The Phillies signed Joe Blanton to a three-year, $24MM extension, according to a team press release. The deal buys out Blanton's last arbitration year and two free agent seasons. AOL FanHouse's Ed Price tweets the details: $7MM in '10 and $8.5MM in '11 and '12. Another $500K can be earned with innings incentives. The price is reasonable, given the recent contracts signed by Jason Marquis and Joel Pineiro.
Blanton, 29, has seen an uptick in his strikeout rate since joining the Phillies in July of '08. Last year he posted a 7.5 K/9, 2.7 BB/9, and 4.05 ERA in 195.3 innings.
Good deal. Cheaper than I thought it’d be.
Ok signing. If you look at Blanton through his whole career, he is the definition of inconsistent. It’s literally a straight up bad year, good year, bad year, good year, bad year, good year his whole career.
would he have gotten 2/16 as a free agent? jason marquis didn’t. this is why you couldn’t keep lee?
his open market value really doesn’t matter in that discussion. he was tendered a contract a week before the halladay and lee deals in december, so they were on the hook for arbitration this year. also, the lee deal had more to do with getting prospects (rather than draft picks) than money.
Cliff Lee for one year. Or Joe Blanton for three years. I like a lot of the things the Phillies have done over the past few years. But, to me this is really a head scratcher. Don’t get me wrong, I love the Cliff Lee trade, I’m a Mariners fan. But, from a baseball fan’s perspective I don’t understand the logic to this one. Granted, Lee was probably going to walk after this year, and also I recognize that the M’s have no legit chance of signing him. But, in that respect why not go for the jugular and keep Lee, Halladay and Blanton. Less pressure on Blanton, but lets see how this one plays out. There are reasons these men lead teams and I am merely a fan.
Ugh. I hope that’s trade-bait.
I don’t understand why they wouldn’t put that $24 million towards Lee instead. Granted, Lee would certainly command more than $8 million per season, but he would be a much better pitcher for the Phillies to keep.
They had to offer Blanton arbitration at the time. Needed to trade Lee for prospects that the Phillies seem to value.
Everyone can argue till they are blue in the face that they should have kept Lee and still done the Halladay trade, which still wouldn’t have guaranteed them the WS, but would have definitely guaranteed a crappy baseball team in 2012. And the team just wasn’t going to do it, PERIOD. The team opted for a better pitcher in Halladay over Lee, to restock the farm system which they depleted in trading for Lee and Halladay.
Oh and they have Halladay for a few years. I have followed Lee for a few years and he isn’t going to walk on water. And by all accounts the players they got for Lee are better than the players they traded for him.
Funny how the team wins a WS, first championship in 20+ years and how finicky some fans can be.
After 10+ years of Andy and no championships, I am going to cut RAJ some slack since he was on board for a 2008 WS.
You realize Lee was due to earn $9M in 2010. So….$24M – $9M = $15M. Does that buy one year of Cliff Lee in the open market? You wish…
Yeah I guess they wanted Blanton for 3 yrs verus Lee for 1 yr though hands down the Phillies would be hard to beat with Halladay/Lee/Hamels at the front end…Don’t get them send Lee away for prospects and then turn around and sign Blanton on a 3yr deal that has only shown that he is a yo-yo in his year to year performance…..Atleast this is better situation for the braves to compete with just Halladay since they have KK the “Ace Killer” to go out and match Halladay…Haha we will see if this move bites the phillies in the butt this year…
not to be a jerk, but his career ERA+ is 102. so who would the phillies replace him with if he left as a free agent? a crude search reveals an answer: basically anyone.
Not to be a jerk, but may I ask what team you root for, because I’m assuming it’s not the Phils. Haha
I live in Philly and get the chance to watch Blanton every time he pitches. His stats are a bit misleading, and I think you are looking a little too far into them. He’s not gonna go out and put up zeroes across the board for an entire season, but what Blanton does is just about ALWAYS keep the Phils in the game. You don’t have to have a sub 4 ERA to be an effective pitcher, and at the very least, that’s what he is. I consider 8MM a year a good deal for Joe.
“He’s not gonna go out and put up zeroes across the board for an entire season, but what Blanton does is just about ALWAYS keep the Phils in the game.”
so does joel pineiro, jason marquis, john garland, and just about any other second-tier starter that doesn’t require a preemptive $24MM commitment.
