The Diamondbacks seem determined to move ace Dan Haren before his next start on Tuesday, and it appeared as though the Yankees became the favorite to land the right-hander yesterday. D-Backs' CEO Derrick Hall hedged his bets, saying there was no front-runner, and that other clubs had offers "of at least equal value out there." The Twins, Tigers, Phillies, and Cardinals all continue to maintain interest in Haren as well.
With all that in mind, here is today's collection of Haren rumors, with more to come…
- Haren's no-trade list probably won't matter in the way that it has for Roy Oswalt, as Haren wants to have a chance to win, a source told Olney (via Twitter).
- Haren would prefer to stay in the west, a source told Heyman (via Twitter). However, the hurler is willing to consider all suitors, which is why talks continue with clubs like Detroit and Minnesota.
- It is possible that the Phillies will trade Jayson Werth in order to get the prospects necessary to land Haren, according to Jon Paul Morosi and Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports. Alternatively, the D'Backs could take advantage where the Phillies' farm system is strongest: its lower levels. Arizona is said to have interest in one single-A player in particular, 18-year-old slugger Jonathan Singleton.
- The Tigers don't want to give up Jacob Turner for Haren and they are also on Haren's no-trade list, tweets Heyman. He adds that Ted Lilly is a "possible second choice" for Detroit.
- There have been no conversations today between the D'Backs and the Yankees, says Olney (via Twitter).
- Arizona is asking the Tigers for pitchers Jacob Turner and Andrew Oliver, tweets Olney.
- The Dodgers were actively talking to Arizona about Haren before Josh Byrnes was fired according to FoxSports.com's Ken Rosenthal (Twitter link). They are not a prominent suitor now.
- ESPN's Buster Olney says the Yankees do not value Haren as much as they did Cliff Lee, and they consider him a risk because of his performance this year (Twitter links). Hence their reluctance to take on Haren's entire contract and deal a boatload of prospects.
- The Yankees are willing to surrender Nova, pitching prospect Zach McAllister, and two prospects for Haren, but they will not eat money and include Chamberlain in a trade, tweets SI.com's Jon Heyman. McAllister's father works in Arizona's scouting department. In a second tweet, Heyman says the Yanks would be willing to pay all of the money left on Haren's deal, but they balked at taking Chad Qualls and Chris Snyder as well.
- ESPN's Jayson Stark says the Yankees were "never close" to a deal for a Haren, having rejected a D-Backs' proposal that would have sent Joba Chamberlain, highly regarded pitching prospect Ivan Nova, and two others to Arizona. The Yanks countered with a package built entirely around prospects. Another sticking point is the $33MM left on Haren's contract, which the D-Backs wanted the Yanks to assume in full. New York, like other interested clubs, wanted the quality of the players in the deal to be dependent on how much of Haren's contract Arizona is willing to eat.
- Sean Brennan, Mark Feinsand, and Roger Rubin of The New York Daily News spoke to a source who indicated that while the Yankees would like to swing a deal for Haren, they won't do so "at all costs."
I can’t imagine the Yankees turning down this deal. Joba has become a disposable middle reliever and will probably never be a starter with this team. Nova is a back of the rotation arm. Haren is a #2 on this team under team control through 2012. Very dissapointed, much more than Lee since we’re not giving up nearly as much here.
Are you really giving up on Joba like that? A 2.67 FIP and 3.33 xFIP are not terrible and he is still young with a lot of upside (even as a starter if they were to juggle once more).
I agree, his peripherals are (shockingly) good in contrast to what we’ve seen. But the Yankees seem to have given up on him starting. If we can get a great starter through 2012 in exchange for Joba centric package, I’ll be thrilled.
Dan Haren’s gonna do a hell of a job for whoever he lands with. You heard it here first.
His BABIP is 50 points higher than his career number and his FIP is only 3.92. Even that is higher than his career number. He leads the NL in K’s. He’s a #1 in most clubs.
Totally agree. .344 BAbip is an anomaly as is his HR/FB. This guy is pitching as well as Cliff Lee right now. If he can keep it up the second half, it will be a big story.
Well his HR/FB ratio will only go up in that Wiffle Ball park the Yankees play in… though I suppose Arizona’s no canyon either.
Well his HR/FB ratio will only go up in that Wiffle Ball park the Yankees play in… though I suppose Arizona’s no canyon either.
Thank you. These are the stats I was looking for when I made my post.
Bad luck, and probably disenchanted because he’s playing for the only team not in the Playoff Race in the division.
I repeat: Hell of a job for whoever gets him.
I’m thinking the Yankees pull the trigger soon enough. If that’s the actual offer the only thing I think is happening is the Yanks are trying to see if the D-Backs will eat some of the contract. I think he will be in New York by tomorrow if that is indeed the asking price.
Not like the Tigers would take Chris Snyder.
Oh, wait . . .
too bad the mets don’t wanna get in on him….They could use his bat
If the Yankees do acquire Haren I would think Vasquez would be traded. This would allow them to lock up the rotation and use him as trade bait to fix the bullpen or provide an additional bat. Overall it would be an extremely smart move that would not require their top prospects to be moved. Nova/Mcallister are both solid pitchers but are not top of the rotation guys. Neither will be missed. If a deal could be structured around them with the Yankees eating his salary this would be far better than the Cliff Lee trade. With Hughes going to the bullpen later in the season (or so it would seem) one more reliable bullpen arm and a reliable bat off the bench the Yankees are in good shape.
The way Joba and Hughes been pitching I say they would move Phil to the bullpen, solving 2 problems, the 8th inning and Hughes’ innings pitch
If the Yankees get Haren I’ll stop watching baseball.
So it’s bad for the Yankees to get Haren, but it was okay for the Phillies to get Lee last year and Halladay this year?
I like it because as a Yankee fan, I would be hella pissed to trade Joba.
I like it because as a Yankee fan, I would be hella pissed to trade Joba.
Seriously? I have a feeling Haren will struggle in New York and give up about 5 home runs per start. Kind of like Vazquez or to a lesser extent Burnett. The Yankees love bringing in strikeout pitchers who are homer prone, and then they act like it’s some sort of unexpected coincidence when those guys get bombed. Maybe if they had built a ballpark where the right field fence was actually in the outfield, that wouldn’t happen…
Haren already pitches in a band box, and Vasquez has done well since his horrible start.
