There are no sure things when it comes to starting pitching, but some teams are better-positioned than others for 2011. These nine clubs don't have to worry about Cliff Lee or any other starters this winter. As long as their pitchers stay healthy, they'll enter 2011 with strong rotations one through five.
These aren't necessarily the best rotations (or else you'd see the Cardinals here), they're the groups that will require the least maintenance this offseason. Also note that all the players below are under team control next year and that some of the teams below (Rays, Braves) have more than five viable options.
- Red Sox – Jon Lester, Clay Buchholz, Josh Beckett, John Lackey, Daisuke Matsuzaka
- Rays – David Price, James Shields, Matt Garza, Jeff Niemann, Wade Davis
- White Sox – Jake Peavy, Mark Buehrle, John Danks, Edwin Jackson, Gavin Floyd
- A's – Brett Anderson, Trevor Cahill, Dallas Braden, Gio Gonzalez, Vin Mazzaro
- Angels – Jered Weaver, Dan Haren, Ervin Santana, Joel Pineiro, Scott Kazmir
- Phillies – Roy Halladay, Roy Oswalt, Cole Hamels, Joe Blanton, Kyle Kendrick
- Braves – Tim Hudson, Tommy Hanson, Jair Jurrjens, Derek Lowe, Mike Minor
- Cubs – Ryan Dempster, Tom Gorzelanny, Carlos Silva, Randy Wells, Carlos Zambrano
- Giants – Tim Lincecum, Matt Cain, Barry Zito, Jonathan Sanchez, Madison Bumgarner
- Honorable mentions to the Blue Jays, Astros and Marlins.
I think you can add the Mariners to that list, or at least all the SPs are in-house
Felix
Vargas
Fister
Pineda
One of Pauley/French/RR-S
An ace of aces and four 4 and 5s
… too bad for M’s fans this ain’t poker
An ace of aces and four 4 and 5s
… too bad for M’s fans this ain’t poker
i dont think kyle kendrick is a definite for the phillies next year i mean maybe cause of a new year theyll start him in the rotation but after the debacle hes been this year i wouldnt be so sure
i agree, probably worley. he couldnt be any worse and he will only cost the league minimum.
Maybe they’ll trade Kendrick to Japan for real this time.
Maybe they’ll trade Kendrick to Japan for real this time.
Obviously, there are better possibilities than Kyle Kendrick. Still, Kendrick and his 4.90 ERA aren’t going to ruin the rotation in the #5 spot.
Obviously, there are better possibilities than Kyle Kendrick. Still, Kendrick and his 4.90 ERA aren’t going to ruin the rotation in the #5 spot.
Interesting concept, and I heartily agree on 6 of 9 …
Kazmir, Peavy and CZam are far from healthy/reliable imnsho
I agree, especially with Peavy.
You might want to tune in on Kazmir’s next start tonight. He’s been pitching much better since his return from the DL. His problem is confidence. No easy task learning how to be a finesse pitcher after being a flamethrower. Especially at 26 years old.
I agree…hes doing better…I would like to see him get back to his ways of old…hes way too young to be dropping to 5th in rotation and talked about being sent to the pen. I hope he really gets it going next year. (kazmir)
I agree…hes doing better…I would like to see him get back to his ways of old…hes way too young to be dropping to 5th in rotation and talked about being sent to the pen. I hope he really gets it going next year. (kazmir)
Reds–Arroyo, Cueto, Volquez, Wood, Leake
Chapman will either be the closer or the 8th inning guy.
Arroyo isn’t for sure coming back next year. He has something like a $11 million club option with $2 million buy out.
The Reds have already said several times that Chapman will be a starter. Also the Reds already have a closer, sort of.
The Reds are probably going to have to do something with Homer. He’s out of options
The Reds have already said several times that Chapman will be a starter. Also the Reds already have a closer, sort of.