I think your either mistaken, or you just don’t watch baseball. You find me a decent number 4 guy that can go out there and give you a quality start (5 innings, 3 earned or fewer) every time he goes out there. I don’t think there are many, and certainly not this year.
Firstly, despite what you may think, Blanton is a good pitcher. I’d consider him Marquis’ equal, and I’d go out on a limb and say he’s better than Pineiro. I remember when the Phils wanted to go out and get Pineiro a couple years ago, and he was garbage. Dave Duncan can do good for any pitcher, ask Joel. If Blanton went out on the market this year, he would have easily been one of the more coveted pitchers on the market. It’s tough to sign a 24MM dollar deal when there’s no competition. Pineiro’s options were the Dodgers, who weren’t going to make a significant offer, the Mets and Angels. Teams didn’t want to pony up for one good year, so I’m not surprised Blanton gets a better deal for being the far more consistent pitcher.
yeah, you’ve got me. i don’t (and never have) watched baseball. which makes it all the more embarrassing that i’m making a lot more sense than you. ok, this is what you want: “5 innings, 3 earned or fewer.” ok, fine. extrappolated over 33 starts in a season that equals a guy with at least 165 innings and an ERA under 5.40. now i know you’re using rock-solid statistics when you assert that blanton’s “a good pitcher” but that’s a pretty high bar you’re setting for ol’ joey b. but i’m pretty sure there’d be a couple of other guys in the league that could come close.additionally, if the secret to turning a “garbage” pitcher into one capable of producing a considerably better season than joe blanton did is a good pitching coach… why don’t you go spend your $24MM on that instead? it’d probably even be cheaper. you could probably even use the extra money to sign jarrod washburn, doug davis, john garland, or anyone else that might end up being just as good as your friend joe blanton.
Oh, now the insults are flying! And you even used a big word like “extrappolated,” which you then went on to spell incorrectly! I’m impressed!
But in all seriousness, you took my words out of context, and you know that you did, because you quoted them. What you’re trying to do is take a small bite out of my argument and turn it against me. Clever… I think not. Did I say that I wanted Joe to go out and pitch a simple quality start every time he took the hill? No. I said that a good number 4 who can give you quality starts time and time again is an effective pitcher. If that’s all I expected out of Joe, then it would have been a crying shame to go out and see him throw 195 innings and have an ERA around 4, now wouldn’t it. Now I know you like to read stats and stuff, and I can’t use phrases like “a good pitcher” without throwing some numbers up there, so here we go. Over the past few years, these are the wins and ERA that both Blanton and Pineiro have accumulated. (I know they’re just obvious stats, don’t have a coronary.)
Blanton: 06: 16, 4.82; 07: 14, 3.85; 08: 9, 4.69; 09: 12; 4.05
Pineiro: 06: 8, 6.36; 07: 7, 4.33; 08: 7, 5.15; 09: 15, 3.49
Now, I know wins aren’t a great margin for a pitcher’s value, but it shows that Blanton can go out and win double digits for a team, potentially, every year, which was the original point I was trying to make. And would I love to have Dave Duncan as my pitching coach? Sure would. Seems like the only problem is that he’s under contract with the Cardinals… Which now that I think about it, isn’t that the place that Pineiro went and had one good year? Oh yeah, it is. Funny though, Blanton had good years with an average team, the A’s, and a good team, the Phils.
So before you give yourself kudos for knowing what you’re talking about, know what you’re talking about. I don’t care what the stats say, in all honesty. I know what Joe Blanton can do because I’ve seen him pitch, and the stats agree, he is a better pitcher than Joel Pineiro, albeit a year under Dave Duncan, who is the closest thing to God pitching knows. (And yes, I’d like to have him… Just so we’re extra clear on that.)
And you didn’t answer the question about your team, I’m assuming your a Mets fan?
With Pineiro it’s all about how you think he will do in the future.
If you believe Pineiro he is a completely different pitcher because of his new found sinker. If that sinker remains effective there is no reason why he won’t find similar success elsewhere.
The other side of the argument is that Pineiro is in a walk-year and he was unbelievably lucky with his unsustainable BB and GB rates.
