The Blue Jays acquired shortstop Yunel Escobar and pitcher Jo-Jo Reyes from the Braves for shortstop Alex Gonzalez and minor leaguers Tim Collins and Tyler Pastornicky, according to a team press release. The Jays designated Ronald Uviedo for assignment to make room on the 40-man roster.
The move comes as a big surprise, as Escobar was perhaps one of the more valuable commodities in the game when the 2009 season concluded. Just a few days ago, MLB.com's Mark Bowman wrote that the Braves "simply aren't willing to sell low on a guy who they still view as the game's top defensive shortstop." Escobar was worth over four wins last year, but his power has disappeared in 301 plate appearances this year. Escobar will be arbitration-eligible for the first time after this season, so he'll be under the Jays' control through 2013. Escobar's attitude was a likely factor in the deal; Bowman wrote in June that "there's no doubt that Escobar's flamboyant approach to the game has continued to infuriate some members of the Braves organization." Back in February, MLB.com's Alden Gonzalez went more in-depth on the attitude angle.
Gonzalez will replace Escobar as the Braves' starting shortstop as they enter the second half with a four game lead in the NL East. He doesn't get on base, but he's already hit 17 home runs on the season and continues to play strong defense. Gonzalez is owed another $1.23MM this year and has a $2.5MM club option for 2011. Braves GM Frank Wren told David O'Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, "This trade improves our club for the second half of the season."
Reyes, a 25-year-old southpaw, has spent most of the season at Triple A. His strikeout and walk rates are strong in his fourth stint at the level, but he's had problems with home runs and hits. Baseball America regarded Reyes as the Braves' eighth-best prospect heading into the 2007 season, calling him a "thick-bodied lefthander who does a good job of keeping hitters off balance." He's dealt with injuries, including Tommy John surgery in '04.
Collins, a 20-year-old lefty, was ranked 19th among Blue Jays prospects by Baseball America heading into this season. The 5'7" southpaw "gets outs with a solid fastball that tops out at 93 mph and a true 12-to-6 curveball that he spins really well." Working in relief, Collins has a 15.3 K/9 in 43 Double A innings this year. Pastornicky, a 20-year-old shortstop, was ranked 17th. He's described as a player who "doesn't have flashy tools but gets the most out of what he has." In the best case, he'll become a line drive top of the order hitter with solid defense, indicates BA. As for Uviedo, the Jays had acquired him from the Pirates in the June Dana Eveland deal. BA described him as rail-thin and homer-prone heading into the '09 season, but praised his fastball and slider.
My take: this is certainly a win-now move for the Braves, who are confident Gonzalez will provide more over the next few months than Escobar would have. The Blue Jays, meanwhile, managed the rare feat of acquiring three-plus years of a shortstop with star potential without giving up much.
interesting no writers had this before the release unless i’m mistaken, just didn’t hear anything prior to this.
Wren likes to keep things shush-shush. I heard a rumor from someone about it, but nothing by a writer.
So does Alex. He prefers to keep things close to the chest, especially after last year’s Halladay debacle.
Combine that with AA’s policy of not commenting on anything remotely involving trades and you end up with a decently big move that flies under the radar.
You know Wren didn’t wake up this morning and was like… let’s trade Yunel before Noon. I went to a random game last year and saw on the screen that we traded for McLouth. I was like “I saw nothing leading up to this on MLBTR!” These types of trades don’t have times or days on the MLBTR page. No chance for anyone to outbid.
thats all it took????? im shocked.
Wow, that’s it? I know Yunel is in the middle of an awful season, but they swap him with Gonzalez who is having a career year and will be an upgrade this season, but get nothing else in return.
I would have liked the Pirates to acquire him, but I guess the Braves wanted an upgrade at shortstop instead of a prospect package. Maybe the Pirates will pick Uviedo back up.
i guess they feel gonzales will be an upgrade over the attitude of yunel until salcedo comes up, i actually like this move i was getting fed up watching yunel escobar complain and not hustle
They could have played Infante at SS for the rest of the season as well, but they probably like the value he provides as a utility player which is understandable.
Infante’s weakest fielding position was SS. So you probably didn’t want him there everyday. Gonzalez will definitely add some pop, and I think Yunel’s defense was a big overrated to begin with.
Guess the Braves FO could no longer wait for Yunel to grow up. I think they sold low, unfortunately.
Braves just got savaged by that deal. That’s ridiculous.
I disagree. With Chipper aging, Glaus/Wagner on one year deals, and Bobby Cox on his way out they are clearly going for it this year.
This move gives them a veteran infielder who plays great defense just like the guy they traded; but also gives them a veteran player with not only pennant race but also playoff experience. Gonzalez is having a career offensive year, has been healthy (which was his major flaw previously) and is under team control at a very affordable rate for next year as well.
As usual, the Braves have a great farm system and are loaded with pitchers and JP Riciardi was just on ESPN radio saying that the two kids they got with Gonzo are quality prospects as well.
I think they said to themselves, ‘we’re selling low, but if we wait it’s going to be even lower’ so they made the move and will be in the playoffs partly because of this move.
4.3 War player or a career year guy with playoff experience. Hmm tough choices.
JP would say he likes the Braves side; after all he drafted the 2 prospects….
4.3 WAR player that can’t get his head on straight enough to play hard for BOBBY COX on a first place team.
Pretty sure the Braves got rid of him for a reason.
I just look at the scouting reports for the prospects and they also got a high level reliever arm who strikes out more than 12 per 9IP and a middle infeilder with speed and on base skills (20 year old who already walks 10% of the time).
I think they cut their loses on a kid who thinks he’s the next Jeter even though all he had was ONE YEAR of 4.3 WAR; he’s not a 4.3 WAR player. That was last year buddy. Don’t get in over your head. the kid is hitting .238 on a first place team with NO HR’s and 19 RBIs in over 300 plate appearances.
By cutting their loses; they got a good serviceable player who’s hitting over his head power wise this year but is and will be a defensive stopper for them and they also got a reliever who will start next year on the big club (at 21/22 yrs old i think) and a middle infielder with good skills and upside.