The Reds are probably going to have to do something with Homer. He’s out of options
Liriano-Baker-Duensing-Slowey-Blackburn.
Sounds like the Twins have a rotation ready to go. The only question is whether or not they bring back/replace Pavano, yet again giving them 6 starters…
I hope they bring back Super Pavario, but if not there is Kyle Gibson who will be in the equation, bringing the total back to 6 pitchers.
I wouldn’t mind having Pavano back, but two Class A Draft Picks would be nice as well. Either way, a rotation of Liriano, Duensing, Baker, Blackburn & Slowey is good enough until 6′-6″ Kyle Gibson is ready AAA Rochester.
The Rays will open up a spot in the rotation for Hellickson by dealing Shields or Garza.
you got that right.
I think it’s more likely that Hellickson replaces one of Wade Davis or Jeff Niemann, since he’s better than either of them.
But Davis & Niemann are cheap; Shields & Garza are getting expensive.
I would actually look for what teams would have to offer for Niemann though. His value may be low, but who wouldn’t take a chance on young pitching and Niemann while he’s still decent?
I think Garza would be the one to go
I would actually look for what teams would have to offer for Niemann though. His value may be low, but who wouldn’t take a chance on young pitching and Niemann while he’s still decent?
But Davis & Niemann are cheap; Shields & Garza are getting expensive.
I think it’s more likely that Hellickson replaces one of Wade Davis or Jeff Niemann, since he’s better than either of them.
Suggestion for Giants – trade Zito or Sanchez for a big bat and go after a starter in offseason. Rotation of TL, Cain, Bumgarner, an offseason addition (Lee or someone), either Zito or Sanchez.
Despite the fact that no one is bringing up sending Zito to the pen again, Zito is still not worth his contract. Over the next 3 years he’s owed $57.5 million… His contract is still awful.
Its possible to trade Zito for another bad contract but in the end we would be eating alot of money … More likely we trade Rowand for an another bad contract
Its possible to trade Zito for another bad contract but in the end we would be eating alot of money … More likely we trade Rowand for an another bad contract
The only bat you’d get for zito would be vernon wells
And he is actually hitting better than most expected this season….are their other hitters who has really bad contracts for a Hitter
Soriano, Bradley… but realistically with 58 mil left on the contract, even though he’s had a decent enough season. it would basically be 2 teams swapping massive contract mistakes.
If you’re the 4th highest paid pitcher in the game then you better be in the Cy Young discussion. Realistically Zito isn’t going any where for another 2 years, that’s still one of the worst contracts in the game.
oh i agree..
If you’re the 4th highest paid pitcher in the game then you better be in the Cy Young discussion. Realistically Zito isn’t going any where for another 2 years, that’s still one of the worst contracts in the game.
let’s go crazy:
rowand and zito for
zambrano and soriano and money
!?!?!?!?!
let’s go crazy:
rowand and zito for
zambrano and soriano and money
!?!?!?!?!
That could actually make sense for Giants. However, Jays have a good enough rotation and already a few lefties so we wouldn’t want Zito and we have no one to replace Wells unfortunately.
That could actually make sense for Giants. However, Jays have a good enough rotation and already a few lefties so we wouldn’t want Zito and we have no one to replace Wells unfortunately.
Brett Anderson wont get the opening day nod after what Trevor has done
Brett Anderson is very unfortunate to get injuried… If Cahill wins the CY Young he will be 2011 Opening Day Starter vs. the Rangers
Brett Anderson is very unfortunate to get injuried… If Cahill wins the CY Young he will be 2011 Opening Day Starter vs. the Rangers
strange as it may sound, I wouldn’t be surprised if the Phillies try and trade Blanton. $8M/yr for a #4 starter (even if he is an innings eater) is a bit much when your payroll looks like theirs does.
who would take him is a more appropriate question.
They tried prior to trading Lee, culdnt get any takers…and given his contract is heavily backloaded ($3m 2010, $10.5m 2011-12) they’d have to eat tons to make something happen.