The point is that nobody really knows what to expect with Pineiro. He could continue to be a solid 2/3 pitcher or he could revert back to a #5. Certainly, Pineiro in 09 was absolutely better than what you could ever expect out of Joe Blanton.
“I think your either mistaken” if you want, i can play this game, too.
“you took my words out of context, and you know that you did, because you quoted them” what? how would you have me address your argument if not quoting you?
“Now, I know wins aren’t a great margin for a pitcher’s value, but it shows that Blanton can go out and win double digits for a team” so wins 1) don’t matter and 2) form the primary basis for your support of blanton. nice.
“Sure would. Seems like the only problem is that he’s under contract with the Cardinals… ” (he was a free agent this offseason)
“Which now that I think about it, isn’t that the place that Pineiro went and had one good year? Oh yeah, it is. ”
ERA+ the last 3 years for each pitcher:
JB: 107,90,105
JP: 104,83,118
(this adjusts for league and park)
“I don’t care what the stats say, in all honesty” congratulations. you’re definitely the person to give an opinion on how to best spend $24 million..
“I’m assuming your a Mets fan?” come on, that’s below the belt.
empathizerightonyourbehind, why are you being so mean. It’s obviously a coin flip on who is the better pitcher and when all else is equal then a shorter, less-expensive contract has the least risk. Neither your or myname_989’s argument is perfect, but I never expected them to be.
If they waited a year, FA’s in the ‘open market’, the Phillies would have had to spend more money for less. Welcome to baseball.
yeah, just look at that ridiculous contract joel pineiro signed. welcome to knowing what you’re talking about.
? Equal money for an older pitcher who’s had one good season in the last 5yrs. One extra year makes this a bad deal, at Blanton’s age?
ok, for the record, i googled it and $16 million DOES NOT equal $24 million. so you might want to get that straight. maybe you’ve been using bing? i don’t know…additionally, the angels have joel pineiro for his age 31 and 32 seasons. now the phillies have joe blanton through his age 31 season. is that difference worth $8 million? i’m not sure, you probably know better than i do.third, although i know its not an end-all, be-all statistic, but here’s the ERA+ of each pitcher over the last 3 years:JB: 107,90,105JP: 104,83,118wow, now i see your point. no wait…
Excellent elementary level debating empathizerightonyourbehind. Not that I am any better since I have now sunk to the same level.
Not to bust your theory but there were only 40 pitchers in the league this year with 190+ innings and a ERA+ over 100. Blanton was one of them.
so were joel pineiro, john garland, jason marquis, and other pitchers that signed or will sign cheaper contracts with shorter commitments. but thanks for trying.
Your the one who said you can get anyone to pitch to this level. Since this stat means anybody over 100 is above average it can’t be true. Especially if only 40 people did it means he must be much better than average.
Or it’s a BS stat that you threw out there.
ok, you’ve completely caught me. ERA+ is a statistic that i just completely made up after i read all about it on obscure websites like baseball-reference.com and the hardball times. guilty as charged.
just to save you the trouble of “bing-ing” anything readily available on wikipedia (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adjusted_ERA%2B) here’s what ERA+ (that i apparently just made up) does:
“It adjusts a pitcher’s earned run average (ERA) according to the pitcher’s ballpark (in case the ballpark favors batters or pitchers) and the ERA of the pitcher’s league. Average ERA+ is set to be 100; a score above 100 indicates that the pitcher performed better than average, below 100 indicates worse than average.”
so, point conceded, you’re right. not ANY pitcher can do what joe blanton does, just any average-or-better pitcher. it just so happens that 3 of these average-or-better pitchers with your arbitrary cut-off of 190 innings were free agents this offseason and they all have or will sign for less money than joe blanton just did. if you drop the innings-pitched line down to 175 (also a completely arbitrary number) then jarrod washburn joins them as well.
so…
This is bad debate even for the Internet.
thanks for your contribution.
Check out Joe Blanton’s Game Log. Early in the season, Blanton was being rocked around by everyone. Then Blanton said he fixed an error in mechanics. Look at May 26th all the way to Sep 10th. See all those good games? Mostly 7 IP 2-3 ERA games. Then he has a horrible one giving up 8 on the 10th to the Nationals. His era jumps to 4.11. Then he 6 IP shutouts the nationals right after (Their offense was getting pretty hot around this time actually) and 7 IP shutouts Florida after that.