Plus they get Gonzo for the rest of this year and, if they choose, next year on the cheap end.
There were unconfirmed reports that the Braves were getting tired of Escobar not living up to his potential and his attitude and that he could be moved if they were impressed with an offer. I must say that I am not at all impressed by this offer. Alex Gonzalez is a stalwart on defense but really has no offensive value besides the occasional homerun. Tim Collins supposedly has a great curveball and has a FIP under 2 in AA, but I’ve never even heard of Pastronicky. Pretty shocked the Braves made this move, personally.
well we traded a young guy who couldnt get on base with an attitude, for a mid age guy who doesnt get on base but at least has a little pop, plus an inf and a great great prospect in tim collins, the guy has a career era of 2.4 and a k/9 ratio over 13 in his minor league career. This is like the vazquez deal where everyone overlooked that the braves got visciano
Even in a terrible year Escobar has an OBP of .334, and has never had a season with an OBP less than .360. In a “career year” Alex Gonzalez has a .296 OBP. I like the addition of Collins, but I just don’t see how Gonzalez is a better player than Escobar, even for the rest of the season.
If that’s all it took I wish the Reds would have sent them Cabrera and a couple of solid prospects.
Cabrera’s defense has dropped way off in the last few years. He’s not in Gonzo’s league. Plus, Cabrera has his own reputation for being a hothead, and his hitting has also dropped way off, but Dusty sure loves him at the top of the batting order.
Watched Gonzalez at SS last year, he’s lost more then a step, and won’t be able to maintain his power. Honestly he isn’t really any better then Cabrera. The Reds best SS for the last two years has been Paul Janish but he’s not a Dusty favorite so he sits the bench.
True that!!!The Reds won 40+ games over the 2nd half of 2009 w/ Janish as the starting SS…But in Dusty’s world the SS is ALWAYS a #2 hitter. Janish is a #7/#8…but w/ a career UZR/150 of 14.1 as a SS…he’s one of the best gloves in the game!!!(JFYI, that UZR/150 is DAMN GOOD!!!)
I still don’t believe this is all it took for the Braves to get rid of Esco….my mouth is still open.
Is Alex G. a few agent after the season?
He has a club option for 2.5MM next season.
Braves got a real gem in Collins (and a great story to boot, I’ll be sad to see him go) but Escobar is definitely the kind of guy I’m happy to have on the Jays!
I got to agree, Collins is a real gem. Collin’s delivery is very similar to Tim Lincecum’s and I was actually very excited to see him pitch in the bigs once the rosters expanded. He added a cutter this year which he has really excelled at giving him three pitches that encouraged the Jays to think about trying him out in the rotation.
Thats it, they traded Escobar for a 33 year old having a career year?
Devestated as a Jays fan to lose Collins, many were hoping he’d be our closer of the future, but for that return I guess I can’t quibble too much.
What?! I guess their view was that if they go to the playoffs, they’ll need a better attitude from their SS. But I’m not sure if Gonzalez is a big head too. either way, neither will be there for the long time.
this also means that salcedo isn’t far off. Opening day 2011???
Edward Salcedo is 18 years old and has about 100 plate appearances in pro baseball. He’s not even close to being ready.
Yea your right, but don’t you think that the braves will pick up Gonzalez’s option just to hold down short for next year?
they have to pick up his option, unless brandon hicks somehow goes ballistic and tears shit up to the point where he has to start…otherwise its going to be a race between mycal jones and edward salcedo to see who can take over short the quickest
Salcedo could end up playing at 3rd. Atleast that was what was said when he was signed.
No need to worry about gonzo’s attitude. He’s a heads down, play the game type of guy.
I dont know the Braves minor leagues system, but I would assume they must have some young SS prospects not too far off? Braves get a Veteran SS having a solid year & a good pitching prospect. Jays get a young SS they have been lacking for years…
they have edward salcedo, and amazing and +++ potential ss, but hes only 18 and at least a few years off.
A very quick a dirty review of the Braves SS prospects:
1. Brandon Hicks: An older ready now type of prospect who is on the MLB bench right now. He plays plus defense at short with some power, patience and speed but serious contact issues are keeping him from being a viable option this year.
2. Mycal Jones: A toolsy SS in high A with much of the raw ability you look for in an athletic SS. He is still obviously developing and needs to clean up the amount of errors he makes.
3. Edward Salcedo: One of the biggest positional player signings from the international market for the Braves in a while. He has a rare combination of power, plate coverage, and speed but many think he will outgrow SS and have to move to third.
4. Matt Lipka and Andrelton Simmons: Our S and 2 round picks respectively. Lipka is the more all around top of the order type SS prospect that combines amazing athletic ability with contact/plate control and solid defense. Simmons was the top defensive prospect in the draft and has the arm to be a power reliever prospect if he/they wanted. His bat really needs to develop is he is going to make it to the bigs.
This is the biggest crop of SS talent the Braves have had in quite a while and it may be because they thought they may have to deal Escobar in the future (which is now now).
That would make sense as to why they are giving up on Escobar in exchange for the Homers for Alex… He should help the Braves in the Second half… they Jays are looking to unload the Vets… but surprised Alex was first to go however.
yeah but they project lipka will move to center but still solid point
That’s still not a reason to sell low on Escobar.
Simmons is going to pitch. Don’t forget Diory Hernandez.
Spot on with your scouting reports, but I am still under the impression they are going to try and use Lipka as the toolsy, CF of the future. I’m seeing him as the white version of Michael Bourne. Myke Jones is similar as he just falls short of being a 5-tool with the glove and spotty defense. Simmons should be throwing. However, I think to waste their 2nd round on a guy by making him upset and not even sign would be an even bigger issue than changing him into the live-arm pitcher he is. Most people just don’t realize that with the depth we have in the minors right now, we can absorb this impact more than the trade of Andrus and Feliz (which tops the list as one of the most desperate GM moves of the century).