I’d bet Blanton is in Philly for at least one more year.
Now that you mention it, trading him in 2012 (if it all) would be a more plausible scenario. I guess for me, it’s more wishful thinking to make salary space to keep Werth and trading Ibanez also. But moonraker45 has a valid point, who would take either of them?
Now that you mention it, trading him in 2012 (if it all) would be a more plausible scenario. I guess for me, it’s more wishful thinking to make salary space to keep Werth and trading Ibanez also. But moonraker45 has a valid point, who would take either of them?
Oh I agree, I don’t think he’s going anywhere…but if he IS, it’s not going to be until 2012.
If Heavy B has a good season next yr, and one or more of the Phils young SP prospects looks to be ready for 2012, I could see the Phils eating half his salary and finding a trade partner for a second-tier or project prospect.
They tried prior to trading Lee, culdnt get any takers…and given his contract is heavily backloaded ($3m 2010, $10.5m 2011-12) they’d have to eat tons to make something happen.
I’d bet Blanton is in Philly for at least one more year.
I would argue that the Jays:
Morrow-Romero-Marcum-Cecil-Drabek (RLRLR) would be pretty set as next years opening day starter…
but i also thought that going in to 2010 that Snider would play everyday and Arencibia would get some time to play at minimum in september… so who knows.
It’s good to know the Giants have the starting five set already. Although, I would have accepted 4 minus Sanchez plus Uggla minus F. Sanchez!!!
Dude beggers can’t be choosers ….Sanchez is hitting close to .300 and been a good #2 hitter….Sanchez will probably snag a bat this offseason but there aren’t many boppers that can hit for HR power and free agency doesn’t present much either …Jayson Werth will be a Aaron Rowand clone if he leaves Philly and there are many DH type of players that can still hit but contagious on the field
Freddy Sanchez had a busted up knee when we traded for him…had surgery in the offseason and now it is bothering him again. He is only hitting .286. Meanwhile Uggla is hitting .281 but with 30 jacks. AND they are making close to the same money.
I also would have given up Jonathan for Bautista instead of having Guillen or Ross.
Your right when we traded for him but now his shoulder and knees problems are in the past. They aren’t bother him now…he still a good defensive 2B Sanchez>Uggla…Better hitter to get on base Sanchez>Uggla…and Sanchez SO less than Uggla….YES “THE UGGLA” CAN HIT HR BUT THAT MIGHT BE 12-15 AT JUST AT&T PARK AND HE IS A LIABILITY OF DEFENSIVE 2B …I would want Uggla’s Power but would want Sanchez to main the spot until we find a better 2B in our farm system that can hit for power (Find me a Jeff Kent in our system)
The Marlin’s home park is almost as much a pitchers park as AT&T plus he is right handed and AT&T saps left handed power more than it does right handed power if I have that right.
Uggla is one of those guys who swings really hard so he strikes out alot but also when he gets ahold of one it goes a long way and doesn’t really matter which park its in.
Land shark stadium is horrible to both RH and LH.. it does not discriminate. Get Uggs outta’ there and his power would go up. Put him in Philly and talk him into moving to 3B, where he should have moved to a couple years ago for his lack or range issues and he would probably hit 40HR or more and be a new home town favorite to boot.
Uggla would’ve been great to have at AT&T he rakes over there he’d likely the same over here. I like Sanchez still he’s carrying the load at the top of the lineup now that Torres is hurt. People forget that the Giants are a versatile team Sanchez could move to third,Sandoval to first and huff to RF if we got Uggla he would still play 2nd. Unfortunately Sabes made bad decisions in trading for Garko and not keeping Penny had he not made those decisions J.Sanchez would be in Florida and Uggla would be in SF.
The Marlin’s home park is almost as much a pitchers park as AT&T plus he is right handed and AT&T saps left handed power more than it does right handed power if I have that right.