You see 8 IP 2 ER game vs. STL (w/ Holliday) and many other gems like this in his game log. His ER is high because of his shaky start and random bad games. But the good outweighs the bad. The guy’s a good pitcher.
Think he should have gotten about 3 Year/20mgoing by the Padilla and Pinerio contracts… but still, not a bad contract
Blanton is soooo much better than Padilla, it’s not even close.
well, that’s why I said he should get more money and more years(last 2 years)Blanton is 35-30; 4.22 ERA Padilla is 26-14; 4.61 ERA… and finished strong with the Dodgers 3.20 ERA in 8 games, his finish was one of the main reasons he got the contractHe was also playing in Texas, which is rough on a pitcher6.666 million is more than 5.025 millionand 3 Years of security is more than one.
So, I’d say, they’re close enough.
Honestly, I think he deserves it.
what makes blanton deserve more than Piniero, Marquis?
we’re having that discussion above. apparently if you don’t know why joe blanton rules all then you don’t watch baseball, or you actually read stat sheets. something like that.
Apparently you just need to read a stat sheet and not watch the guy pitch to know what he is all about. Not a terrible contract. Adam Eaton he is not. This contract falls in line with the rest.
“what makes blanton deserve more than Piniero, Marquis?” -> Age.
My point was the price of a mid rotation guy today is going to be cheaper than a similar FA on the open market option. Don’t give me Padilla was signed for cheaper. Another guy I have watched. He sucks at 2 million, let alone 5.
I think Blanton has a good chance to earn what he’s being paid, but I imagine he could’ve been had for a few million cheaper.
He may be slightly overpaid, but there is no question he is a consistent 200 inning guy. He makes for a great #4 . This sets up the Phils top 4 in the rotation until 2012. Halladay/Hamels/Happ/Blanton. Which isn’t too bad for a team with powerhouse offense.
I love this move for the Phils.
My impersonation of empathizerightonyourbehind: You might want to look at the statistics. Blanton only has achieved 200 innings in 2 of his 5 full seasons. Consistent 200 inning guy? I think not.
Well, now, let’s not be too hasty. Those other seasons did see totals of 194, 197, and 195.
So he is a consistent 200 inning guy, give or take 5 innings.
I think he is overpaid.
I still can’t believe what he asked for in arbitration lawls…
The basis for Blanton’s game is innings…
He eats innings and makes them quality…
He won’t be that guy that goes 15 shutout innings in a row or carry your team through September, but he will consistently give you 6 or 7 with 3 earned…
With the Phils offense, this is exceptable…
In baseball today, it’s hard to find guys that both stay healthy and keep you in the game on a consistent basis…
empathize…
joe blanton has a lower career WHIP and higher K rate than marquis and piniero. and he has already succeeded in philly.. I’m not saying he is head and shoulders above anyone else but it seems to me like you think this is a bad deal and i just don’t understand your logic..
An ace gets 16-20 mil a year, a #2 gets 11-15, a #3 gets 6-10… and I think it is safe to say blanton is a number 3?? you don’t think so??
it was never my intention to say joe blanton was a bad pitcher. i merely just meant to establish how average and “#3ish” he is. sure, the rate seems fair, but the deal seems odd for a few reasons. notably:
1. its premature. even if blanton tested the free agent waters, it seems unlikely that the phills couldn’t get him back for 2/$16MM AFTER seeing what he did this season. i know he’s been durable, but things happen. i just don’t see why you have to jump the gun on this one. additionally, there are always a handful of pitchers out there every year that are just as useful as blanton. it certainly doesn’t hurt to wait for a deal to present itself.
2. any money this took away from signing cliff lee medium-long term is a huge mistake. my only critique of blanton is that basically any league-average starter can put up the numbers he has. this isn’t true for lee. maybe they explored this option or maybe they didn’t, but if keeping a league average “joe everyman” on staff took away from keeping cliff lee around… it was a big mistake.