Yea, he does… and look at his ERA. Would the Yankees really want that?
Look at his FIP and his BABIP. They both point towards a very inflated ERA.
Seriously? I have a feeling Haren will struggle in New York and give up about 5 home runs per start. Kind of like Vazquez or to a lesser extent Burnett. The Yankees love bringing in strikeout pitchers who are homer prone, and then they act like it’s some sort of unexpected coincidence when those guys get bombed. Maybe if they had built a ballpark where the right field fence was actually in the outfield, that wouldn’t happen…
Why would the D-Backs even want Sloba Chamberlain?
I really do not want the Yankees to trade Ivan Nova for Haren. I think Nova will be a solid Major League pitcher when his time comes, which i think is within 2 years.
Haren is a whole different pitcher than lee, i mean lee has been bounced around from team to team and has still put up awesome numbers. And he was mostly pitching in the American league. If the Yankees were to get Haren now, it would prevent them from signing lee in the offseason. all those yankee haters should be happy the yanks are getting haren instead of lee
//all those yankee haters should be happy the yanks are getting haren instead of lee//
What about Haren fans?
And what’s to say the Yanks won’t get Lee even if they get Haren? Can they afford both?
Its the Yankees, unfortunately for teams that build there rosters the right way, they can afford both.
I don’t get all of the Yankee haters. I am a Royals fan and if anyone should be ticked off about all of the money they have it is me, being in one of the smallest markets there is, but you know what? That is the game. If the Yankees have the money/prospects to acquire Haren now and Lee in the offseason they should do it because any other team would. You cannot get mad at NY for doing what is best for there team. They have a huge fan base that expects them to win and if it was all about money they would win every single year (and while close, they don’t). Besides, Boston, Chicago, etc, also have huge payrolls and no one complains. Also, you cannot pay guys to play well together. It is more than just money. And, if money was no option for them they would have resigned Damon and Matsui last year at what they wanted but they didn’t, and told Damon to take a hike.
If the D-Back pick a portion of his salary I don’t see how the Yanks don’t sign Lee
With Pettitte possibly retiring and Vazquez hitting Free Agency, I would not be so sure.
Oh and your forgetting another important Yankee coming off the books: Kei Igawa. Its the last year of his contract. So between the three of them that’s roughly 30 million coming off the books at the end of this year. Haren I think makes 12 million next year? So 18 million, that’s plenty to get Cliff Lee. Also they may save a couple million hear or there when they re-work Jeter and Rivera’s contract. Plus Posada comes off the books next year so does Swisher. I think they keep Swisher, fans love him.
Don’t forget more than likely Jeter and Rivera will not be making more than what they make now ($22 mil and $15 mil I believe)
Oh yeah I know, that I think Jeter will probably get something around 18 million and Rivera probably around 12 million. But Rivera can have his 15 million he’s worth every penny. So that’s an extra 6 million there. I think Lee won’t get anything more that 18 million a year for 6 years, given he’s older, and I’ve heard that he wanted a 6 year deal.
Oh yeah I know, that I think Jeter will probably get something around 18 million and Rivera probably around 12 million. But Rivera can have his 15 million he’s worth every penny. So that’s an extra 6 million there. I think Lee won’t get anything more that 18 million a year for 6 years, given he’s older, and I’ve heard that he wanted a 6 year deal.
Sorry RBIBaseball, I meant to reply to GreinkeTheGreat, not you.
Not that it really matters, since it’s the Yankees…but Lee is nt going to settle for $18m. Multiple sources reported Lee is looking for a deal comparable to CC, so it’s going to be 6-7yrs for at least 21-23m per
Looking and getting are two different things. Cc was 28, Lee will be 33.
it would be a nice story if Jeter/Posada/Rivera all played for the league minimum to win one for the Boss…
lol
ok i just laughed at myself too
I think most of us are just instinctively unhappy whenever the Yankees get anyone…
I don’t see how thats going to stop them from getting Lee. Pettitte is most likely going to retire this season and there not re-signing Vazquez so that leaves them with CC/AJ/Hughes and Haren if they got him. They would need 1 more pitcher.
You think getting Haren would stop the Yankees from trying to get Lee? HA! Why, when they could just move Burnett and his 16.5 million dollar contract into a middle relief role??
I will laugh when there’s 300MM worth of Yankees pitchers on the DL or pitching like scrubs. AJ Burnett is getting the ball rolling, I see.
I’d like to see the d-back try and get Montero back in a deal for Haren. They could move Jesus to 1B and deal Laroche to the Giants who are looking at a left handed bat anyways.
A top tier prospect in Montero and perhaps a midlevel pitching prospect for Laroche would be a good haul for the D-backs. They could probably get the Yanks to throw in a midlevel pitching guy as well.
Montero? not happening, I would be very surprise
Montero? not happening, I would be very surprise
Joba, AAA prospect, hughes for Dan, plus money.
That has less chance than a Ramiro Pena for Haren straight up.
You have a valid point, if they do pick up a portion of the tab on Haren, they might still try to get Lee but are not necessarily have to. And that will help them a lot in negotiations. And if they do get Lee and Haren the rotation would be incredible for the Yankees. Sabathia Haren Lee Burnett and Pettitte/Hughes if Pettitte retires and if he doesnt I say they put Hughes in the Pen.
The only reason I put Haren in front of Lee is to split up the left and right arms. So you go Left right Left right and whomever is the fifth starter is going to be left/right
Plain and simply put, Joba was rushed. He still has the talent to be a good starter or an excellent closer. He just needs a little more time. Seems like the D’backs feel so as well. Everyone called IPK a waste. A AAAA prospect at best and he’s doing ok for them. Fans and non-baseball people are too quick to dismiss a player. History is peppered with starters/closers who had great stuff but struggled to fufill their potential in their first 3 seasons and then took off. It’s also peppered with those who never filled their potential at all. We’ll see who’s right but to dismiss Joba as a failure is a joke and very short sighted.