I don’t see Leonard or any of our minor league 3rd basemen developing the pop needed for the corner position, so I agree with Salcedo filling out, similar to Heyward’s growth, and moving to the hot corner.
Nope, unfortunately they don’t. That’s what makes this trade incredibly stupid for the Braves.
As a Jays fan, it’s sad to see Collins go. He’s a serious wildcard in this deal…fantastic stuff, even better numbers, but ultimately… he’s 5’7″ in platform shoes. So who knows.
Pastornicky (not Pastronicky) is a quality player. Still very young, has a chance to stick at short and has held his own with the bat (he’s in a pitcher-friendly park in a very pitcher friendly league). JP Ricciardi made some comments when the Jays signed Hechavarria, that they already had a shortstop of the future in Pastornicky.
Regardless, the upside that Escobar brings to the table is seriously worth it for the Jays
Wow, big surprise.
Awesome job, Blue Jays. Just fantastic. A top ten shortstop in his prime for a 33-year old glove having a flukey home run spike and a relief prospect (albeit a good and fun one).
Wait until Escobar continues his rock-for-brains behavior in Toronto, you won’t be so happy then.
Jays fans have lived with an high-potential airhead before
see: Alex Rios.
Yes, and the team loved it so much they put him on waivers.
It’s not so much that Escobar is an airhead, which he is, but that he’s also a punk. He walks around staring at other teams’ players like there’s a secret staring contest going on. But instead of looking intimidating he just looks like a little punk. He’s very much from the same mold as Ronnie Cedeno, another high talent SS who isn’t worth a damn either.
Correction: They loved the contract so much they put him on waivers
Meh, I don’t know if I would call Ronnie Cedano a “high talent shortstop”. He’s mediocre at best. Not sure if you were labeling Cedano as a punk here either but if so I don’t see it, for all his faults he doesn’t seem to be that kind of player or display that kind of attitude. Agreed though, he isn’t worth a damn.
I’m not a Blue Jays fan or a Braves fan. I’m just a baseball fan who thinks the Blue Jays made a great trade and the Braves made a bad one. Hardly anyone is boneheaded enough for me to not prefer six years of youth and 70 extra points of OBP.
Oh, and someone please explain BABIP to Frank Wren.
As a Braves fan, I’m actually satisfied with this move. IIRC, Collins has like.. a 15.3 K/BB ratio or something nuts like that in AA. While Gonzy’s having a career year.. Yunel’s attitude and propensity to hardly show real excitement at all for the game just infuriates me. I don’t care if he’s having a down year. It’s the fact that he doesn’t seem to even care he’s having a bad year..
i agree as a braves fan myself i am content with this deal, yunels attitude just made me dislike him, i often found myself rooting against him even though hes on my favorite team
Really sad to see Collins go but I love this trade!
AA is a magician!
This is pretty stupid IMO. I mean yeah, Yunel is having a down year and hes does need to mature a little bit, but he is one of the best defensive shortstops in the game. Not to take away anything from Alex Gonzalez, but this is horrible. Gonzalez will probably have a Bret Boone like season, but next year will be just average again. If I were a Blue Jays fan, I’d be having a pizza party tonight. They got a great prospect for practically nothing.
I was ready to see Escobar the player go for quite a while but I was afraid of what kind of defense we could put there to replace him. Alex Gonzalez is an excellent defender at short and definately has more power and a better head on his shoulders than Escobar. The one thing I will miss is his ability to take walks compared to Gonzalez’s poor plate discipline.
I don’t know much of anything about the prospects coming in but I know Jo-Jo Reyes still has a ton of ‘raw talent’ but he wasn’t going to get another shot in Atlanta so that wasn’t much of a loss. Also Escobar is going to enter his arbitration years next year so its not like we are going to be missing a super cheap 400K player for the future.
Overall, I think I like the trade but it never should have needed to happen if Escobar could have just grown up.
Dumb move for the Jays. If Collins was a half-foot taller, he’d be closing games for us instead of Gregg.
I can’t get over how overvalued height/weight is for pitchers. A guy that can chuck 92mph is still a dude that can chuck 92mph.
I’ll give up a potential closer for a down-seasoned low-babip Escobar any day of the week.
Shocking considering what the Braves were supposedly asking for him in the offseason. I think its a bad deal even when considering his down year and attitude problems, but factoring in what his value was coming off 2009 this was a horrible, horrible deal.
Not a bad looking deal either way. The braves wanted to ugrade at short (with an eye to opening the position for the future. They got a better defensive player with power (this year). They got AA all-star with wicked stuff and numbers, but a question mark concerning his size. Finally, they got a very athletic, smart, and young SS with a potential high upside. Just because are not familiar with the jays prospects does not demean their value. For the Jays, they picked up a young SS with a high ceiling that they can ride. If he turns into the player of 09 then they have options with Hechevarria. If he does not then they wait and hope that Hechevarria turns into the SS of the future. It gives them a stronger (younger) outlook looking forward to 2011-2013.
You gotta love this trade. Yunel may have a bad attitude but maybe a change in scenery is a good thing and I am sure the jays staff can straighten out his bat.
Just wow…AGon is not nearly as good as his TOR #’s suggest (look at his time in CIN, when he was healthy, as a good point of reference)….And Yunel isn’t nearly as bad as his 1st half #’s.
I’m betting the ATL regrets this move w/in weeks!!!
but we also got 2 + prospects with high upside, and a stop gap in agon until then. a lil production is better than 0 production with a bad attitude, which at the time is what we got with escobar
This move was all about Bobby Cox’s last hoorah…and a run for the WS.
The prospects mean squat right now…You never know if they will turn out for the good, or not.
What the ALT traded for was a 1/2 of a career yr, a hope & a prayer…The BlueJays won this trade HANDS DOWN!!!!
Gonzalez has a club option for next year and the Braves are trying to horde SS prospects in Single and Double A ball. Theres a good chance that 2 of them will be good enough to take 3B and SS for them in the future and a great chance at least 1 will.