They thoroughly explored the Lee extension option throughout this offseason. His agent (very understandably) wants top, top money over 5+ years. Phillies were unwilling to do this for Lee, so that was the end of that story. He was not going to get an extension in Philly. Criticizing a Blanton extension because its potential impact on a theoretical Lee extension is simply not valid
Criticizing a Lee trade as a precursor to the Halladay deal (vs waiting and taking more offers on both Joe and Cliff throughout the offseason) is still very much fair game IMO, and a different story. But Lee was never getting an extension here
“2. any money this took away from signing cliff lee medium-long term is a huge mistake. my only critique of blanton is that basically any league-average starter can put up the numbers he has. this isn’t true for lee. maybe they explored this option or maybe they didn’t, but if keeping a league average “joe everyman” on staff took away from keeping cliff lee around… it was a big mistake.” -> Really we are still on the Cliff Lee thing? Get over Cliff Lee, he was traded for prospects and the team was at their “ceiling” for payroll. They traded Lee for prospects, they traded Lee for prospects. You people just don’t quit. Wasn’t going to happen. Halladay and Lee was NEVER going to happen.
Premature how? He is 29 years old. Locking up for 3 years at 2010 for a durable starter doesn’t seem premature. You now know who your 1, 2, 3, 4, pitchers are for 3 seasons.
Waynegomes.. i really don’t think they explored the Lee extension thoroughly. they could have easily gotten better prospects, and the fact that lee seemed shocked by the trade implies he thought there was a chance he could stay a philly in a future, but all that is neither here nor there.. lee is gone, so can we all let that go please..
today is blanton’s day… I agree with gomes point that criticizing blanton’s extension because it somehow affected lee’s extension is absurd. Lee is gone, move on.
But empathize you are completely right that this deal didn’t need to be done now. Phils were most likely going to win arbitration because of Blanton’s ridiculous 10 mil desire… so they would have only paid him ,what, 7.5 this year? as for this season coming up. He most likely won’t all of a sudden turn into an ace and have a great year that would force the phils to pay more than 16 mil for 2 years, so it is a pretty safe bet that they could have resigned him after this season for that price
Well they were able to lock in his salary at 7 mil for this season, taking away whatever chance that they’d have to come up with another couple million for an arb award. As we know they are right up against their spending limits right now, which is why they gave enough prospects to get money back in the Halladay deal and made moving Lee a precursor to the deal. This cost certainty for 2010 may have even freed up enough cash for another pen arm such as Smoltz, Chan Ho or ContrerasGiven that they had tendered him a contract and would have been on the hook for at least 7.5 mil without a new deal, the effective” 2 year extension” is favorable for the Phils IMO, and I think he would have a good chance to exceed that on the open market next offseason. There is no guarantee that leaguewide spending would be equally as tight in the 2011 offseason as it is now. Blanton is a tick up in quality from the Garlands and Marquis, looking at the trends in his peripherals. He year was more comparable to Wolf (when you adjust for ballparks), he has better durability track record than Wolf and he got his 3-30 earlier this year
Finally, given Amaro’s recent tendencies, if they had gone to arb and let Blanton play out his walk year, there is very little chance they would have offered him arb after the 2010 season when they’d be on the hook for well over 10 mil given a healthy season. So the “keep him and get a pick” argument isn’t realistic to me either
Wayne
i am not arguing that this a bad contract, I think this is a very good contract . I agree that Joe is a tick up from the marquis group.
My only problem is that I really don’t think this deal had to be done until after the season. Phils were going to win the arb case so this year is even either way. What if Blanton has a bad season or gets injured?? They could of had leverage over him after the season. It’s not likely that Blanton has a season well above his career norm to create any leverage on his side. I just think they could have waited until after this season
I really think we are just bickering over nothing right now. We both agree it was a good deal.
I think allowing him to hit FA drastically decreases the chances of retaining him.
Now maybe the could have waited a few months and then tried to work something out with during the year, giving the Phils security against an early year serious injury, but the injury risk works both ways…..if Blanton keeps up his 09 production through the ASB and is that much closer to FA, he may be less willing to take a 2 year, 13.75-16.5 mil extension (would be the effective extensions for 3-24, depending on whether he won arb), and have more incentive to try to test the FA market for a bigger payday
If they do think he’s worthy of an extension, I like the fact that they struck quick to do it on (what I feel) are favorable terms to the team
Also like having the top 4 SPs all locked up through 2012 now, that should help smooth the transitions in the lineup that are sadly coming the next two offseasons
“There is no guarantee that leaguewide spending would be equally as tight in the 2011 offseason as it is now.” This has been my point exactly, but empathizerightonyourbehind has failed to grasp that.