If the Yanks can get this deal done with Nova, McAllister and two other prospects while taking on Haren’s entire salary then so be it. If they have to take on Snyder and Qualls as well, then who cares? Qualls has about $1.7 mil left on this years contract and is a FA at the end of the year. His numbers have consistantly sucked this year but he still throws a fastball and power sinker in the 92-94 mph range. Maybe working with Eiland can halp turn him around. If not, then release him. Is there really a big deal between assuming $33 mil in salary vs $35 mil? As for Snyder, a DH/C rotation of Posada, Snyder and Cervelli isn’t an awful thing to have. Also, worse comes to worse a 29 yo C who has 15-20 hr power and the ability to draw walks and hold a decent OBP isn’t exactly a difficult commodity to flip. He’s only owed $5.75 mil in 2011 and $6.75 mil option for 2012 w/ a $750k buyout. Even w/ signifigantly less ab’s than his counterparts (only 193 at bats) he ranks 8th among all C’s in HRS w/ 10, 9th in OBP for all C’s w/ at least 150 ab’s and 9th in walks. If they can’t use him then I’m sure we can easily flip him to a team in need of a power hitting C w/ plate discipline. Detroit (over Avila of Laird) and White Sox (over Pierzynski and Castro) could use an offensive upgrade at C. Either way, using or moving SNyder wouldn’t be a problem.
If the deal, is in fact, Nova, McAllister and two other prospects (not named Betances, Romine, Brackman or Banuelos) for Haren, Qualls and Snyder and we pay all the money then let’s take this pig to the market and get this deal done!
I think Phelps should be on that untouchable list, since he’s really good.
I’m a fan just as you are so please don’t take what I say personally. Phelps’ numbers and his rapid movement reminds me a lot of IPK. IPK’s fastball topped out around 90 mph where as Phelps is around 92 touching 94 on occasion. Both guys seem like smart, control oreintated pitchers who know how to pitch and maximize their stuff. People crucified IPK and made him out to be AAA fodder because, after maybe 200 IP in the minors, he didn’t come up to the majors and win 20 games. I hate to lable prospects untouchable based on stats alone. No one is untouchable. Phelps can be the real deal and I would love to keep him but we should all be a little more comfortable with what Haren can do vs a guy with no mlb experience.
I’m a fan just as you are so please don’t take what I say personally. Phelps’ numbers and his rapid movement reminds me a lot of IPK. IPK’s fastball topped out around 90 mph where as Phelps is around 92 touching 94 on occasion. Both guys seem like smart, control oreintated pitchers who know how to pitch and maximize their stuff. People crucified IPK and made him out to be AAA fodder because, after maybe 200 IP in the minors, he didn’t come up to the majors and win 20 games. I hate to lable prospects untouchable based on stats alone. No one is untouchable. Phelps can be the real deal and I would love to keep him but we should all be a little more comfortable with what Haren can do vs a guy with no mlb experience.
I didn’t take anything personally, I agree with you. Also the reason why Kennedy was crucified was because after that start he made against the angels, where he got rocked and said that he gave it his best. Wrong answer to tell New York fans. Also, I believe he couldn’t handle the pressures of New York.
Yanks are not taking Qualls and Snyder and paying Haren’s full salary.
And you say so why? Again, Qualls is a FA at the end of the year and is only owed about $1.7 mil this year. What’s the difference between assuming a total of $33 mil vs $35 mil? And keep in mind that’s spread out over a couple of years. Yanks may lose Pettite to retirement next year and can let Vazquez walk if they want. If Haren returns to form then at $13 mil he’s a steal. Synder is a commodity, as is Joba. If the Yanks can come out of this deal with Haren, Snyder and KEEP Joba then they have done a good job for themselves, if for no other reason than seeing them as possible pieces for a trade in the offseason. Quall’s salary would have zero effect on us and Snyder can be moved easily if needed. A power hitting 29 year old C with a good OBP owed $12 mil over the next 2 years is not hard to trade.
I say so because it was reported yesterday that the Yanks didn’t want to take Qualls or Snyder. Also if the Yanks are going to give up top pitching prospects AZ should pick up some of the money.
Well it’s quite clear that the hold up in the deal is the Dbacks want Joba and the Yanks to take on either or both of Qualls and Snyder. If the Yanks can come to a compromise of keeping Joba and taking on to easily absorbable and/or moveable contracts then which seems to make the most sense? Ding, ding, ding. Keep Joba, assume Qualls 2010 balance of about $1.7 mil and keep or flip Snyder for other needs. Nova and Phelps are good pitching prospects but neither has been seen as a #1 or #2 caliber pitcher. That could change but for now Haren is a #1 or #2 on most staffs and is controled for 2 more or 3 more years.
Well it’s quite clear that the hold up in the deal is the Dbacks want Joba and the Yanks to take on either or both of Qualls and Snyder. If the Yanks can come to a compromise of keeping Joba and taking on to easily absorbable and/or moveable contracts then which seems to make the most sense? Ding, ding, ding. Keep Joba, assume Qualls 2010 balance of about $1.7 mil and keep or flip Snyder for other needs. Nova and Phelps are good pitching prospects but neither has been seen as a #1 or #2 caliber pitcher. That could change but for now Haren is a #1 or #2 on most staffs and is controled for 2 more or 3 more years.
I say so because it was reported yesterday that the Yanks didn’t want to take Qualls or Snyder. Also if the Yanks are going to give up top pitching prospects AZ should pick up some of the money.
Yanks are not taking Qualls and Snyder and paying Haren’s full salary.
It’s not that the knowledgeable fans have given up on Joba, it’s just that it seems like the Yankees have.
Plain and simply put, Joba was rushed. He still has the talent to be a good starter or an excellent closer. He just needs a little more time. Seems like the D’backs feel so as well. Everyone called IPK a waste. A AAAA prospect at best and he’s doing ok for them. Fans and non-baseball people are too quick to dismiss a player. History is peppered with starters/closers who had great stuff but struggled to fufill their potential in their first 3 seasons and then took off. It’s also peppered with those who never filled their potential at all. We’ll see who’s right but to dismiss Joba as a failure is a joke and very short sighted.