Uggla is one of those guys who swings really hard so he strikes out alot but also when he gets ahold of one it goes a long way and doesn’t really matter which park its in.
Your right when we traded for him but now his shoulder and knees problems are in the past. They aren’t bother him now…he still a good defensive 2B Sanchez>Uggla…Better hitter to get on base Sanchez>Uggla…and Sanchez SO less than Uggla….YES “THE UGGLA” CAN HIT HR BUT THAT MIGHT BE 12-15 AT JUST AT&T PARK AND HE IS A LIABILITY OF DEFENSIVE 2B …I would want Uggla’s Power but would want Sanchez to main the spot until we find a better 2B in our farm system that can hit for power (Find me a Jeff Kent in our system)
I think the 2011 Cubs staff (Zambrano/Silva) is ready. Ready to explode at any moment after the season starts.
I think the 2011 Cubs staff (Zambrano/Silva) is ready. Ready to explode at any moment after the season starts.
The Angels are going to have to dangle one of their starters to get a big bat. One logical proposal would be a deal with Brewers that involves Ervin Santana and Prince Fielder as principles.
With Weaver, Haren and Pineiro, they would still have solid top 3, and by evening out the salaries somewhat with Santana, they’d have enough left over to fill his spot with a mid level FA.
From Brewer perspective, Santana fills the gap between Gallardo and Wolf. Narveson gives them a cheap and useful #5. That leaves the #4 spot to fill. They could find a second arm in a deal or through FA or go with an internal candidate.
I dont know man…that would either mean that moralas plays third…or fielder would…unless you wanna put him on the DH spot.
With Matsui gone it has potential to be open, but if the angels are in fact eyeing crawford or someone else speedy in the outfield, it would mean Bobby would DH. Its kinda like tetris i know…
plus I really wouldnt want to see santana go..
I dont know man…that would either mean that moralas plays third…or fielder would…unless you wanna put him on the DH spot.
With Matsui gone it has potential to be open, but if the angels are in fact eyeing crawford or someone else speedy in the outfield, it would mean Bobby would DH. Its kinda like tetris i know…
plus I really wouldnt want to see santana go..
The Angels are going to have to dangle one of their starters to get a big bat. One logical proposal would be a deal with Brewers that involves Ervin Santana and Prince Fielder as principles.
With Weaver, Haren and Pineiro, they would still have solid top 3, and by evening out the salaries somewhat with Santana, they’d have enough left over to fill his spot with a mid level FA.
From Brewer perspective, Santana fills the gap between Gallardo and Wolf. Narveson gives them a cheap and useful #5. That leaves the #4 spot to fill. They could find a second arm in a deal or through FA or go with an internal candidate.
Of course the Cubs god awful pitching rotation is posted before the likes of Houston and Florida. Figures.
This post has nothing to do with how good they are, its about how ‘set’ they are. Three of the Cubs pitchers are locked down on large contracts so they aren’t going anywhere and Gorzelanny and Wells are both young mainstays in the rotation. The Marlins and Astros may have better rotations but they have more variablity in how they will set them up.
I thought BNS explained the post pretty clearly.
I disagree with not only this post, but with the corresponding post regarding teams that will be looking for a starter this winter. The Phillies are not going to go into 2011 with Kyle Kendrick as their 5th starter. People forget that Kyle Kendrick was optioned to AAA earlier in the season. The only reason that he never made it there was because Jamie Moyer was injured, and Kyle had to be recalled. Both Charlie Manuel and Rich Dubee (pitching coach) have voiced their displeasure in Kendrick, and with Jamie Moyer a free agent after the season, that fifth starter’s role is wide open. Maybe they hand the job to Vance Worley, who’s impressed, but like you said with the Cardinals, the Phillies could be in the market for a cheap, maybe risky, starting pitching.
