Ted Lilly may have made his last start as a Cub last night, tossing five-plus shutout innings in Houston while lowering his ERA to 3.69. The latest on the lefty up top:
- The Dodgers are more focused on Lilly and Paul Maholm than Roy Oswalt, according to ESPN.com's Jayson Stark.
- The market for Lilly has picked up, according to Stark (on Twitter). The Tigers are involved, and so are the Dodgers, Twins and Phillies.
- The Phillies have inquired on Lilly, according to Rosenthal (on Twitter). Ed Price of AOL FanHouse hears rumblings about a possible Lilly-J.A. Happ deal (Twitter link). However, Stark hears that the Phils, who are on the lefty's no-trade list, won't deal Happ for Lilly. The Twins and Dodgers remain involved, but the Mets are waiting to hear "from above" before pursuing Lilly more aggressively, according to Rosenthal.
- The Cubs have indicated a recent willingness to assume some of the $4.43MM owed to Lilly, reports ESPN's Jayson Stark. That'd help the chances of a Dodgers deal. Unfortunately for the Cubs, potential Lilly suitors like the Mets and Tigers may be reassessing their chances.
- The Twins have asked about Lilly, reports Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports, but their presence on his no-trade list means he'd require additional compensation to accept a deal.
Eh……
Well, I would like to see Lilly in Minnesota-can you imagine the sight of ‘Lil Ted Lilly standing next to the humongous Joe Mauer at a mound conference? Now THAT would be fun!
Seriously, it would be a good move-Lilly has pitched better than any of the starters on the Twins staff not named Liriano or Pavano.
If you look at ERA only, yes, he’s pitching better. If you look at many other stats, he should be at an ERA in the mid-4’s. He’s better than Blackburn, but about equal to Slowey.
Baker is the opposite of Lilly, they should switch ERA’s because Baker is pitching like Lilly’s ERA and Lilly is pitching like Slowey’s. Lilly pitched A LOT better last year.
I’d say Pavano, Liriano and Baker are better than Lilly. Not sure about Duensing yet, since this will only be his second start.
No, he’s pitching fine. Trust me. He’s only gotten hit hard twice. And he’s had zero run support all season. Any team that gets Lilly, especially at a discount, is stealing him. He threw in the low 90’s last night, and he should have thrown about 8 innings, but Jerry Davis had the squeeze on for some reason. (Below the belt was high, at the knees was low, and apparently two inches on either corner didn’t exist.)
Lilly wasn’t really ready to come back in April, and then he had two or three bad starts in the aftermath of his near-no-hitter. Those have inflated some of his numbers. But he’s looked a lot better lately. He’s absolutely pitched better than Baker. I can’t believe the Cubs are willing to pay some of the salary, that just seems pointless.
Probably good to point out that xFIP and SIERA diverge pretty strongly on Lilly. SIERA has him as a pretty good, above average, solid #3 pitcher these last few years, while xFIP has him as a back-end guy (mid/high-4s).
Lilly has pitched better than Haren this year and probably almost as well as Oswalt. He should be in pretty high demand for teams in the race. Hopefully the cubs can get a few solid prospects in the deal. I wonder who the cubs will put in the rotation if Lilly leaves? We might see Mr Roid rage aka Zambrano back there again.
If Lilly is traded, the right move would be to put Cashner back in the starting rotation.
You won’t get a few solid prospects for a 2-month rental of a guy with 3 wins this year. And Zambrano isn’t going back into the rotation for the Cubs….maybe ever.
I don’t think the team Lilly is traded to will care about wins… unless he’s going to Arizona, which I doubt.
It is often the run support that dictates the amount of wins. The examples are endless.
Yes, In fairness for run support, Lilly has the lowest support in MLB for a starter with his amount of starts. At least that stat was current for him not long ago. I have not looked, but I don’t see it changing upward much. He faced Myers his is last two starts who pitched very well for himself. Lilly received no runs last night and I want to say one run the previous start. Again, I would have to look. Bottom line, the Cubs do not hit for Lilly or consistantly, period.
Yes, In fairness for run support, Lilly has the lowest support in MLB for a starter with his amount of starts. At least that stat was current for him not long ago. I have not looked, but I don’t see it changing upward much. He faced Myers his is last two starts who pitched very well for himself. Lilly received no runs last night and I want to say one run the previous start. Again, I would have to look. Bottom line, the Cubs do not hit for Lilly or consistantly, period.
Really? Wins? Jesus I thought we’d went beyond this. That’s like saying a dude leading the league in RBI is the best hitter.