If the Yanks can get this deal done with Nova, McAllister and two other prospects while taking on Haren’s entire salary then so be it. If they have to take on Snyder and Qualls as well, then who cares? Qualls has about $1.7 mil left on this years contract and is a FA at the end of the year. His numbers have consistantly sucked this year but he still throws a fastball and power sinker in the 92-94 mph range. Maybe working with Eiland can halp turn him around. If not, then release him. Is there really a big deal between assuming $33 mil in salary vs $35 mil? As for Snyder, a DH/C rotation of Posada, Snyder and Cervelli isn’t an awful thing to have. Also, worse comes to worse a 29 yo C who has 15-20 hr power and the ability to draw walks and hold a decent OBP isn’t exactly a difficult commodity to flip. He’s only owed $5.75 mil in 2011 and $6.75 mil option for 2012 w/ a $750k buyout. Even w/ signifigantly less ab’s than his counterparts (only 193 at bats) he ranks 8th among all C’s in HRS w/ 10, 9th in OBP for all C’s w/ at least 150 ab’s and 9th in walks. If they can’t use him then I’m sure we can easily flip him to a team in need of a power hitting C w/ plate discipline. Detroit (over Avila of Laird) and White Sox (over Pierzynski and Castro) could use an offensive upgrade at C. Either way, using or moving SNyder wouldn’t be a problem.
If the deal, is in fact, Nova, McAllister and two other prospects (not named Betances, Romine, Brackman or Banuelos) for Haren, Qualls and Snyder and we pay all the money then let’s take this pig to the market and get this deal done!
Also, as to Javier Vazquez. Someone suggested that he be traded if Haren is acquired. Why? The sole reason why the Yanks are pursuing Haren and tried to trade for Lee is because our rotation had some questions. Sabathia is solid, Hughes has innings limitations he’s going to be facing late August, Pettite is on the DL for another 3-4 weeks and AJ has struggled. Vazquez on the other hand has been solid of late. If anything I think the Yanks would allow Pettite as much time as needed to get healthy and go with a rotation of CC, Haren, AJ, Vazquez and Hughes throughout the month of August. Figure Hughes would probably be around 150 IP by the time Pettite is suppose to be ready. If that’s the case then they might decide to send Hughes to the pen and maybe resume the 8th inning role if they haven’t found and obvious guy for the role and try to keep his innings total around 180 IP for the year. Then if they make the playoffs they can go w/ a rotation of CC, Haren, Pettite and either AJ or Vazquez as the 4th starter and the other as the long man, especially if Aceves isn’t back yet.
Everyone, Yankees included should really just go after a guy like Brett Myers if Arizona is treating Haren likes hes Roy Halladay.
Everyone, Yankees included should really just go after a guy like Brett Myers if Arizona is treating Haren likes hes Roy Halladay.
Of course the Yankees don’t want to give up Chamberlain. In their mind the entire league is their farm system and you are just supposed to give up players at minimal cost to help their team. The Yankees and Red Sox make me ill.
Comments like this are idiotic. No team, ever just conceeds to giving up young assets. All of them, regardless of the eventual outcome, try to get the most while giving up the least. Please stop making it sound as if the Yanks and Sox are the only teams that think that way. If other teams didn’t think that way as well then the trading of stars would be much easier than it actually is.
Haren leads the majors with 161 hits allowed and is second in home runs with 23 allowed….. thats saying something
That he’s been unlucky? That he pitches a lot of innings? That he pitches in a hitters park?
Roy Halladay is second in the league in hits allowed. DFA him.
Umm… Opponents hit .285 against Haren this year.
Halladay has thrown 21 more innings and allowed 12 fewer hits than Haren for a .244 BAA.
Haren has also allowed 23 home runs this year to Halladay’s 13, so when he gives up the hits they do a lot more damage.
Haha, I was being facetious, I wouldn’t say Haren, even when his numbers reflect his ability, is better than Halladay. The point was that hits allowed isn’t the best stat to use when saying a pitcher isn’t any good. Obviously Haren hasn’t had as good as year this year as he has the past few years, but a lot of it has to do with bad luck. His peripherals have been great, but fly balls are leaving the park at a higher rate than league average or Haren’s career average, and more balls are falling in for hits than league average or Haren’s career average. Saying Haren has the most hits and HRs allowed and therefor is a bad pitcher or not worth $12.5 million the next 2 seasons leaves a lot out of the analysis.
Haren has given up 13 of his HRs at Chase Field and 5 in Coors, both parks inflate Home Run numbers according to park factors.
unlucky? Hes been getting hit hard for an entire calender year now. In the NL West… good luck in the AL east.
He has a BABIP of .350. League average is .300 and his career average is .304. I would say he’s been pretty unlucky.
Batters are hitting the same amount of line drives off of him as last season, with a 2.2% increase in fly balls (and in turn a 2.2% decrease in ground balls). Chances are that the fly ball numbers and Home Runs will come down closer to his career mark and you will see an improvement from Haren.
That he’s been unlucky? That he pitches a lot of innings? That he pitches in a hitters park?
Roy Halladay is second in the league in hits allowed. DFA him.
Haren leads the majors with 161 hits allowed and is second in home runs with 23 allowed….. thats saying something
I have to imagine the Yankees talk of not wanting to take on Haren’s whole contract and concerns about his performance this year are just negotiating tactics. I find it extremely hard to believe that the Yankees, and many other GMs for that matter, think that 12.5 million for the next two years are market or above market value for Haren. Starting pitching is at a premium and ever off season #3 and #4 starters get paid at least $8 to $10 million dollars (I don’t want to talk about guys who are perceived to be 1s and 2s like John Lackey get paid, it makes me sad).
Haren also pitches in a hitters park that Park Factors say are similar to Yankee Stadium, and he has pitched in the AL before (albeit in Oakland), so the traditional concerns about switching leagues should be tempered some with Haren. He also has great stuff, the Yanks or whoever gets him aren’t acquiring J.A. Happ or someone like that.
If the Yanks can get Haren for Nova, McCallister and 2 guys outside their top 7, they should do it in a heart beat, and other teams that need pitching shouldn’t let the Yanks beat them with such an unspectacular offer.