Just on a side note though… This may sounds absolutely insane, but the Phillies could actually upgrade their bullpen by adding Kyle Kendrick to it. (Crazy, I know.) He’s been really good against right handed hitters, and may do well coming out of the bullpen to avoid facing lefties. Just a thought though.
I disagree with not only this post, but with the corresponding post regarding teams that will be looking for a starter this winter. The Phillies are not going to go into 2011 with Kyle Kendrick as their 5th starter. People forget that Kyle Kendrick was optioned to AAA earlier in the season. The only reason that he never made it there was because Jamie Moyer was injured, and Kyle had to be recalled. Both Charlie Manuel and Rich Dubee (pitching coach) have voiced their displeasure in Kendrick, and with Jamie Moyer a free agent after the season, that fifth starter’s role is wide open. Maybe they hand the job to Vance Worley, who’s impressed, but like you said with the Cardinals, the Phillies could be in the market for a cheap, maybe risky, starting pitching.
Just on a side note though… This may sounds absolutely insane, but the Phillies could actually upgrade their bullpen by adding Kyle Kendrick to it. (Crazy, I know.) He’s been really good against right handed hitters, and may do well coming out of the bullpen to avoid facing lefties. Just a thought though.
kdub33,
There’s no guaranty you can get Crawford. But even if you did, you’d have problem benching either of your corner OF? A lot of teams will get in the chase for Crawford. You’re Angels team has posted a putrid .315 OBP this year. Fielder has posted back to back seasons with OBP over .400, and even though this has been an off year for him he’s still leading the NL in walks. As good as Morales is, he’s not a real patient hitter. Fielder’s still one of the premier sluggers in all baseball. I would expect Fielder to DH in that lineup.
As for Santana, you have to give up something to get something. Angels need offense and they don’t have the young stud pitching to deal.
I’m also thinking Scott Boras will view Angels as realistic suitors for Fielder long term and may be willing to strike a deal.
kdub33,
There’s no guaranty you can get Crawford. But even if you did, you’d have problem benching either of your corner OF? A lot of teams will get in the chase for Crawford. You’re Angels team has posted a putrid .315 OBP this year. Fielder has posted back to back seasons with OBP over .400, and even though this has been an off year for him he’s still leading the NL in walks. As good as Morales is, he’s not a real patient hitter. Fielder’s still one of the premier sluggers in all baseball. I would expect Fielder to DH in that lineup.
As for Santana, you have to give up something to get something. Angels need offense and they don’t have the young stud pitching to deal.
I’m also thinking Scott Boras will view Angels as realistic suitors for Fielder long term and may be willing to strike a deal.
I’d be willing to bet the Cubs starting rotation does not look like that to start the season.
you better hope not! If not they will be lucky to finish ahead of the Pirates next season
They can improve from with in and via trade. By That I mean trade some of the guys listed and put younger guys in the rotation. Like I said, I doubt that they start the year with those 5, and it wouldn’t surprise me if they got someone via free agency.
you better hope not! If not they will be lucky to finish ahead of the Pirates next season
I’d be willing to bet the Cubs starting rotation does not look like that to start the season.
I may be a bit biased but Oakland’s rotation may be the best in the bigs next year. With 2 solid bats, you are looking at a very solid playoff team.
Phillies have the best rotation.
Uhhh, no… I think SFG makes a strong argument to dispute this (they have a complete rotation with lights out closer), NYY, BOS (if healthy)… The upside to these rotations are huge… Philly will be good, but missing a lights out closer. Huge necessity for them. If SDG resigns, they make a strong argument for best in majors also IMO unless we are strictly discussing front 5, which I think NYY and SFG still keep the number 1 spot, and BOS squeezes in.
I meant better, not best. That’s my error.
I meant better, not best. That’s my error.
