems someone wants to add fuel to the fire.
On the flip side, I’m kind of in awe over the amount of Yankees fans congratulating the Rangers on here. I didn’t realize you guys were capable of not being arrogant d-bags…but it’s def noted and appreciated for sure. I’m pulling for you guys to have a good winter (w/o signing Lee) so we can come back next year and do it again
Well dude, it’s your first WS appearance(I’m not saying anything like ‘we let you do it cause it’s your first time), and your guys were def the better team this go-around. And I really, really liked when Nolan Ryan and Greeneburg took over, as a sign of great things to come. Kudos to the Rangers, man
The ‘arrogant D-bags’ you speak of are usually the ones that have come into their baseball lives during the 90’s and into the 2000’s. These folks have a feeling of entitlement and have not seen the team struggle as has your team and earlier versions of the Yankees. So they think the baseball world revolves around their team. Most of my Yankees brethern on this site are intelligent and reasonable fans that know and appreciate the game and are comfortable enough with themselves team to congratulate those that deserve it.
Good Luck in the Series!