Gonzalez has a club option for next year
The Braves didn’t deal Escobar for a 2011 season of Gonzalez so that point is redundant.
Neither prospect really has high upside.. I mean I love Tiny Tim Collins but yeah.
What upside??? the Braves didn’t even get ONE top ten Jays prospect for Escobar.
Escobar has shown nothing in recent weeks to even suggest he takes off soon. His attitude was getting worse too. The Braves will be fine. They made a move that will help them this year and next while they groom the future SS in the minors.
Also Gonzalez has a team option for 2011, which if exercised gives him a reasonable chance to move up to a type B free agent (assuming he has a decent 2011).
Jays win this one, hands down. Good deal for Toronto.
One would think Gonzalez would hit even better after leaving the AL East. The defense between the two is a moot point, but even if Gonzalez doesn’t get on base, he still hits better & protects other hitters more than Escobar. Also, Cox must of had some say-so for this deal to be done. The braves gave up a SS who needed a new place badly (ie. francouer & k johnson who are doing better now, but how do you know if wasnt from leaving ATL?) and an AAAA lefty pitcher who had struggled immensely in the majors. for a SS (and possible draft pick), who is older, but will help this team now especially for Cox’s chances at another title. Collins has a great chance to be a consistent middle reliever, who may turn out to be a setup/closer type. Is it what the Braves wanted for Escobar? No, but its not like they gave him away either.
btw Gonzalez’s OPS is almost 200 points higher than Escobar’s
“btw Gonzalez’s OPS is almost 200 points higher than Escobar’s ”
You know that’s not going to sustain itself going forward right?
And you know this how?
Escobar’s career OPS going into this year was .806.Gonzalez’s career OPS even with this year’s .796 is under .696.Gonzalez is/was having a career year with a team that swings for the fences on every AB. If he takes that philosophy with him to Atlanta, sweet! I just don’t see him hitting another 17 home runs this year. Do you?
I’d take anything over what Escobar was giving us. That mean .618 OPS is only .008 higher than Tim Hudson’s.
Escobar is going into the AL East and Gonzalez is leaving it. Escobar will (hopefully) improve and Gonzalez will regress a little, but I feel that Gonzalez will still end up having a higher OPS than Escobar for this year at least. Not to mention he probably will not be hitting in the 2 spot, like he has been for the jays. I’d bet Cox will slide him in 6th to give a little more protection to glaus/mcann than escobar/whoever else was giving.
I may be alone but I think this deal is win win..the Defense is about even, Gonzo while having a career year helps the braves this season, even next year his glove will be great and their other bats should be enough. Reyes had good stuff, but just couldn’t get it done in the bigs, probably a AAAA player…Collins is gonna be great in the braves pen next season, maybe even by September in the NL East..I don’t know much about Pastornicky but he has got to be worth something or the Braves wouldn’t have wanted him
Pastornicky is a decent prospect. If he were to hit for a higher AVG, then he would be a much better prospect. He’s got some good power, speed, and I think he’s good at defense but he needs to hit better if he was wants to make it to MLB.
And yes I agree, both teams get a good deal. Jays get a future SS which we haven’t had for a while and Braves get a solid power hitter in Gonzalez who replaces Escobar defense. Not to mention 2 good prospects in Pastornicky and Collins.
PS. I think you guys will really like Collins. He’s small as hell but he pitches like a 6’9 monster. He’s got like 15.3 K/9 ratio which is ridiculous.
TIM COLLINS NOOOOOO!
I’d rather have kept Collins and left Jo-Jo Reyes out of this.
Doubt that was an option at all, but I’m with you on that one… Braves fans are going to love him!
This is a very interesting trade for both teams.Escobar is obviously having a bad year and apparently has a bad attitude but you can’t just give up on him like that.Pastornicky is nothing special IMO just a throw-in. Same for Jo Jo Reyes.The one that hurts giving up is Tiny Tim Collins. I saw this guy pitch in person, not only did he get heckled to DEATH because of his size but he was a beast on the mound. He definetely has the makeup of a major league closer, we’ll see if that happens or not.As for AGon, loved watching him play but dude was playing WAY over his head. Let’s see if he takes the Jays HR approach to Turner Field…Even swap for both teams I think. I love Antopolous’ aggressiveness, JP Riccardi would NEVER make this kind of trade.
Oh and height and weight are real concerns for GMs, because a small guy throwing 92-93 tends to put a lot more strain on the arm, which gives rise to health issues. Think about it. The extra 80 pounds and that extra 5-6 inches can help put a lot extra behind the ball as opposed to simply using mechanics and the torque of your arm. Also I think there are some psychological differences to staring up at some fire-breathing behemoth. As far as whether their is a difference in the hittability of a pitch based on the plane of the arm I really have no idea.
Must say though, Collins would be a lot of fun to watch at the major league level.
Collins has a Lincecum-esque delivery. Make of that what you will.
^this. in fact, he;s been giving the nickname “Tim Collinsecum”. So yeah, do as you please with that one.
Not necessarily a plus…Lincecum’s delivery was a major cause for concern among scouts, and one of the reasons he fell in the draft. Scouts thought he’d be great, but didn’t see him lasting.
FF to this year…Lincecum is far from “flaming out”, but he’s lost nearly 3mph off his FB since ’08, his K’s are down, his BB’s are up, and his ERA FIP and xFIP are all up.
Off year, or is the strain on his small frame catching up to him? We’ll see I suppose.
Tiny Tim Collins was a favourite prospect of a lot of Jays fans. A really good story & some fine results in AA ball this year. It was fun to watch his progress on the farm. Pastronicky looks to be a decent player too – I’ve heard many times that he’s a great kid in terms of make up.
Wow.
I’ll make the prediction now – Escobar will have a better 2nd half than Gonzalez.
I don’t have a problem with the Braves trading Escobar. I do have a problem with the return. Escobar is a few months of good playing away from being a huge trade piece. His lousy 1st half is being blown out of proportion.
This is one of the ultimate sell low moves in baseball. I would be pissed if I was a Braves fan.