Well, wins and RBIs do tell a story. Wins do show an ability to pitch deep into games, enough to qualify. RBIs do belie a manager’s faith in the hitter to put him in an RBI slot.
I remember when I first got into baseball 45 years ago, and tried to affect some trendy stats lingo, just to pretend I knew more than anyone else.
Calm down, and at some point, you’ll understand that the batter isn’t running to go get the ball after he hits it.
I’ve still got to disagree with you. You can earn yourself more opportunities for RBI by doing a better job with the bat — or you can be Bengie Molina batting 4th for the Giants the past few years getting 80 RBI a year as a catcher. You can be as defiant as you like with what I said, but both stats are some of the worst to categorize a player.
If Ted Lilly were Rich Harden, I would be much more inclined to agree with you on the W statistic. But he’s been throwing 7+ a majority of the time, and less than 6 IP just 4 times (in accordance with the deep into games comment).
But again — i think both stats have their place, but if we’re describing real value on a player — they don’t belong.
I’ve still got to disagree with you. You can earn yourself more opportunities for RBI by doing a better job with the bat — or you can be Bengie Molina batting 4th for the Giants the past few years getting 80 RBI a year as a catcher. You can be as defiant as you like with what I said, but both stats are some of the worst to categorize a player.
If Ted Lilly were Rich Harden, I would be much more inclined to agree with you on the W statistic. But he’s been throwing 7+ a majority of the time, and less than 6 IP just 4 times (in accordance with the deep into games comment).
But again — i think both stats have their place, but if we’re describing real value on a player — they don’t belong.
Lilly has the lowest run support of any starting pitcher in the majors this season, so you can throw wins out. His other stats are good, and he’s been very consistent over the past 4 years, including this season.
Zambrano will have to go back into the rotation for the Cubs if they ever want to trade him. Nobody is trading for an $18 million per year middle reliever. And keeping Z in the pen is a horrible move. He’s not a great starter anymore, but unless the Cubs are going to cut him, he needs to be in the rotation.
You pretty much have no idea what your talking about Lilly has probably received the lowest run support in the league. If the cubs were scoring runs when he pitched he would probably be leading the team in wins. With the way he’s pitched this year I think it’s safe to say we will get something good in return for him.
You pretty much have no idea what your talking about Lilly has probably received the lowest run support in the league. If the cubs were scoring runs when he pitched he would probably be leading the team in wins. With the way he’s pitched this year I think it’s safe to say we will get something good in return for him.
not to burst your bubble but a win loss record is a pointless stat.
Lilly to Philly!
Not so fast. He does have home run and fly ball tendencies. That park would be difficult for him.
Wrigley Field and Camden Yards are tied for 6th most HRs while Citizens Bank Park is 17th so far in 2010. It is not an exact indicator of how a pitcher will perform and Lilly is a flyball pitcher, but the odds would benefit him based on that stat.
Wrigley Field and Camden Yards are tied for 6th most HRs while Citizens Bank Park is 17th so far in 2010. It is not an exact indicator of how a pitcher will perform and Lilly is a flyball pitcher, but the odds would benefit him based on that stat.
johnmiltonrocks, i can’t believe the name Pavano is in that post…you’re right, but still it seems a little crazy to see
I know! That’s why it’s so hard to ever give up on pitchers-if they have talent, and don’t give up on themselves, how can you give up on them? I know a lot of pitchers with Pavano’s injury history never make it back, but it’s also true some of them do. He has been solid for the Twins this year.
If Tremendous Ted went to Minnesota, I’d be so happy.
Why would he have the Twins on his no-trade list?
Might be the size of the market? Not sure why else. It’s a good organization committed to winning, from what I can tell.
he didn’t have a problem playing in Toronto though?
because its the twins and nobody likes the twins is all I can come up with…
No one like’s teams that run their organization the right way and have been successful basically all of the last decade.
yeah pretty much, look where all that success has gotten them…to a few divisional series. you can wear those central divison champion t-shirts every day for all I care, I’ll take one WS champions shirt from 05 thank you very much.
We will have our time soon enough.
not with that pitching staff
Right, we handled you guys with our “pitching staff.” 1 WS win in the last 92 years is nothing to brag about.
I guess we could look at the last 92 years but I really think its irrelevant given the fact that were talking about the past decade. But fine, you’re right one world series in 92 years isnt great.
I’m not trying to get into a di*k measuring contest or anything, just saying our offense could be good enough to get us by if we can just get decent pitching. Aside from Pavano and Liriano it’s been here and there. Duensing looked good and with his pitch count expanding, he could become a solid #3/#4 and if they bring in Lilly they could have a solid enough rotation to make a run if there bats keep going.