Uhhh, no… I think SFG makes a strong argument to dispute this (they have a complete rotation with lights out closer), NYY, BOS (if healthy)… The upside to these rotations are huge… Philly will be good, but missing a lights out closer. Huge necessity for them. If SDG resigns, they make a strong argument for best in majors also IMO unless we are strictly discussing front 5, which I think NYY and SFG still keep the number 1 spot, and BOS squeezes in.
a rotation is 5 pitchers, not 1 ace, 2 above average pitchers and 2 lemons
I won’t say that the Phillies have the best rotation, because then people would flame me for being biased, but I could easily argue that the Phillies have three aces, and two quality back of the rotation starters. I’m not sure who your “lemons” are, but a healthy Phillies rotation would inclue Joe Blanton and Jamie Moyer, two very servicable guys. Even with Kyle Kendrick in the rotation, the Phillies rank among the top 5 in 7 starting pitching categories, and are 6th in strikeouts. I’
Roy Halladay is the only ace of the staff.. not only is he their only ace, but he’s probably (arguably ofcourse) the best pitcher in baseball (or one of) . So obviously if your counting all his IP’s, SO’s, CG’s etc sure its going add to the staff’s overall stats… Hamels is not an ace, he’s having a much better year, but you put him up against a Price or Sabathia in the WS and you’re overmatched, its why they acquired Lee originally isn’t? Would they have if they felt Hamels was a bonafide 1? doubtful.. Oswalt is also a very good pitcher, but still falls short of a premier rotation leader.. and my lemons are blanton and kendrick. one of which will probably have to start in the playoffs.
That’s a ridiculous argument. Obviously, you can only have one “ace” (which simply means a team’s best starter, no?), but the Phillies have three guys that could be aces on several different teams in Roy Halladay, Cole Hamels and Roy Oswalt. As you said, Roy Halladay is the “ace” of the Phillies staff, and one of the elite pitchers in baseball, but your argument against the other two (Hamels and Oswalt), is absurd. Cole Hamels should be in the same conversation as David Price and CC Sabathia, and he would be “overmatched” by no means.
David Price may be having a career year, yes, but in what way would Cole Hamels be “overmatched” in facing CC Sabathia? Is it that his ERA is .03 points higher? Hamels has a better K/9 and BB/9, and could be the “ace” of many contending teams. Please enlighten me as to how he’s “overmatched” by Sabathia and Price, because to me, “overmatched” means that he’d have no chance of winning against them, and I disagree.
The same could be said for Roy Oswalt, who actually has a lower ERA than CC Sabathia, who has a better K/9 than CC Sabathia, and a better BB/9 than Sabathia AND Cole Hamels. Bottom line is that Hamels and Oswalt could both be the anchor, or the “ace” of a contending staff. BOTH have gone to the World Series, and Cole Hamels has won a World Series, in which he was the MVP of that World Series in ’08. Neither guy would be overmatched, and both are what we define as “aces.”
I’d also like to be enlightened as to how one of Blanton or Kendrick would have to start in the playoffs. They certainly won’t have to start in a 5 game series, and the Phillies could easily go with Halladay / Hamels / Oswalt in a seven game series, similar to what the Yankees did in ’09. So as cliche as it sounds, when life hands me lemons, I’ll make lemonade, and bring either Blanton or Kendrick out of the bullpen to get tough right handed hittersm which both have done very well.
yada yada yada. i know that you can have more then one ace on a staff, but the phillies don’t have more then one is my point.. and please stop looking at era as means for comparing pitchers in different leagues, especially when sabathia and price have to face the best offenses in the league while oswalt came from one of the worst and the phillies in a pitcher heavy but not too strong offensively division..
If you actually think that Hamels or Oswalt is a better pitcher then Price or Sabathia your delusional. . There is a reason why midway through 2009 the team made gave up the farm not once but twice to acquire a true ace to out duel other teams front line starters.. If they felt Hamels was truly that good they would have used the prospects to acquire other needs, or kept some of the prospects and filled out the back of the rotation.
and yet again your wrong with the 3 man rotation . MLB has condensed the playoff schedule this year as a response to complaints of too many off days last year. The yankees went with a 3 man rotation because their were off days. Maybe you should look stuff up before you try your hardest to prove people wrong.