Agreed 100%
go look at the Braves’ website…. we’re not pissed in the least.
Many of us are!!!
You must have a crystal ball in your house. because otherwise I think that won’t happen.
Totally agree. I would not be surprised at all if Escobar outperforms Gonzalez the rest of the season.
Also I think this is possibly further evidence that the Braves are all in for the Cox-finale. They also picked up some valuable experience at a key position…can’t hurt in a playoff run/playoffs.
As a Braves fan, I’m gona have to say that I like this deal. His attitude has become just too much, and he has absolutely NOOOO baseball smarts. For example: I don’t know the exact dates, but just a couple days ago Esco fielded a roller up the middle and looobbed it over to Glaus, who had to come off the bag and make a tag on a hard running Francoeur, and Glaus ended up jamming his wrists. All Yunel had to do was make a throw over and he didn’t and cost Glaus a jammed wrist. Earlier in the year he just flat out didn’t tag on a deep fly ball and didn’t score. The guy behind him tried to tag, not realizing he hasn’t and then he got picked off. We lost that game by 1 run. I will admit he has loads of potential and a greeaaat arm but it’s just become too much to handle. I think we got a decent return, maybe either a good #2 hitter or a lower lineup guy with a good defensive mind who will sometimes give you a homer. And according to this, I’ve seen some Jays fans who say this pitcher has potential maybe he’ll be in the bullpen eventually. Sorry Jays fans, but don’t expect anything from JoJo Reyes, we’ve tried that a couple times he just doesn’t have the stuff to pitch in the Bigs. Salcedo is 18 and in A Rome so he’s a ways off. Gonzalez has a $2.5 million dollar club option for next year so we have him until 2012 and I think by then Salcedo will be ready to take over the reins at short. Just a look at the stats, I know Gonzo is having a career year and Esco is in the dumps but still here:
Escobar: 2009: .299 14 hrs 76 rbis OBP .377
2010: .238 0 hrs 19 rbis OBP .334
Gonzo: 2009: .238 8 hrs 41 rbis OBP .239
2010: .259 17 hrs 50 rbis OBP .296
Also, Escobar has a knack for hitting into DP’s in clutch situations so. And I know Frank Wren is gonna get crucified for this deal but I think this is a good trade as Yunel Escobar had had it here. They kept giving him chances and he kept wasting them. We’ll see who the winner in this trade is later.
Salcedo will not be ready in two years, and will probably not be a shortstop when he’s ready. Gonzalez is having a fluke power spike at 33 and his OBP is still under 300. I’d take Escobar for the rest of the year over Gonzalez the rest of the year and next year, easily.
Also, Escobar has a knack for hitting into DP’s in clutch situations
So does Gonzalez, actually. He’s hit into 9 of them, but I’ve honestly lost count as to how many came in the 9th inning; At least 4.
Cito and Murph will turn Escobar in to a dead pull HR hitter.
This is the first Braves trade in 20 years that strikes me as laughably lopsided against the Braves. Giving up a 27-year-old, cost-controlled shortstop with a potential impact bat AND a top 10 SP prospect for a stretch-run mediocrity, a relief prospect, and a warm body? That’s just not what I’ve come to expect from an otherwise top-notch front office.
a top 10 SP? Are we talking about the same JoJo Reyes? in 41 games in the majors his era is 6.40 he gave up 226 hits with just 128 strikeouts. his record is 5-15. so how in the world is he a top 10 SP? sure he mite b a decent minors pitcher but he has nooo future in the bigs. escobar has no baseball smarts i was thru with him decent deal for both sides. gonzo is just a stopgap to salcedo or lipka or tht guy we got in the deal
To clarify: I mean that Jo-Jo Reyes is one of the Braves’ top 10 pitching prospects, not that he is a potential top 10 pitcher in the NL. I view him as a fungible #5 SP-type, which still has value, obviously.
#5 starters are pretty easy to come by, Jo-Jo can be easily replaced (actually, he already was.)
yeah, he sucks. we gave him a chance and he blew it every time we brought him up.
“This is the first Braves trade in 20 years that strikes me as laughably lopsided against the Braves. ”
Teixeria for Andrus, Salty and Feliz .. t-too soon ?
That trade was hardly lopsided, as Tex gave the Braves exactly what they expected from him. The fact that they didn’t make it to the playoffs wasn’t Teixeria’s fault… it was in spite of his efforts. Just because a trade works out for the other team doesn’t make it a BAD trade.
I thought my Cards might get Gonzalez when I read that the Jays scouted us the other day… considering we probably offered Brendan Ryan and Allen Craig, clearly the Braves blew our deal out of the water.
I think it’s good for both sides – including Collins compensates for the difference in age between Escobar and Gonzalez.
Not one of their top-10 prospects? Jo-Jo Reyes is worth as much as Gonzalez. I rather have Hicks or Hernandez playing SS over Gonzalez.
Um…..this helps he Blue Jays more. The Braves have a very very bad judgement of players. Gonzalez is a very inconsistent player who has hot streaks then goes dead cold. Gonzalez also has had a rough year compared to previous years with defense. Escobar has had poor defense in the past but he is doing way better than Gonzalez. Escobar is also getting on base more. Even with a lack of power this year you would think the Braves would be smart and wait for it to return and enjoy the better defense and OBP rather then watch the decline of Gonzalez and the complaints of fans that are bound to come. Braves got screwed on this one.
Also I don’t care how much of a pre-madona Escobar is. He is still better then Gonzalez.
” The Braves have a very very bad judgement of players”…….its kinda hard to keep reading after that line.
Every trade Frank Wren has done has been disappointing until results show. I trust him.
I feel that this proves two things:
1. Escobar’s attitude was a lot worse than anyone knows and with us not being in a huge media market those type of actions didnt get out.
2. I personally think that they are really putting a lot of faith in salcedo to really grow and come in and take over the ss job in another year or two.
OMG !!! WOW!
Well at least we wont have to hearthe Braves fans here talking about how Yunel is better than Reyes any more.