Right, we handled you guys with our “pitching staff.” 1 WS win in the last 92 years is nothing to brag about.
not with that pitching staff
You have no room to brag anymore, it’s not 2006. The Yankees fans have 27 of those things they call World Series Championships.
again, in the last decade the white sox have had just as much success championship-wise as the yankees. next point?
Not that I really care, but in the last 10 WS Yanks won 2000 and 2009, the sox of the white variety won in 2005. So no, they haven’t had as much success as the Yanks in the past decade. Not that the Twins can talk, Yanks have infinitely more than them in the same span. And so do the Sox.
But as a Twins fan, what burns me even more is that 3 different AL Central teams have even BEEN to the WS in the past decade and not once was it the Twins.
Hopefully we can win one before oil depletion destroys civilization š
again, in the last decade the white sox have had just as much success championship-wise as the yankees. next point?
You have no room to brag anymore, it’s not 2006. The Yankees fans have 27 of those things they call World Series Championships.
I dunno but he was with the Jays before coming to chicago so maybe something happened while playing against them or maybe he just doesnt like the town. the twin cities aint no Miami, chi, la…………..
The Dome or most of the 90’s teams is my guess. The Dome was mostly a hitters park until the end, I think. Pitchers don’t like that. Plus, it was the Dome…
lilly to the dodgers. cubs willing to eat part of his salary. SOLD. Get it done NED!!!!
That is a terrible idea! Why would the Cubs pony up some of his salary while also losing the draft picks that his A status would give them? I could possibly see this if a bad contract player was going with Lilly, but not straight up. Whoever they get better be a high prospect or major league ready…
I was thinking the same thing. I know teams are really watching the money these days and the Dodgers are basically broke right now. Hendry better end up with a good deal.
Also, if Mr. Ricketts is willing to eat some of Lilly’s money, you know they are going to have to eat a whole lot of bad to try and move players now and the offseason.
I was thinking the same thing. I know teams are really watching the money these days and the Dodgers are basically broke right now. Hendry better end up with a good deal.
Also, if Mr. Ricketts is willing to eat some of Lilly’s money, you know they are going to have to eat a whole lot of bad to try and move players now and the offseason.
If Ted Lilly goes into 2011 FA market with a Type “A”lbatross hanging around his neck, he better look into finding a team around March at the earliest.
That is a terrible idea! Why would the Cubs pony up some of his salary while also losing the draft picks that his A status would give them? I could possibly see this if a bad contract player was going with Lilly, but not straight up. Whoever they get better be a high prospect or major league ready…
A.L Central is the worst division in baseball
Any Sox fans out there think Z would be a good fit for them? As a Cubs fan I’m legitimately asking..his desire to stay in Chicago while still getting a change of scenery would suit him well, I think.
With that said, what happened to Big Z……
I hate to say it but i think there would be a fit, IF the Cubs are willing to pay a TON of that contract and would accept 2 low level prospects or something like that. If Big Z ever had a shot of rebounding in his career it would be playing for his buddy ozzie and working with pitching coach Don Cooper who has a great track record of fixing highly talented broken pitchers (danks, floyd)
Since when was Danks broken? Floyd had mechanical problems, but a lot of pitching coaches don’t see that these days(Larry Rothschild) so I do give him credit.
We can take Peavy. His bad mechanics are starting to bite him in the butt. The salary just about matches up. I’ll take his three straight years with DL stints over this club cancer.
Since when was Danks broken? Floyd had mechanical problems, but a lot of pitching coaches don’t see that these days(Larry Rothschild) so I do give him credit.
We can take Peavy. His bad mechanics are starting to bite him in the butt. The salary just about matches up. I’ll take his three straight years with DL stints over this club cancer.
I hate to say it but i think there would be a fit, IF the Cubs are willing to pay a TON of that contract and would accept 2 low level prospects or something like that. If Big Z ever had a shot of rebounding in his career it would be playing for his buddy ozzie and working with pitching coach Don Cooper who has a great track record of fixing highly talented broken pitchers (danks, floyd)
Any Sox fans out there think Z would be a good fit for them? As a Cubs fan I’m legitimately asking..his desire to stay in Chicago while still getting a change of scenery would suit him well, I think.
With that said, what happened to Big Z……
the dodgers should go out and get him if the cubs are willing to eat up some of his salary.
That probably means the Dodgers are gonna have to part with Martin or Withrow. Not worth it, in my opinion. C’mon Phillies! Take him!
Cubs fans aren’t that optimistic. I mean, i know they’re not familiar with our system, but i saw one of them claiming that Scott Van Slyke is the prize that they need to bring back. Lol.