Actually your wrong, mlb is giving the winner of the NL at seasons end to pick their opening rouncd schedule. Maybe you should relax. I know it’s pretty amazing to this a team as smart as the Phillies would give up prospects for proven, quality and highly reliable front of the rotation starters. Gosh, it’s just absurd when they have all those extra openings. Excuse me waiter! Please let the Phillies trade prospects for relief pitchers and fill-ins for Utley and Polanco cause I’d much rather have Ty Wiggington tan Oswalt.
We already won a world series with Cole as our #1 and then the Yankees signed a bunch of aces, the Braves have Hudson, Hanson and Jurrjens and the Card have Wainwright, Carpenter and Garcia. Before Roy 2.0 arrived our #3 was Blanton who was getting hit hard. So I still do not understand where else the Phillies would have upgraded that would have benefitted them most. Sure, Happ is performing excellent, but with prospects your never sure.
Also, Oswalt’s xfip and WAR are both better than Price’s. Mainly due to Price’s bb rate. If there is anyone being forgotten here it’s Liriano. His stats are amazing. gb rate over 50, .2 hr/9, bb/9 is at 2.7.
“Actually your wrong, mlb is giving the winner of the NL at seasons end to pick their opening rouncd schedule.”
The opening round is not a seven game series. That’s not just an NL thing, the league did that years ago. What he’s pointing out is that the MLB condensed this year’s playoff schedule so you can’t coast through with only three pitchers anymore.
He never said they could choose between a five and seven game series. What he meant was that they could choose between starting their five game series on Wednesday or Thursday. As I said below, that COULD allow the Phillies to go with a three man rotation.
I used ERA to show a pitcher’s effectiveness. I’m tired of hearing that terrible excuse that a pitcher in the American League (East) should be given a little breathing room because they play in a tough division. The bottom line is that all of the guys we’ve mentioned, be it Hamels, Oswalt, Sabathia or Price, will all have to pitch in games, both inside and outside of their divisions, against teams that can hit. You may not be as up to date with the NL East as I am, but the Braves, Marlins, and even the Nationals, all have teams that can put on a good offensive showing. I’m not saying that Hamels and Sabathia are on an equal plane. What I’m saying is that the plane is not that different, and refuting your point that either Hamels or Oswalt would be overmatched in a game against Sabathia or Price. They would not be.
I understand where you’re coming from with your comments about Roy Halladay and Cliff Lee. I got it the first time. What you misunderstand is that the Phillies did not trade for either guy because they didn’t have faith in Cole Hamels as an ace. They acqured Cliff Lee at the trade deadline because Hamels was struggling. Not because his stuff wasn’t good. You’re talking about a guy who had put together terrific seasons from late ’06 – ’08, and struggled for one year in ’09. I’d hardly call one off year a reason to not consider Cole Hamels as an ace. Ruben Amaro isn’t completely idiotic. He knew that the Phillies wouldn’t be able to win a World Series in ’09 with the way that the rotation had struggled, and needed to acquire a similar piece in the offseason. It has nothing to do with the effectiveness these guys have had this year.
Now, the Phillies can go with a three man rotation deep into the playoffs by pitching guys on short rest. Looking at the schedule, it’s completely plausible, and I’m not sure how those changes effected said three man rotation. The team with the best record chooses how the schedule would be played out, and conceivably, the Phillies could go:
Wednesday – Roy Halladay
Friday – Cole Hamels
Saturday – Roy Oswalt
Sunday – Roy Halladay
Obviously, you may not want to do this so early in the postseason, but it’s completely plausible to throw a guy like Halladay on 3 days rest. Or, you could throw a “lemon” like Blaton, who has pitched well in the post season, and use Halladay for Game 4. The changes to the postseason schedule do not disallow using a three man rotation. It makes it more difficult to do so. I’m not trying to prove you wrong. I’m trying to show you why your points are invalid…. Okay, I’m trying to prove you wrong.