I have to imagine the Yankees talk of not wanting to take on Haren’s whole contract and concerns about his performance this year are just negotiating tactics. I find it extremely hard to believe that the Yankees, and many other GMs for that matter, think that 12.5 million for the next two years are market or above market value for Haren. Starting pitching is at a premium and ever off season #3 and #4 starters get paid at least $8 to $10 million dollars (I don’t want to talk about guys who are perceived to be 1s and 2s like John Lackey get paid, it makes me sad).
Haren also pitches in a hitters park that Park Factors say are similar to Yankee Stadium, and he has pitched in the AL before (albeit in Oakland), so the traditional concerns about switching leagues should be tempered some with Haren. He also has great stuff, the Yanks or whoever gets him aren’t acquiring J.A. Happ or someone like that.
If the Yanks can get Haren for Nova, McCallister and 2 guys outside their top 7, they should do it in a heart beat, and other teams that need pitching shouldn’t let the Yanks beat them with such an unspectacular offer.
I don’t know how the Yankees turned down, nova chamberlain and mccallister
Buster Olney had an update on his Insider Blog which mentioned the no-trade clause might not be a huge obstacle in keeping a team on his list of 12 from getting him, and specifically mentioned the Tigers.
The Yankees do not need another repeat of Javier Vasquez. I am a diehard Yankee fan, and I wouldn’t like to see Ivan Nova and Zach Mcallister go. They are solid prospects for the future, and will do well. I also think Joba will mature, and get better in the next few years. Besides, if the Yankees get Haren and his 16 million per year, plus Cliff Lee’s 19-20, and the resigning of Mo and Jeter, I don’t see how they can pursue Crawford or Werth. I mean they are the Yankees, but no one has that kind of money. And like I said earlier, Dan Haren is not pitching like an ace this year, and I would not like to empty our farm system for a Javier Vasquez repeat.
Ok first of all haren is making 12 million. not 16 million. Yanks, are not getting Werth or Crawford. They have Swisher, Granderson, and Gardner. I’m a Yankees fan and their not going to spend that much money on players. ’09 was the exception because they had 80 million coming off the books.
they have money coming off the books this year again thats why there gonna sign lee and most likely crawford. Plus from what Crawford says he wants to be a yankee
Well I’ve stated earlier, that Pettitte will come off, Vazquez will come off. Discounts from resigning Jeter and Rivera, and most important of all Kei Igawa, yes he’s still in AAA
The Diamondbacks are asking the Tigers for pitchers Jacob Turner and Andrew Oliver. From Buster Olney
I would do that in a second. Yes, I would do that in a MILLISECOND. A nanosecond. Whichever’s shorter.
get it done DD!
1- The Yankees don’t need Haren. Get pitching in free agency.
2- That being said, the DBacks really shouldn’t trade Haren for a package of McAllister/Nova/others. Either hold out for Montero/Joba or don’t trade him at all. Arizona doesn’t need to trade Haren. They have a strong young core, and it makes more sense to trade one of the position players for pitching help,(e.g. Stephen Drew). Unless some team is about to do something stupid, don’t trade Haren.
Their weakness is primarily the back-of rotation and the bullpen, and those things are fixable without blowing the team up.
3- Joba is a starting pitcher, not a reliever. And yes, he was rushed. If he were on pretty much any team except the Yankees, he’d be working out of a rotation.
Yankees dont need Haren? Mitre is gonna fill the gap for a month, have you watched him pitch? He is not good and if Yankees want to repeat they need pitching depth. If the Yankees dont have to give up Montero, then they need to do this trade. Joba is and always has been OVERRATED.
Mitre is bad, but the Yanks don’t need to fill his shoes with an ace. They’re going to make the playoffs regardless of whether they replace Mitre, and 5th starter is irrelevant once you get into the playoffs. If other pitchers get hurt, grab a league average starter off waivers in August.
Only 3 guys really start in the playoffs anyway, so it’ll be CC, Hughes, and one of Burnett/Pettitte/Vazquez.
Agreed, though the elimination of the extra off-day in the LCS is going to make the three-man rotation much more difficult. All three will have to pitch on short rest
Tweet faster, Buster!//Heard this: No conversations today between Arizona and the Yankees. The NYY scoffed at reports that they were in the lead of the Haren negotiations, because they have never been close to completing a deal to this point.//
buster_ESPN
To be honest, I think the Diamondbacks will and should deal him to the Tigers.
Buster Olney’s twitter said that Haren’s no trade list to Tigers won’t be a probelm.
Diamondbacks are asking for Turner, Oliver, and probably two others.
Here’s the thing.
Tigers want Dan Haren. Tigers are willing to give them to you.
Tigers’ offer is much much better than the Yankees deal.
And here’s another thing.
Tigers can take on the contract of Dan Haren which the Diamondbacks want.
Comerica Park will be much better for Dan Haren then the Yankees Stadium.
Tigers might actually want Chris Snyder whom the Diamondbacks wanted to get rid of.
Lastly, Tigers deserve it.
//Tigers might actually want Chris Snyder whom the Diamondbacks wanted to get rid of.//
This. This right here.
I don’t care if Chris Snyder is a zombie, a cardboard cutout or fashioned out of cheese. He has to be better than Gerald Laird.
Question is would you disown the Tigers if they said no?
I would never disown them, but I’d be really, really unhappy.
I mean, I like both Oliver and Turner, but Haren is one of the top starters in baseball, despite his ‘numbers’.
Tigers should say yes.
Diamondbacks should say yes.
This is a good deal for both teams.
This is the year the Tigers can compete for the championship.
With Haren, their rotation can match up with any other rotation in baseball.
It’s not only this year as well.
It will be for at least the next two years they have this rotation.
Haren is still only 29.
Lilly is well in his mid 30s.
Overall, I think Tigers will be much better off with Haren then Lilly.
Rotation of Verlander, Haren, Porcello, Scherzer, and Bonderman is fearful.
Plus they keep the first four for at least two more years.
Diamondbacks have a pretty nice hitting prospects.
So if they pair up Andy Oliver and Ian Kennedy until Jarrod Parker and Jacob Turner is ready, they will be pretty fearful as well.
I really think Dan Haren deserves to win and succeed which will be with the Tigers.
I really believe the Detroit deserves this more than Yankees or Phillies.
I really hope this works out.