I at least want someone decent for Tremendous Ted, he’s one of my favorites.
are you talking about Ethan martin because i do not think they would get rid of Russel Martin since the Cubs already have Geovany Soto
man, i can’t believe were gonna get lilly. i would rather get the man that outpitched lilly last night, brett myers.
. . . just heard on the radio that the Tigers were looking at Scott Podsednik?
nm, I might have misheard.
No offense to Cubby faithful or Lilly himself, but he’s just somebody that’s reliable to take the 5th spot. That’s fine and all but they need a “match up” guy in the 1-3 slots for the playoffs if they get there; they have had that proven to them twice in a row by Philly.
He averages 6.5 IP per start, has a decent 3.69 ERA (119 ERA+), a 1.14 WHIP, and he’s consistent. Go find me 10 #5 SPs that have better numbers.
By that, I mean find 10 teams with 4 better starters.
Thanks for the stats, I still think he’s garbage.
I’d throw Padilla & Kuroda ahead of Lilly, so that’s #5.
So you claim ONE instance in which he could be a #5, disregarding the numbers Kuroda has put up. He averages only 6.1 IP per start, has a higher WHIP (1.30), a lower ERA+ (111), a lower K-BB ratio, and a career-high ERA+ of 112, a number Lilly has bested 7 times, including this season.
And would you today take Billingsley’s 1.37 WHIP, 4.00 ERA, 2.4 K-BB, and 97 ERA+ over Lilly without a thought?
So, calling him just a #5 on a personal preference that really isn’t backed up by any stats, doesn’t make him a #5 under every condition. If you can only provide one potential #5 condition, how is he JUST a #5 that can’t really win unless it’s under certain matchups?
He’s simply a #5 in LA, no catbox lining moneyball book changes that.
No offense to Cubby faithful or Lilly himself, but he’s just somebody that’s reliable to take the 5th spot. That’s fine and all but they need a “match up” guy in the 1-3 slots for the playoffs if they get there; they have had that proven to them twice in a row by Philly.
can we fire amaro yet lilly is not that much better than happ, but hes making 12mil more, hes 34, and happ is locked up for a lot longer. But amaros our gm so well probably add more prospect along with happ.
As an A FA he’d get 2 draft picks to help replenish the minors…
Lol, Lilly for Happ = Worst deal ever. Lilly will be a FA and Happ will cost nothing for liek 3 more years and will be controlled for like 5.
Philly interested in Lilly and Westbrook…w00t.
Hopefully they pick one of them up today, opening the door for Oswalt to LA.
If Amaro really trades Happ for anything other than Oswalt, I think I’ll cry… and there’s no crying in baseball. ='(
lilly for happ?!?!?!!?!?!!? ill kill ruben myself if he does that…..only way happ leaves is for oswalt…and i really dont like that either
If that Lilly-Happ swap is true, then I want him going to Philly. I highly doubt they get a better offer than that from anywhere.
Hendry always finds a way to make a trade PWN.
I thought the Tigers conceded already.
I find it hard to believe the Phils would do Happ for Lilly. If that rumor has any truth though, Hendry better do it.
happ is better than lilly!
why would the tigers be interested in lilly? why? it makes no sense. we are literally fielding a AAA lineup right now. ted lilly isnt going to win any games for us when hel be getting worse run support than hes getting right now. and why would we trade prospects for 2 months of ted lilly which will make no difference at the end of the day? either throw in the towel DD, or trade for a few cheap bats to try and delay the inevitable and let us fans feel like we will still be watching competitve tiger baseball.
I love love to see Lilly for J.A. Happ.. Cubs might have to thrown in a another players… the Phillies can have Jeff Stevens, Jeff Samarjadra and Mitch Atkins along with Lilly for Happ thats a fair trade if you ask me… not sure what the Twins have to offer ML wise.. their lineup is so good they would never part with any of them..
i kinda want the padres to pick up lilly. If the cubs pick up the money on the contract, could Cory lubke(spelling?) and adam russell work?
adam russell? he was part of the Peavy deal right? .. a friend mine actually knows him personally .. that would be cool to have him on the Cubs since she’s a cubs can and he was part of the white sox at the time.. yes Russell and whoever else you named for Lilly would be good.. personally i think Lilly and a lower prospect for JA Happ would work too.. not sure why Lilly would have a class Org team like the Philly on his “Do not trade” list
i read in USA today that the Dodgers should trade Jon Ely and James McDonald in order to acquire Lily. i was astonished! that would be the worst trade in the world for the Dodgers. Ely has looked great at timeas for the Dodgers and McDonald has loads of talent which he just hasnt gotten results from in the big leagues. Terrible idea!