Roy Halladay is the only ace of the staff.. not only is he their only ace, but he’s probably (arguably ofcourse) the best pitcher in baseball (or one of) . So obviously if your counting all his IP’s, SO’s, CG’s etc sure its going add to the staff’s overall stats… Hamels is not an ace, he’s having a much better year, but you put him up against a Price or Sabathia in the WS and you’re overmatched, its why they acquired Lee originally isn’t? Would they have if they felt Hamels was a bonafide 1? doubtful.. Oswalt is also a very good pitcher, but still falls short of a premier rotation leader.. and my lemons are blanton and kendrick. one of which will probably have to start in the playoffs.
I won’t say that the Phillies have the best rotation, because then people would flame me for being biased, but I could easily argue that the Phillies have three aces, and two quality back of the rotation starters. I’m not sure who your “lemons” are, but a healthy Phillies rotation would inclue Joe Blanton and Jamie Moyer, two very servicable guys. Even with Kyle Kendrick in the rotation, the Phillies rank among the top 5 in 7 starting pitching categories, and are 6th in strikeouts. I’
a rotation is 5 pitchers, not 1 ace, 2 above average pitchers and 2 lemons
Nah… Tampa probably does.
1. D-Price
2. Hellboy
3. Davis/Garza/Big Game James
4. Niemann/Garza/Big Game James
5. Niemann
And with Tampa coming up with Matt Moore, Alexander Torres, Alex Colome, and Jake McGee it’s only going to get better.
You are probably right on with the Rays THIS YEAR having the top rotation. Now, we need to see if Nieman, Davis and Price can repeat and also the Rays have this nasty habit of unloading people making salaries appropriate for what they deliver, like Garza and Shields, so for next year is in flux.
That repeat deal have to remember Andy Sonanstine however and how he flopped his second year in the rotation. TB however has plenty of options coming behind them however now, just as they did last year when Sonanstine bombed out.
Jays should be deep also, Boston still has Doubront behind the 5 and venerable 6th Wakefield. Some pretty decent/deep ones out there.
I hope you’re using that title sarcastically. I am still puzzled as to why people persist on calling Shields “Big Game James” considering his career mediocre numbers against quality lineups.
Within their division thats perfectly plausible.. They desperately need some power though, but their rotation is coming along very nicely
Just a guess, Ben, but are you a Cardinals fan?
Just a guess, Ben, but are you a Cardinals fan?
oakland certainly has a scary rotation same with toronto and tampa.atlanta phili st louis san diego.tampa i dont think is trading garza they will have alot of money off the books with cc pena soriano they can trade shields though get a nice solid bat or something
THE PIRATES ARE SET
1.)OVER-PRICED BUM
2.)SOFT TOSSING LEFTY
3.)WAVIER PICKUP
4.)PROSPECT THAT AMOUNTS TO NOTHING
5.) AAAA PITCHER
Bet the Pirates sign Justin Duchscherer (they wanted him last year) and add “ALWAYS INJURED FORMER ALL-STAR.”
Also in breaking Pirates news, The Pirates have succesfully signed local man to a contract after witnessing him throw a piece of crumbled up paper into a garbage can without incident, Garbage can next in line for contract.
Any of these rotations could change before 2011 with trades, but interesting none the less. Maybe the next post could be projected rotations for 2011. Where will Cliff Lee land? Who is likely to get traded and where?
funny how the phillies got cliff lee when their rotation was already “set.” A’s traded mazzaro, not sure if their rotation is set now. They got rich harden but failed to hammer out a contract with Iwakuma. Some of these rotation’s are even 6 (phillies – lee, red sox – wakefield) or 7 (rays – heckilson, sonstantine) deep