//Overall, I think Tigers will be much better off with Haren then Lilly.//
I definitely agree with this. Plus, isn’t Lilly a free agent too?
//So if they pair up Andy Oliver and Ian Kennedy until Jarrod Parker and Jacob Turner is ready, they will be pretty fearful as well.//
Yeah. Plus, the D’backs might be able to get a mid-level prospect, such as Furbush, who could be serviceable until Turner is ready for the majors.
//I really believe the Detroit deserves this more than Yankees or Phillies.//
But you have a Yankees avatar . . . !
//But you have a Yankees avatar . . . ! //
You got to look at it logical is sometimes.
I am a Yankee fan but I am thinking logically.
Tigers do deserve it.
I like you. /thumbsup
I wish all Yankee fans were like you!
I guess your really against Dan Haren because of his stats. I mean Haren would be nice, Yanks don’t need him. Pettitte will be back soon enough.
I would like him.
I live in Arizona and get to see Haren all the time.
Trust me, he is brilliant when he is on.
He went through some bad break this year.
He looks little discouraged here with a bad team.
Oh that’s cool. Yeah I would be discourage too. Its good to see another reasonable Yankee fan. It stinks when a majority of people only look at wins, and ERA, as measures for success.
wouldnt suprise me if we take on qualls. only signed through this year i believe, and it would give leyland that “veteran bullpen arm” hes so obsessed with….
He’s been really struggling, but he might be one of those guys who needs a change of scenery more than anything else.
There is no deserving teams in baseball. The team that makes the trade is the one that gives the most, whether they be deserving or not. Otherwise, we would not have any good or bad teams in the league, if teams got what they “deserved.”
Wonder if Detroit will try to steal Stephen Drew away too. They’ve been linked to him before and if they can sweeten the pot I’m sure Arizona would do it.
It would probably have to be Porcello, I would assume?
i hope not. i do not want stephen drew at all.
I could care less, RS fan here but for the Tigers I think they could really use both.
I agree they could probably use Drew because . . . Danny Worth? Ramon Santiago? But I heard he wasn’t great defensively.
Is this true, D’backs fans?
Not great defensively but solid. Good arm and good range. Never makes the spectacular play though, in fact he’s probably the least flashiest SS in the league.
Hm. I’d probably take him if he was available then, but I doubt that could happen without Porcello.
who Drew? not sure who your watching. for my money? he’s a top 5 NL SS (defensively). sure, he’s not ‘flashy’ but he makes some amazing plays. strong arm. solid glove. just 4 errors in 723 innings so far this year. Everybody talks about how Brendan Ryan (STL) is a STUD defensive SS and he has 12 errors in 621 innings.
people sleep on every player in Arizona (not named Upton or Haren), cuz well, the Dbacks stink this year. take my word, and with any biased opinion aside, Drew is a VERY SOLID SS. Not a multi-gold glove caliber one, but better than 90% of the NL, IMHO.
I think you’re over-valuing our players.
Well, first of all, the only team that “deserves” it is the team that gets the deal done and gets the player. This isn’t a fairy tale, where everyone gets what they want. This is a competitive, cutthroat business. And I have no idea what to say about how that mind set is “logical”… I… just… don’t… know…
Woops. That was supposed to be up there -^ to Patrick Kim
Agreed and I understand what you are talking about.
This will be a brutal next few days around baseball.
It’s fun time of the year ain’t it?
It absolutely is a great time of the year. You may very well be the most agreeable, easiest to get along with human being on the internet… you must be a robot. 😛
Mike Valenti will hate it if Haren-to-Detroit happens.
Therefore, it needs to happen.
why does valenti hate it lol that guys a moron
Valenti is a blowhard. He was ranting the other day about the Tigers possibly going after Haren, saying, “Who do you think you are, the Yankees?! The Tigers need to save money, not spend it!” lol even with the $34 mil or so coming off the books next year.Maybe not so coincidentally, I think Valenti is from New York.
Tigers have close to 60 mil coming off the books next year.
I thought that might’ve been the case, but I wasn’t positive so I went with what I saw in the Freep (IIRC).
That’s even better though.
Looks like things have gotten quiet, probably some snags in talks, or the Tigers rejected the offer and are countering.
Wouldn’t be surprised at all if that was the case.
It’s times like this I wish Dombrowski didn’t play things so close to the vest. I want to knoooow.
Haren for Oliver/Turner + prospects. Git r dun… Snyder is an excellent defensive catcher but terrible at the dish. Good guy to have backing up. If i’m DET i take em both if it gets you Haren w/o giving up Porcello.
//Snyder is an excellent defensive catcher but terrible at the dish. Good guy to have backing up.//
I’d be more than happy to take the guy with the .779 OPS. (For example, Laird? .519. Ugh.)
I guess it’s safe to go have lunch now . . .
Uh oh Detroit is in trouble:
Gambo620
according to my sources talks with Yankees heated up yesterday, cooled down today but have not stopped. Detroit not a major player for Haren.
Gamb620 is a sports radio host in Arizona. I got his twitter from another guy on here.
I’m not giving up on a Haren-to-Detroit trade until a deal (with anyone) is done.
Does Leyland think that Haren can help that’s the question it seems…. Cause Leyland would rather hold onto prospects
Leyland said he didn’t want to give up premium prospects unless it was for an impact player. Does Haren count as an impact player to Leyland? I would certainly hope so.
Also, Leyland doesn’t influence trades. He gives input, but leaves that to Dombrowski and co. At least that’s the impression I got from the Free Press piece.
Your right but an impact player could also mean 3B with Inge out. I agree with you that Haren is an impact player . Also you have to realize that Arizona has been trying to get McAllister for over a yr, i know his dad’s in the scouting dept but that speaks volumes.
Yes, I am aware of that. Both starting pitcher and offense are needs for the Tigers right now, though.
What impact 3B is out there anyway? José Bautista? Mike Lowell? Inge expects to be back in four to six weeks (he says maybe before that, but I don’t think they’ll rush him/let him rush himself). I don’t think they need to go for Adrian Beltre right now.
Well you do get versatility with Bautista which isn’t a bad thing, but its hard to say if he’ll be a 1 yr wonder and continue to produce. I don’t follow Detroit that much but is Mags coming off the books at the end of the year?