Comparing Blanton to Marquis or Garland is just lazy. Blanton’s K/BB last year was 2.76, he set a new career high in Ks in 7.51, and his overall FIP was hurt by a ridiculous rash of HRs early on in the year (22% HR/FB through May 1st). 4.07 xFIP last year is quite good. There is a question as to whether he can maintain his bat missing ways since it’s an outlier vs his career track record, but that decrease in contact is still encouragingThe way you have to look at the extension is not 3-24 either, since the Phillies were on the hook for somewhere between 7.5 and 10.25 already this season….conservatively, let’s say they would have agreed to midpoint for around 8.8 mil for 2010. This extension is basically two years for 7.6 per year for 2011-2012
This signing helps to show what a great deal the Braves got on Tim Hudson.
How about we actually see the guy pitching 100 innings post surgery before we go around patting ourselves on the back.
No patting on the back going on here. All multiyear contracts on pitchers are calculated risks; I just like the Hudson risk a whole lot better than the Blanton reward.
This seems like a page from the Mets handbook. This has Oliver Perez written all over it.
in terms of…..? i dont see how blanton’s extension has anything to do with the mets signing oliver perez
They are both bad signings and overpayments.
Joe Blanton is a far better pitcher than Oliver Perez, right now. First off, Blanton is a horse. He eats innings up like it’s second nature. Oliver Perez is an injury prone overrated pitcher.
Ollie had a great year in 04, all across the board. His next very good year-07-he had a FIP of 4.35 and an xFIP in 4.65. So, his mid-3 ERA was deceptive. As expected, he regressed to an ERA of 4.2 with a similar FIP and xFIP the year after, and nothing needs to be said about the year after that.
He gets an obscene contract, and proceeds to fold up. How convenient.
If anything, Ollie should trade his contract to Blanton.
This was not a horrible signing, but not an amazing signing at the same time. I find it pretty hard to believe that any person would compare Blanton’s contract to Ollie. He’s getting paid 12 mil a year to do nothing. Blanton is actually a decent pitcher and is getting paid 4 million a year less than that.
Maybe its just me, but did anyone think this now brings Blanton’s potential trade value much higher because he now is locked up for the next three years at 8 million a year, which could be a bargain. Blanton was up to be traded before trading Lee, however Blanton would have been a Free Agent too at the end of the season.. so no one would give any worth while prospects for a 1 year rental… he’s now a 3 year bargain who will win 12+ games every year. And if we keep him, then we too are assured of his 12+ wins a year for the next 3 years. Its a good move…
It depends, though. It certainly does if he pitches well, as he’ll be pitching a whole bunch of games in a hitter-friendly park.
It is a good move. Nothing to get overly-excited about, but, at the same time, nothing to be disappointed about.
Someone answer me why Lee had to be traded when he did. It just felt forced. Trade for Halladay. Recognize that Lee is now the best available pitcher, and start a bidding war for his services this year. If you get blown away with an offer, trade him. If you don’t get a good enough offer, threaten to keep him. The teams that missed out on other FA signings desperate to put fans in the seats would have ponied up. At least make the M’s sweat it for a week.
If Halladay and Lee were never going to happen, fine. But why did the rest of the league have to know that, basically killing Lee’s trade value?
Remember that Lee’s value was already low anyone because he is insistent on hitting the open market. He was only under control for one more year.
Also, it depends what you’re comparing Lee’s deal to. I happen to think they got better prospects from Seattle than they gave to Cleveland. Sabathia’s deal in 2008 or the Minaya deal for Bartolo Colon seem to be outliers when trading front line starters.
No one has mentioned that blanton is actually making less than pinero (15.5MM versus 16.0MM) for the next two years. As both CHONE and marcel predict better years with better peripheral stats from blanton next year, at least the first two years of the deal seem perfectly fair, if not a bargain for the phillies.
I think that the third year at 8.5MM is a warranted risk. Blanton’s injury history (or lack thereof) along with his consistent performance (1000+ IP over the last 5 years and >2.2 WAR each of the last five years) can explain the third year.