Hope this works out for the Braves in the sense that at least Alex Gonzalez can keep up his good first half for the rest of the year.
braves wouldn’t even give up escobar as part of acquiring holliday from the A’s last year, i wanted him on the A’s too… oh well. hopefully this doesn’t hurt his already dismal fantasy production for me.
I like this trade. We get two prospects that are really high potiental, plus we fill the hole temporarily while we keep developing players. Escobar was a bring down on the team with his attitude, and Wren did the mentality that Escobar was the new Francour, that he was bringing the team down and caused the front office frustration, so they gave a clean start to them. I am glad we made this trade, it’s more for the future kind of trade, but it’s also a now trade.
Pastornicky is not high potential. Sorry?
Oh really? a low A prospect that can hit .270 and had 9 triples in one year? Gee. That’s a wash up.
Who really cares about A- numbers?
and Tommy Hanson was drafted in the later rounds, and look at what he did rookie year.
Yeah, Collins no doubt has big potential, Pastornicky is probably a super utility player in the long run.
No, the Braves got two low tier prospects. In other words, they gave up Escobar for NOTHING!!!
With the club option for 2011 on Gonzalez, this isn’t a bad trade. I’m liking it. Yunel doesn’t quite fit with the attitude that Bobby Cox (and next year Fredi Gonzalez) want to be conveyed in the dugout. It gives us a right-handed power bat while not really taking away the defense at short.
Alex @ Turner Field:184-AB 15-R 46-H 6-2B 6HR’s 21RBI’s–LINE: .264/.299/.414/.713OPS -Which are higher than his career line
You can have Ho HO Reyes for all we care lol
It’s a throw-in, really. Not really the point of the trade at all. Just like the Braves can have Pastornicky who’s probably 6th on their SS prospect depth chart now.
Nice try Brave fans but everyone knows that this deal is a steal for the Blue Jays. Escobar the best defensive SS in the majors entering his prime at 27 vs an aging overperforming SS in Gonzalez at 33? Jays will have Escobar at least 3 more years and Gonzalez has another year on his contract. What are the Braves thinking?
JoJo Reyes one of the Braves top 10 pitching prospects. Wow, obviously some people lack the whole “research” part before they comment. I don’t feel any Braves fan views JoJo Reyes as anything special and are pleased to see him go.
One thing I haven’t seen anyone comment on is the fact that Yunel is arb-eligible for the first time after this year. This mean that in all likelihood the man will probably make somewhere close or beyond the 2.5MM option Gonzalez has for next year. Solid stop-gap, salary move for the Braves.
“One thing I haven’t seen anyone comment on is the fact that Yunel is arb-eligible for the first time after this year. This mean that in all likelihood the man will probably make somewhere close or beyond the 2.5MM option Gonzalez has for next year. Solid stop-gap, salary move for the Braves.”
you might be one of the only sensible people on here.
former GM J.P. gives his opinion
sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=5379421
says a win for the braves
Of course he would. He drafted Tiny Tim and Pastornicky…
JP would NEVER and never DID make a trade like this because he was a chump .
Probably not. He was such a tool.
And he said Pastornisky is going to be an everyday shortstop or at worst, everyday 2nd baseman. He’s got a LONG way before he does that.
So glad Jays got rid of that dead waste.
Key words from the above post…”FORMER GM”!!!
Actually, I kinda wonder if Wren called JP up and said “hey, are there any hidden gems in the Jays system?” We know JP is a high on Pastornicky. And of course it was JP who “discovered” the undrafted Collins while on a scouting trip to see another player in his home town.
You give JP too much credit. It was JP’S dad who found him, not JP.
Yeah, reportedly JP’s father, along with half the town of Worcester, had tipped JP off about Collins previously. But he was actually at the game to scout a prospect by the name of Keith Landers (who now plays for Louisville). Collins happened to be put in the game and JP was so impressed that he set up workout in front of some Jays scouts. Shortly after, the undrafted Collins had a minor league deal.
Edit: Couldn’t find it before, but here’s the quote from JP:
“Says Ricciardi, “I knew about Timmy because all my friends in Worcester kept telling me about him. But I was actually there to see a kid named [Keith] Landers who got picked by the Orioles late but went to school at Louisville. I started to watch Tim warming up and could hear his fastball pop and thought, ‘Whoa, that fastball is coming out of him!'”
tsn.ca/mlb/story/?id=288182
Who cares what JP Riccardi thinks? If he was on Canadian TV, he’d spin the story the other way around.
I think this is a great trade for the Braves for what they got rid of and not necessarily what they got back. Jo Jo Reyes is a disaster and Escobar has an attitude problem that I think was the big factor in this trade. Had he been struggling but not been such a basket case in the head I don’t think this deal goes down. Damn near taking Glaus’ wrist off the other night w/a lazy lazy LAZY throw to first was probably the final straw.
So you trade a 4 WAR player with three years of team control remaining because of a lazy throw? Cool story, bro.
….
Do you actually watch the braves? if you have, he messes up on a constant basis. Also, quit being a troll.
ok thers the throw tht nearly broke troy’s arm the pop fly he called immediatelly then wasnt even close to the fly ball he didnt tag up on (and we lost tht game by 1 run) and if u wana go back to last yr the pickle in baltimor wher he tried to throw home and ended up getin no outs. plus iv neeevvvveeerrrr seen him run out a ground ball or even a double play. bobbys benched him multiple times nothing works he hasnt even tried to learn english so no1 can talk to him he thinks hes the coolest thing since sliced bread so hes the laziest play iv seen in a while if ur producing thts different but wen u havent hit a homer in over a year and ur hitting .239 you cant get away with it. 95% of braves fans, 100% of those who give a crud wer fed up with him and ready to see him go
I can remember a couple of times when the braves needed a run to tie or take the lead and Escobar coasts to first on a double play ball with one out and runners on 1st and 3rd. This is one of many examples of what the Braves and their fans saw time and time again from Escobar.