I don’t think he will be. His vesting option looks like it will kick in, barring an injury/benching (unlikely)/trade (also unlikely, thanks to the vesting option)/etc.
well hes still producing not a bad thing, If you can get Drew and Leyland can mold him into a better hitter than his brother then 2/3 Drew’s would have done great at the MLB level right? lol
Stephen Drew is intriguing. Anyone know if his longterm future is at shortstop?I wouldn’t trust Leyland to mold Drew into a better hitter . . . Not sure I’d trust Lloyd either. But he’s hitting .270. I don’t even think Everett’s OPS was .270.
LOL. I just checked fangraphs. Everett’s OPS was .268.
Drew’s ceiling is approx a .295, 25 HR & 85 RBI guy. he hit .316 in ’06 and didnt get close to that until 2008 when he hit .291, same year he hit 21 HR’s.
But he’s a STUD defender at SS. And this year? he’s caught some BAD breaks on offense (ie: hits deep in the gap and last minute dive by outfielder, etc)…
He’s a good player, and on avg, you can expect prob a .275 16 HR & 70+ RBI guy w/ a VERY solid glove.
lol, you could give us your entire minor leagues for Haren, Drew & Reynolds. Would plug holes in SP, SS & 3B. haha. jk. but no, i’m sure we’re looking to move drew too, if you guys are interested. But once your GM turned down Turner AND Porcello?? i dont see how anything will get done. Asking for our ace, but no go on either of the MAIN prospects you have? ughh…
nobody is willing to give up their premier prospects for haren because the dbacks have no leverage at all. they are a last place team, looking to dump some salaries, and haren is having the worst year of his career. if he was performing up to his standards, then this would be a very different case. but since the dbacks seem determined to move him “before his start on tuesday” they are in no position to be making huge demands.
sure we are. we dont HAVE to move him. We’d be perfectly fine with him as our ace in 2011. Its NOT a salary dump, regarless of what fans and other GM’s think. With Webb & Byrnes coming off the books + all the deferred contracts, by no means will it break the bank to keep him around. Its that we aren’t going to give Haren to a team for (1) C- prospect and (1) D+ prospect. So yes, its known we’re looking to move him. But at the same time, offering junk in return for an ace, won’t get any deal done.
if dan haren cannot help your team or your rotation then i dont know what will. this is the kind of difference maker leyland is talking about. our rotation has been so up and down all season long, we cannot have verlander and scherzer followed by 3 days of prayer.
Jon Heyman just tweeted that Tigers don’t want to give up Turner in a Dan Haren deal.
Is there anything more?
Also, still not entirely convinced the Tigers are out of it yet though it seems unlikely now.
Nah, that’s all I’ve heard, and that Lilly is a good second option. So yeah it looks like what I said earlier, talks have either died or have slowed down. So if the D’backs are going to move Haren by tuesday from I’ve been hearing, they’re going to have to settle for the best offer. So far the Yanks have offered the closest thing that the D’backs are looking for. They won’t cave in and offer up Joba.
Blah, Ted Lilly. I won’t complain too loudly if they get him though. Just not a huge fan.
I remember when Lilly was an FA he begged the Yanks to take him but they didn’t bite lol speaks volumes about chicago huh lol
dont want lilly. i dont see lilly making us world series contenders or anything of the sort, so why trade good prospects for a guy who we wont resign anyways?
UGH. very dissapointing.
It was just pointed out to me that “dont want to” doesn’t mean “will not”. Just sayin’.
yeah. i was very confident after seeing leyland say he would deal young talent for a “difference maker” or “something special”, so to me it sounded like DD approached him about it and leyland basically said if you can get me dan haren then go for it; as opposed to when leyland destroyed all rumors about porcello and saying there is no possible way hes moving. im still remaining hopeful though.
Good point about Porcello. He shot that one down pretty fast.
I’m not sure that I see Haren moving. His contract isn’t that hefty and the D-backs aren’t in rebuilding mode. They expect to have a shot at the title next year.
They’re asking for a lot and teams aren’t going to give that up. I get the idea that they’re moreso just saying “if you really want Harent, then it will cost you _______” and they’re not really actively hoping to trade him.
No need for Haren. Mitre will be fine. I know because a Yankees fan told me just yesterday.
hahahahah wow credible source
Mitre gave up 7 earned runs today in 4 innings and just came off the DL. The Yankees need another starting pitcher. Dan Haren IS the answer. Nova, McAllister, David Adams, and Daniel Brewer should get it done. 2010 2nd Half Rotation: CC, AJ, Haren, Javy, Hughes (goes to the ‘pen when Andy comes off the DL)2011 Rotation: CC, Lee, Haren, Hughes, AJ
Wheres A.J. in your 2011 rotation? they won’t trade him and Andy may retire
swap andy with aj and it seems more likely
andy is not gonna play baseball like chris chelios played hockey. Yes he’s a great pitcher but seeing how it takes year to year i wonder if he’d like to see his kids graduate
Phillies are trying to get in it now, but they have to flip Werth which is not going to happen.
they’re trying to get into it after Oswalt snubbed them just a second resort
Why wouldn’t that happen? Hart and DeJesus are both off the market now due to injures, making Werth even more valuable around the league.
Actually Hart is still available… it was just a bruise
Hart’s not out… no DL time
Well no one is going to give up the prospects for Werth so that the Phillies could then turn around and trade them to the Dbacks. We already know that the Rays are not a match. Giants maybe, but if they get involved the D’backs are going to want Bumgardner or Sanchez. Giants won’t do that. Then their is the Red Sox, but the Red Sox are stingy with their prospects.
The Rays just said that they don’t think a deal will be made a couple days ago, meaning that the Phillies were asking for too much…they were asking for Davis or Upton. If they drop down to Matt Moore or Alex Colome and something small, I think a deal could be made. Add Happ, Singleton and a low level prospect to whatever piece you get from the Werth trade and you have a legit package for Haren.
Not sure where you are pulling Bumgardner and Sanchez from, it’s pretty effing obvious that they aren’t going to be in a trade for Werth, nor would they be in a trade for Haren.