If he runs hard and is out, thats fine, but time and time again his attitude had detrimental effects on the team’s ability to win. THAT is the major reason why his time in ATL is over, and, for many, this was overdue.
and those complaining of Yunel’s baBIP— .270 isnt far off from his career .316 line
and AlexG’s baBIP is at .274
you just cant please people these days.
erm…don’t even know who you’re referring to, but a .270 BABIP is far, far off a .316
I guess the Braves saw enough of his lackadasical play in NY over the weekend. As a Mets fan, I have to give the Braves credit – you can not tolerate players hot-dogging like that. When you produce around it – like Hanley Ramirez is currently – it gets overlooked. But the production can end quickly, and permanently, when players are allowed to be lazy. This is why nearly every year, the Braves are a better team than they look on paper.
Also, Troy Glaus nearly had his arm broken courtesy of Escobar’s laziness, and looked pissed about it…. wonder if that had an impact as well.
I’ve heard Salcedo, Hicks, Jones, and Lipka over and over but does anybody remember Diory Hernandez? He’s hit about .285 or better at every stop and seems to be cut out of the Martin Prado mold. I wasn’ surprised Esco was moved, I just thought we’d be bringing back an outfielder instead of another ss, I really thought Infante and Diory could handle it but hopefully Alex can keep it up for the Braves. Still need to get somebody like Marlon Byrd or even Corey Hart but at least now you don’t have to mortage the farm.
yeah, Diory hit about .200 last year for the Braves…a real star in the making
He actually hit .141 in 82 ab’s, a huge sampling size right? Freakin Arod only hit .204 in his first action good thing Seattle didn’t write him off. Hicks has no bat whatsoever, Jones is in A ball, and Salcedo and Lipka have only been in the organization for a month. Just saying, his minor league numbers are comparable to those of Prado and Escobar. Since coming back from injury he’s batting .300 at AAA. Look it up douche, your sitting in front of a computer.
Actually he hit .141 in a whopping 82 ab’s. Arod hit about .200 in his first big league action, good thing Seattle didn’t give up on him. Just saying that Hicks has no bat, Jones is in A ball, and Salcedo and Lipka have been with the organization for about a month. Diory has comparable minor league numbers to Prado and Escobar and is hitting .300 for AAA Gwinnett right now. He looks a little closer to Atlanta than the other three, wouldn’t you agree? Diory may never be a star, but at least you can look up the numbers before you post so you don’t look like a complete douche.
I wonder how Jo Jo’s stuff is gonna play as a reliever, with the glut of starting pitching from Double A to the Majors, it’s doubtful he’ll be a back end guy for the Blue Jays.
by the way, Tim Collins has 73k’s in 43ip at AA. and he is a lefty.
I like the trade for the Jays but it’s tough to lose Collins. I will say that it’s nice to see his numbers get some attention due to his inclusion in the trade.
Just as it relates to everybody concerned about Collins’ size, Billy Wagner is listed at 5’10 (in his spikes…), but I’m sure he’s only 5’8-5’9. I honestly doubt that has much to do with not giving Collins the ball for the MLB club than his actual development. Another BP arm for the Braves in their system to set up their future…
I’ve read that hes listed at 5’7 super generously, hes actually about 5’5 maybe 5’6
Braves fans, your missing the key point of the deal: We no longer will have to lay in bed at night after a pitchers hits the DL that Jo-Jo will be called up! Seriousley though it’s not a horrible deal for Atlanta. We have enough high OBP guys to make up for Gonzalez’s defficiancy in the area and he’ll settle in nicely in the 6 hole of the line-up the rest of the way and hopefully be decent next year as well. The BA reports make these propects look intriguing as the potential of a Collins-Kimbrel back end of the ‘pen down the road is nice. Pastornicky could eventually become our new Omar Infante or maybe the SS of the future if Salcedo can’t stick.
I love how a guy you never heard of before today suddenly becomes your SS of the future. Hilarious.
1) I said maybe
2) We live in the internet age bud, i can read BA scouting report and watch some film and form an opinion on a guy in a few minutes
1) I said maybe
2) We live in the internet age bud, I can read a BA scouting report and watch some film and form an opinion on a guy in a few minutes
And I love how you assume someone you have probably watch play 5 or 6 times at the most is gonna suddenly break out of a huge slump and have a serious personality change just because he came to your team. Hilarious.
He betta not hit in the 6 hole. 7 or 8 plz.
This will come back and bite the Braves in a couple years, imo.
Damn, that’s all it took. Hendry where were you on this? Ryan Theriot, Jay Jackson, Micah Hoffpauir and Kyler Burke could got our double play combo ready for next year.
A man could dream
2B- Starlin Castro
SS- Yunel Escobar
Okay so Jose Bautista next? 😀
Thank you Frank Wren. While I think Yunel easily has the potential to become a great SS in the league, he lacks the motivation to correct any problems he may be having. The way he has played this year has reminded me of Andruw Jones’s last year with the Braves, except Escobar has a cocky attitude that Andruw did not have. What set me over the top was the Mets game on Friday when he flipped the ball to first and Troy Glaus jump in the basepath in a play that could have severely hurt Troy, and he acted as if it were Troy’s flaut. The guy needs to grow up. If he can do that, he will be a great MLB player, but until then, the Braves are winners in this deal.
Alex Gonzalez is having his career year and still posting an OBP under .300.
no he had a career April, he’s sucked since then.
Weird. Both players have established their level of play before this season. Escobar would seem to be as good or better offensive player than Gonzalez. Fantasy baseball 101 tells you not to trade a good offensive player who had a poor first half for a lesser offensive player who had a good first half, you’ll likely end up missing the better half of play of each player. Not to mention the fact that the Braves are paying more salary now. I wouldn’t have made the trade, at least looking at it from the surface anyway.
The more that I look at Alex Gonzalez’s stat, the more worried I get that not only may he not be an upgrade offensively over Yunel Escobar, he may be quite a downgrade.
There is something to be said about playoff experience, however.