Yeah but if this was going to become a three team deal, I’m sure the D’backs would want the best group of prospects. So if the Giants get involved, D’backs would want Bumgardner or Sanchez who are major league ready, which the D’backs want. If I’m the D’backs and get a three way deal going I would want the best reasonable prospect from that third team.
Guys like Bumgarner, Sanchez, Hellickson, Hughes, Chamberlain aren’t “reasonable” returns for Haren, let alone Werth. The DBacks can want a lot of things, but it doesn’t mean that they will get close to obtaining it.
Happ, Singleton, Moore/Colome and some mediocre specs is plenty of value for Haren. That’s a major league ready 3/4 pitcher, a top 50 prospect, and another top 50-75 prospect…that is plenty enough for Haren.
I could see the Phillies holding onto Singleton and Cosart though, which is why they might be going after Oswalt instead.
I am pretty convinced that the Phillies will either get Haren or Oswalt.
I’m hoping Haren for Happ, Singleton, Ramirez, and another prospect or a combination of prospects they get from trading Werth (if it happens) and try and save some prospects (Colvin, May, and Cosart). Singleton, in my opinion, will have to be the centerpiece for the deal along with a MLB ready pitcher (Kendrick, Bastardo, Happ, Worley, who threw some heat today, or Mathieson).
I don’t know if I want to give up both Happ and Singleton in a deal. Happ, you know what you got; a legit back of the rotation guy in the majors (assuming he’s actually healthy). While he isn’t a front line starter, there’s a definite value in knowing pretty much what he projects to be. Compare that to guys in the minors where you’re much less sure what they may turn into. Major league seasoned pitchers, in my mind, are worth much more than a guy in A ball, even if that guy can throw 99 mph. Too hard to project pitchers that low. Now I could see giving up Singleton as a centerpiece, but I wouldn’t add much more to that beyond say…Ramirez and maybe Gose/Jiwan James/Gillies/Etc. 18 year old’s with his strike-zone recognition are worth their weight in gold, even if he does only play first. His position can be changed, but that eye for pitch-selection won’t. To me, after Brown, he’s the most valuable commodity the Phillies have and I’d like to see that develop if I can.I realize withholding either Happ or Singleton from a deal might cause Arizona to balk at trading Haren, but if I’m Amaro, I’ll have to live with it and see if I can add a starter in the off-season when the price might be lower. Maybe thats wrong, but I really don’t like trading pieces at the deadline when you’re far more likely to get screwed than in the off-season (theoretically, I guess). And I definitely don’t like trading a king’s ransom for a single pitcher, unless you know exactly what you’re gonna get. I have too many questions on Haren to give up both Singleton and Happ, based on this season’s performance and his stats. (Mainly going by stats since I’ve maybe seen him pitch once this year)
And holy hell, that was a really long spiel. Sorry.
A trade for Haren is going to hurt; I know where you are coming from and I’d rather see the Phillies give up Matthew Rizzotti and JA Happ together than trade Singleton. Although Rizzotti is putting up some impressive numbers in AA as well. I think it will come down to however Amaro thinks can be shifted into a corner outfielder.
Happ is a good number 4 starter, however Worley looked good today, Cosart, Shreve, and Colvin have all been pitching well. I also like Bastardo…So Happ and/or Kendrick could be used to bring in Haren.
I could live with Happ/Rizzotti/Any one of the outfield prospects + someone else. Dunno if the DBacks could live with that, though. Rizzotti’s putting up amazing numbers, but its such an aberration from the rest of his career, its gonna give a GM some doubts. Plus from what I hear(haven’t seen much of him play), he’s kind of limited defensively. So thats another thing that’ll take off value.
Dunno what value Kendrick has at this point and Worley’s really raw and unproven right now. Bastardo’s talented but apparently made of porcelain.
I could see the DBacks liking Mathieson, but at this point, I think he’s more valuable to the Phillies than anyone else. The arm problems have got to scare away a lot of people, no matter how hard he’s bringing it right now. And that’ll lower his value. Plus the Phils have stuck with the guy for 4 years and two Tommy John’s. I wanted to see my horse run in the derby, before I trade him in for a different model. So to speak.
Cosart’s an untouchable for me. I know he’s young and he’s got some arm issues, but still I think he’s got a potential ace material. I’d like to have at least one of those in the system. Colvin and Shreve, and I guess May are in play, but they’re so raw, I don’t know how other teams would view them.
well tigers can kiss dan haren goodbye after losing maggs for 6 weeks and possibly guillen too. no sense in giving away our best prospects when theres no shot we stay in the race
The injury to Magglio shouldn’t kill a Haren deal, as Haren isn’t just a half-year guy. If the Tigers think they could contend in ’11, well, Haren is under contract until 2012 or even 2013.It probably will though.
im not sure which pitchers are going to be free agents next year, but it would make more sense to just use that money to sign one or two in the offseason; and keep turner/oliver in the meantime. harens under contract for a couple more years, but i just dont see it mattering much for this year since it will be a lineup of cabrera and 6 rookies..
The Tigers will have close to $60 million to play with for 2011, now that Magglio’s option won’t vest.
Also, Magglio won’t be out for the rest of the season. If the Tigers hang around long enough, they could get both Inge and Magglio back in September to help with a playoff race.
Yes, Haren’s under contract for two years. Lilly is a free agent.
I don’t understand. Haren’s under contract for two, possibly three more years. But since it won’t matter for this year, the Tigers shouldn’t try to get him?
//no sense in giving away our best prospects when theres no shot we stay in the race//also I agree, let’s give up on any chance to win the division right now. SELL!/sarcasmActually, you didn’t advocate selling, so my apologies.
Heyman:
#phils remain more focused on oswalt than haren
D-Backs interested in Happ/Singleton. No way Snakes accept any deal without both of them. I think Happ could be a solid #2 guy plus AZ needs for a lefty.
If Detroit plays hardball with Turner i’d throw in Drew. Could a Haren/Drew combo land Porcello/Oliver if Tigers could keep Turner?
//If Detroit plays hardball with Turner i’d throw in Drew. Could a Haren/Drew combo land Porcello/Oliver if Tigers could keep Turner?//
I’d certainly have to think about it seeing as SS is a gaping hole in the lineup right now. Dunno about Dombrowski.