Great job by GM Alex Anthopoulos. Escobar is under control for 3 years. Gonzalez was only a stopgap and trade chip. This trade gives SS Hechevarria proper time to develop in the minors.
2011 Infield: 1st Base, Brett Wallace; 2nd Base, Aaron Hill; SS, Yunel Escobar; 3rd Base, ?; Catcher, J.P. Arencibia. Add to that lineup, a young developing pitching staff and the Jays are heading in the right direction.
The Jays will make a few more trades before the deadline (Overbay, Downs, Frasor, Gregg, Buck, Encarnacion, Bautista, Lewis). Hopefully, they will get a high ceiling 3rd base prospect, outfield prospects and some more pitching.
Not too bad for a 1st year GM.
I blame Melky Cabrera for Escobar’s demise in ATL, lol. In NY, he was constantly blamed for Cano being unprofessional and unfocused. I wonder if he was clubbing with Yunel like he used to with Cano. In all seriousness, I give the Braves credit for having the fortitude as an organization to ship out a player with a bad attitude. It may end being a short sighted move if Yunel matures a little, but I’m of the mind that these guys make so much money, they should know how to behave like professionals and not spoiled little children. The Braves sent a message today and banished their “brat” to Canada and 1/2 a year on turf. Good for them.
You do know Canada has cities, right? It’s not the Canada Blue Jays, it’s the Toronto Blue Jays. Maybe look at a map.
Herb,
I tease Canada because I love Canada. If I could make my living there, I’d move there.
What are Mets waiting for??? We need Power and Pitching if we are gonna make a serious run at the pennant. Beltran should help with the power now is the time fo rMinaya to get aggresive and get a starter AND a reliever. Anything less than 5-6 on this trip is pathetic
Despite Gonzalez’s better numbers this year, I think the Blue Jays got a steal here. Not only is Escobar 6 years younger, but I believe he is a better SS altogether. Not only did they get the steal at the SS position, they also got Jo-Jo Reyes! For what? NOTHING. A few unknown prospects that won’t go anywhere.
Blue Jays won this trade.
Jo Jo Reyes is a AAAA player, ask any brave fan we would have traded him for a box of sunflower seeds, hell even the off brand. And Tim Collins is not an unknown prospect, 80% of jays fans who posted on this topic said they will miss tim collins….
ur an idiot
Haha. Kid, go troll somewhere else.
I love it when fans of both teams say they got ripped off, I guess that makes a fair trade.
good move for braves they removed themselves one of the laziest players in MLB and clubhouse cancer good for them
Frank Wren is staring his crappy ways again I thought we were looking for a decent outfielder. Maybe u should have gotten Bautista and Gonzales that would have been a much more even trade.
I can almost guarantee you Wren asked about that possibility but that was just asking too much for a player who’s hitting .239 with no homers. Bautista is leading the AL in homers so you’re just not gonna get an AL homer leader for someone without a home run. It would have been nice though. Id make a bet that Wren isn’t quite finished.
yeah lets get a outfielder that is hitting 250 with those homeruns and lets see his second half.
As a Braves fan, I like this trade. However, I would have LOVED the trade if we had gotten someone like Stephen Drew instead. (Remember, we could have Elvis Andrus playing for us right now, but alas, Tex came and went…) Anyway, as a die hard Braves fan, I find it hard to dislike any player. However, I dislike Yunel, and I’ve tried to give him a chance to win me over. His bad attitude, lack of team comraderie, and poor effort just don’t epitomize what the Braves’ organization is about. His teammates were tired of him, and in the end, it brings down the great morale they’ve built. Everyone seems to be having a blast playing the game, except for Yunel. There is no doubting his talent, and I hope he turns things around in Toronto. I’m hoping even more that Gonzalez lights it up McGriff-style when he arrives in Atlanta! I wonder what move the Mets will make now?
As a Braves fan, I like this trade. However, I would have LOVED the trade if we had gotten someone like Stephen Drew instead. (Remember, we could have Elvis Andrus playing for us right now, but alas, Tex came and went…) Anyway, as a die hard Braves fan, I find it hard to dislike any player. However, I dislike Yunel, and I’ve tried to give him a chance to win me over. His bad attitude, lack of team comraderie, and poor effort just don’t epitomize what the Braves’ organization is about. His teammates were tired of him, and in the end, he was just destroying the morale they had built. Every Braves player seems to be having a blast playing the game this season, except for Yunel. There is no doubting his talent, and I hope he turns things around in Toronto. I’m hoping even more that Gonzalez lights it up McGriff-style when he arrives in Atlanta! I wonder what move the Mets will make now?
This deal is pretty sweet for the Jays ….they signed Gonzo for nothing in the off season and package two B level prospects for a young short stop with tons of talent who had votes for the NL MVP last year
This is an amazing job at adding high impact assets and a classic selling high / buying low for AA
This deal makes sense for the 2010 season as the Braves are clearly trying to win in Bobby Cox’s last season… it appears that Escobar personality was harder to handle when he wasnt producing …Hopefully this trade is a wake up call for him
Trades winners are judged by the team that got the best player …so based on that logic Toronto wins this trade
Trades winners are judged by the team that got the best player??? Does that mean that Atlanta won the Texas AtL trade for Texeria? HELL NO. Neftali Feliz and Elvis Andrus were both AL all-starts this year, and the only thing Tex brought to atl besides his expensive contract was a hit song on you tube about him. And to remind all braves fans…
The braves got ron mahay and Mark Texeria for Elvis Andrus(All star), Neftali Feliz(all star) Jarrod Saltalamacchia(would be good catcher if he could through ball back to the mound) and two more prospects.
THen the next year the braves practically gave Tex to the angels for fucking casey kotchman and stephen marek(who has yet to see in turner field)
THen the next year the braves swap kotchman and adam Laroche(who had an amazing 2 months with the braves), then the braves were to cheap and un-loyal to resign him. (dont get me wrong TG has been great this year)
So basically, the braves traded 5 players to get one year of tex, and now a minor league pitcher with no value.
Just because the braves got the best player, does not mean they won the trade.